So.....the resistance has arrived.

The T-70 is a brute of a medium-weight fighter - one hit point short of a B-wing but with agility 2 and a pretty decent dial (especially with integrated S-Foils offering focus/barrel roll under the right circumstances).

4 x Blue Squadron Novice, R2 (later Flight Assist) Astromech, Integrated Astromech was a pretty decent squad for improving your play style and learning the game.

I was wondering about an updated version. Now, there are a couple of options going; since a T-70 has picked up a 4th hull, you no longer 'need' an astromech to work, meaning you can buy whatever upgrade suits your plans best.

There are a shed-load of named pilots and unique astromechs which I've no doubt I'll experiment with eventually, but to start with I want to get my eye in with basic ships.

• 4 x Blue Squadron Rookie
  • 4 points to spend
  1. R3 Astromech lets you multi-lock with a target lock action. The action economy is nice, but since you're not splitting fire, it's arguably not that useful compared to the offensive/defensive flexibility of the focus token.
  2. R4 Astromech AND Jamming Beam - see below. Neither is that amazing on their own but the combination of the two might add up to something more impressive
  3. Tractor Beam - again, multiple tractor beams are far from amazing but being able to lob tractor beam shots from any ship on spec is nice. Plus, the option of a massed volley of 4 tractor beams might just be sufficient to let you reposition a large based ship - which could be devastating if something unmanouvrable ends up lined up with the board edge.
  4. Heavy Laser Cannon - bore-sighting opponents at range 2-3 isn't easy, but a firing line or pinwheel of 4 T-70s provides a pretty nasty 'web' of bullseye arcs to avoid, and one or two cannons firing can dramatically up the firepower of the squad. It's a lot easier when hunting medium or large ships; squads with "...and Redline" can expect to receive a couple of heavy laser bolts if flown well.
  5. Ion Missiles - Doesn't actually provide any more firepower than the primary weapons (although ignoring range 3 bonuses is nice), but giving a heavyweight swarm analogue the ability to ionize an opponent is often good; if your move is predictable, then I can line 3-4 T-70s up on you, including a couple of range 1 shots, and that's going to hurt a lot no matter who you are. This is likely to get even more annoying once the CIS faction comes out - droids (appropriately enough) hate ion weapons, because without a native focus action it functionally takes away their perform action step as well as leaving them adrift.
  6. Homing Missiles - Hmm...at range 3, getting a target lock with an initiative 2 pilot isn't easy, but if you can, it gives you a respectable chance of hitting an agility 3 target at range 3. Yes, they can just choose to take a hit instead, but frankly expecting more than 1 damage was optimistic anyway. It's a lot less impressive on a 3-dice primary ship than on something like an A-wing, but it's still a nice option to have.
  7. Advanced Optics - pretty pointless on a 3-dice primary ship; you're asking for the dice to deliver a blank and no focus results, otherwise you've gained nothing. That doesn't come up that often - especially since turning 3 blanks into 2 blanks and a hit is unlikely to gain you much in real terms. The chance of rolling Hit/Hit/Blank is not trivial, though, and it'll really up your performance if you do against stuff like TIE phantoms or X-wing aces, who have defence modifiers out the wazoo but only 2 green dice to apply them to.
• 4 x Red Squadron Expert
  • 2 points to spend.
  1. R4 Astromech gives you something not a million miles away from the old Baby Blues, but now at a respectable Initiative 3. Yes, you don't need the astromech for durability, but being able to exit a talon roll or a linked barrel roll into a speed 2 hard turn is a nice option, giving you manoeuvrability (if not agility) roughly on par with a TIE interceptor.
  2. Jamming Beam - I never gave this much thought in 1.0 because it was a pile of turd. Now jam tokens are harder to apply, and the jamming beam can by comparison strip off multiple tokens at once. It's okay.....you'd never want to fire 4 jamming beams at the same target but being able to fire a jamming beam from whichever ship you like is nice. Note - importantly - that Reinforce is a green token; firing a jamming beam to peel off a defender's reinforce token before smacking them around with three primary weapon attacks is probably going to do you more good than firing 4 primaries.
  3. Heroic actually leaves you 4 points shy. Theoretically, it won't do very much, because most of the time someone blanks out, they actually mean "I rolled a mix of focuses and blanks and have no token". The odds of genuinely 'blanking out' are only 14% on defence rolls and barely more than a tenth of that on attack rolls.
     • And you know what? Bugger statistics. Because everyone knows the dice are guaranteed to blank out on the one roll where it really, really matters and for 1 point and no prerequisites whatsoever regarding stress, actions, tokens, anything, Heroic might save your neck.
  4. Predator does....what predator normally does. It's a free reroll on a bullseye target; but I find myself thinking "the advantage of this over a heavy laser cannon rookie is?" - I guess the ability to use it at range 1 (where bullseye shots are easier to get, too) probably qualifies.
  5. Crack Shot - Cheaper than predator, but T-70s are tough as old boots; you should be getting several turns of fire out of each one or you're going to lose by attrition far too fast. Leave the one-use EPTs on TIE fighters.
  6. Debris Gambit - Evade is nice. Red evade....less so. Even if obstacles make it white, is it really that much better than a focus token given that you don't know which of your four ships will be shot at?
  7. Trick Shot - nice if you're facing someone dancing around the rocks. Pairing this up with the Integrated S-Foils linked barrel roll/focus could help offset the penalty if you can't like up a bullseye whilst moving around debris.
  8. Composure - if you somehow have 4 copies! Stops you wasting actions on barrel rolls or boosts that won't fit, I guess. Nice but it's a safety net if you assume you're going to screw up. Let's try to not do that in the first place, shall we?
• 4 x Black Squadron Ace
  • Can't take any upgrades.
  1. You are initiative 4, which is pretty respectable for generics (it's not bad for limited pilots!), but that's your only advantage. Against initiative 1 swarms, or initiative 5 & 6 aces, you might as well be Rookies.

