Alroght, this came up the other night in a game. When using the ship ability to perform a red boost or rotate action after performing an action and including primed thrusters in the list.

We had one guy who stated using this ability with no stress after the first action he could then perform a red rotate action followed by a red boost to end up with three actions and two stress.

The other guy was arguing that once you perform an action you can use the ship ability to perform a red boost OR (as the cards states) a red rotate arc. Ending Sith two actions and one stress

What is the thoughts on this? I’d like to hear some thoughts to help settle this argument. I don’t personally see how you can perform both red actions when you are faced with the opportunity to do one or the other.

You can do both. The ability is not limited to once per round, so as long as another trigger is available (and note that it can trigger off the red rotate) then go right ahead.

You cannot trigger both actions off the same initial focus (e.g.) because of the Once Per Opportunity rule.

4 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

You can do both. The ability is not limited to once per round, so as long as another trigger is available (and note that it can trigger off the red rotate) then go right ahead.

You cannot trigger both actions off the same initial focus (e.g.) because of the Once Per Opportunity rule.

I not interested in an argument here, just trying to make sure it’s ruled right, so I do appreciate the input. I just don’t understand how an option that gives you a choice between two things can end up with both options in your pocket. It seems making a choice between two things should only leave you with one of the two, not both. Maybe I’ve been doing this all wrong for years when presented with two choices, I should have been taking both options all along.

It seems once you have made the decision to use the ships ability there shouldn’t be an opportunity to use the same ability again. Where has something like this shown up before?

11 minutes ago, Vykk Draygo said:

I not interested in an argument here, just trying to make sure it’s ruled right, so I do appreciate the input. I just don’t understand how an option that gives you a choice between two things can end up with both options in your pocket. It seems making a choice between two things should only leave you with one of the two, not both. Maybe I’ve been doing this all wrong for years when presented with two choices, I should have been taking both options all along.

It seems once you have made the decision to use the ships ability there shouldn’t be an opportunity to use the same ability again. Where has something like this shown up before?

You're clearly not, because I told you the correct ruling and you're arguing against it.

Nothing like this has shown up before. That doesn't mean the correct understanding of the rules cannot be gleaned.

So, to elaborate.

REFINED GYROSTABILIZERS: You can rotate your indicator only to your V or ^. After you perform an action, you may perform a red boost or rotate action.

PRIMED THRUSTERS: While you have 2 or fewer stress tokens, you can perform roll and boost actions even while stressed.

What you seem to be suggesting initially is this:

Perform focus action. Trigger Gyros twice, perform red rotate, gain stress, perform red boost (with thrusters), gain stress. That is not legal, because you're triggering Gyros twice from the same initial action, which violates the Once Per Opportunity rule. It's not legal to take both choices at once.

What IS legal is this:

Perform focus action. Trigger Gyros (as you just did a focus action). Perform red rotate. Gain Stress. Trigger Gyros (as you just did a rotate action). Perform red boost (legal because Thrusters). Gain stress. You're triggering Gyros twice, from two separate actions, and that's fine. The result is the same, but the sequence of how it came about is different.

This is perfectly legal. As would be, for instance, Coordinating a focus to the ship before it activates, gyro-ing a boost, then the ship doing a blue, locking, and gyroing a rotate.

Refined Gyrostabilisers is not limited to once per round. So as long as you are using a separate opportunity to trigger it each time, you can do both actions using it.

9 minutes ago, Vykk Draygo said:

I not interested in an argument here, just trying to make sure it’s ruled right, so I do appreciate the input. I just don’t understand how an option that gives you a choice between two things can end up with both options in your pocket. It seems making a choice between two things should only leave you with one of the two, not both. Maybe I’ve been doing this all wrong for years when presented with two choices, I should have been taking both options all along.

It seems once you have made the decision to use the ships ability there shouldn’t be an opportunity to use the same ability again. Where has something like this shown up before?

The ship ability procs twice. Once for the Perform Action Step action, where the player performed a red rotate action, and once off the red rotate for the Primed thrusters permitted barrel roll.