Thoughts? Preferences? Opinions?

Seems like a great list to play your first games with, and effective for veterans to!

My favorite version would probably be red squadrons with heroic and R4, but any of the cannon based variations are pretty good to.

Id probably roll with the 4 HLC list.

4 attack dice with just a focus is better than 3 dice with a focus + lock. So getting 1 or 2 lined up increases the damage output of the list. And getting a ship to stress itself by barrel rolling or boosting out of a bullseye arc, but still in your primary gives you an advantage to get behind them next turn as well, limiting their moves.

All four Xwings with a focus firing their 3 dice primaries

• vs 2 green dice = 5.14 expected hits
• vs 3 green dice = 3.73 expected hits

One HLC Xwing with a focus and three focus primary weapon Xwings

• vs 2 green dice = 5.86 expected hits
• vs 3 green dice = 4.39 expected hits

Two HLC Xwings with a focus and two focus primary weapon Xwings

• vs 2 green dice = 6.58 expected hits
• vs 3 green dice = 5.06 expected hits

Heroic Reds for me. I'd keep the 4 point bid. It might matter against some 4-LOM or Palob lists.

Statistics on Heroic don't seem too bad. 14% chance of a proper blank-out means once in every 7 or so attacks. With naked green dice, a T-70 will live through about 4.9 attacks from 3 focused red dice. With Heroic added, that goes up to 5.9 similar attacks, per the simulation by @DerRitter . If you're focused every time, there's still the same increase from 6.9 to 8.0 average attacks. Taking on average an extra attack to die is worthwhile.

Oddly, Heroic seems best against bad enemy dice. Consider: an enemy rolls 1 hit against you. It happens. Heroic brings the chance of a Focused X-Wing taking damage from 14% down to 2%. If unwilling/unable to spend focus, from 39% chance to take a damage to 30%.