1. You aren’t stressed and you do a barrel roll.
2. You just performed an action. Refined Gyros says you can do a red boost or rotate after you perform an action. You rotate and take a stress for the red action.
3. You just performed an action again. Refined Gyros says you can do a red boost or rotate after you perform an action. Usually , the stress from the red rotate in step 2 would prevent you from taking advantage of this again. But , you have Primed Thrusters which says you can do boosts and barrel rolls if you have 2 or fewer stress. You boost and take a second stress.
4. You just performed an action again. Refined Gyros says you can do a red boost or rotate after you perform an action. You’ve already done both of these actions this turn, so no further benefit from the Gyros this turn.

8 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

You're clearly not, because I told you the correct ruling and you're arguing against it.

Nothing like this has shown up before. That doesn't mean the correct understanding of the rules cannot be gleaned.

So, to elaborate.

REFINED GYROSTABILIZERS: You can rotate your indicator only to your V or ^. After you perform an action, you may perform a red boost or rotate action.

PRIMED THRUSTERS: While you have 2 or fewer stress tokens, you can perform roll and boost actions even while stressed.

What you seem to be suggesting initially is this:

Perform focus action. Trigger Gyros twice, perform red rotate, gain stress, perform red boost (with thrusters), gain stress. That is not legal, because you're triggering Gyros twice from the same initial action, which violates the Once Per Opportunity rule. It's not legal to take both choices at once.

What IS legal is this:

Perform focus action. Trigger Gyros (as you just did a focus action). Perform red rotate. Gain Stress. Trigger Gyros (as you just did a rotate action). Perform red boost (legal because Thrusters). Gain stress. You're triggering Gyros twice, from two separate actions, and that's fine. The result is the same, but the sequence of how it came about is different.

This is perfectly legal. As would be, for instance, Coordinating a focus to the ship before it activates, gyro-ing a boost, then the ship doing a blue, locking, and gyroing a rotate.

Refined Gyrostabilisers is not limited to once per round. So as long as you are using a separate opportunity to trigger it each time, you can do both actions using it.

Well, I guess it depends on your idea of an argument. I’m asking what has come before to show that an ability can trigger twice. I don’t recall seeing that happen before and asked for an explanation for why this ability would trigger twice. I also recall from our 1.0 days of things that triggered more than once not being allowed to.

So maybe I’ll rephrase the question. What allows this ability to trigger twice when I know of nothing else in the game to allow it.

You are seeing an argument, I’m looking for clarification. What rules as written allows this to occur since no other abilities trigger more than once in a activation. You also claim to have told me the correct ruling, could you please link me to that correct ruling? I can’t seem to find it, which is why I came here and posted said question.

3 minutes ago, Vykk Draygo said:

Well, I guess it depends on your idea of an argument. I’m asking what has come before to show that an ability can trigger twice. I don’t recall seeing that happen before and asked for an explanation for why this ability would trigger twice. I also recall from our 1.0 days of things that triggered more than once not being allowed to.

So maybe I’ll rephrase the question. What allows this ability to trigger twice when I know of nothing else in the game to allow it.

You are seeing an argument, I’m looking for clarification. What rules as written allows this to occur since no other abilities trigger more than once in a activation. You also claim to have told me the correct ruling, could you please link me to that correct ruling? I can’t seem to find it, which is why I came here and posted said question.

It's right there in the post you just quoted. There's no official word because there doesn't need to be. The abilities are clearly written on the cards.

Perhaps you can reread the post you quoted and identify which elements you're not clear on rather than just saying it doesn't feel right to you. Feel is irrelevant. The rules are clear.

The ability can trigger. Unless something limits it to once per round (nothing does) it can trigger as many times as you can trigger it.

10 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

The ability can trigger. Unless something limits it to once per round (nothing does) it can trigger as many times as you can trigger it.

There is actually a point that covers this in the rules reference on page 19, the first entry under the appendix. It uses Jake Farrell for the example. It does work, and I found the answer that I was looking for. The rules do exist and would have been much simpler with a link instead of these long winded explanations. Thanks

23 minutes ago, Vykk Draygo said:

There is actually a point that covers this in the rules reference on page 19, the first entry under the appendix. It uses Jake Farrell for the example. It does work, and I found the answer that I was looking for. The rules do exist and would have been much simpler with a link instead of these long winded explanations. Thanks

My initial response contained all the necessary information in two lines.

Just saying.