//

Predator might be OK, if there's a lot of lower agility large-base ships, but that's a pretty specific meta. I kinda think the Predator Red is going to be more reliable than the HLC Blue, because it's Init 3 instead of Init 1. There's not a huge amount of ships out there Init 3 outskills, but it's better than Init 1.

On the other hand, if I'm bringing Red Vets for Initiative 3 over HLC Blues, it might be right to take Crack Shot for the baby bid. But if HLC/Predator is for medium/large base stuff, the lower agility that implies might mean Crack Shot doesn't contribute. Like, can't Crack Shot a VCX.

//

Homing Blues are interesting, however.

To a certain extent, Homing Missiles are the only upgrade for the list which do nothing for the strengths of the squad (baseline efficiency jousting), but provide some different kind of benefit. Would it be possible to try something odd, like flying away (like, 3-hard away the first engagment) to get locks, then using reds to come back around?

It comes down to this: 4x T-70s are probably going to have the firepower to burn down most low-agility, high-HP things anyhow. Homing Missiles work best against low-HP, high-Agility ships. You can probably plan on Soontir Fel dodging your arcs, so taking Locks, then preparing to come around later for Homing Missile auto-hits at long range might be a strategy which helps an efficiency joust list beat an aces list. But 2e low-mod green dice probably beat an aces list anyhow.

11 hours ago, wurms said:

4 attack dice with just a focus is better than 3 dice with a focus + lock. So getting 1 or 2 lined up increases the damage output of the list. And getting a ship to stress itself by barrel rolling or boosting out of a bullseye arc, but still in your primary gives you an advantage to get behind them next turn as well, limiting their moves.

This. I don't really care whether the advantage I gain is smacking you with an extra red die or you not having a token because you've repositioned (or stress because it's a linked reposition). Either way, it's better for me than for you. And more importantly, whilst dodging one bullseye arc isn't hard, dodging a 'firing line' of 4 in a close-packed pinwheel or echelon is a LOT harder.

12 hours ago, Roller of blanks said:

My favorite version would probably be red squadrons with heroic and R4, but any of the cannon based variations are pretty good to. 

Sadly you get Heroic or R4 if you want 4 of them. If you got both I'd be all over that like stuff that is all over other stuff.

7 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Oddly, Heroic seems best against bad enemy dice. Consider: an enemy rolls 1 hit against you. It happens. Heroic brings the chance of a Focused X-Wing taking damage from 14% down to 2%. If unwilling/unable to spend focus, from 39% chance to take a damage to 30%.

Well - whether you're reducing 2 hits to 1 or 1 hit to 0, it's pretty much the same. The nice thing about a T-70's thick shields and decent hull is that the odd shot isn't too bad.

It's a touch more durability during red moves, which is often when tokenless ships come a-cropper (I used to be quite fond of Wired for similar reasons).

8 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Predator might be OK, if there's a lot of lower agility large-base ships, but that's a pretty specific meta. I kinda think the Predator Red is going to be more reliable than the HLC Blue, because it's Init 3 instead of Init 1. There's not a huge amount of ships out there Init 3 outskills, but it's better than Init 1.

I'm not convinced initiative 3 is anything to do the happy dance over. However, the bigger deal is that predator/primary (versus heavy laser cannon) works at range 1 - offering 4 dice plus focus plus reroll and it's a darn sight easier to get a bullseye on a range 1 target than at range 3.

7 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Homing Blues are interesting, however.

To a certain extent, Homing Missiles are the only upgrade for the list which do nothing for the strengths of the squad (baseline efficiency jousting), but provide some different kind of benefit. Would it be possible to try something odd, like flying away (like, 3-hard away the first engagment) to get locks, then using reds to come back around?

It comes down to this: 4x T-70s are probably going to have the firepower to burn down most low-agility, high-HP things anyhow. Homing Missiles work best against low-HP, high-Agility ships. You can probably plan on Soontir Fel dodging your arcs, so taking Locks, then preparing to come around later for Homing Missile auto-hits at long range might be a strategy which helps an efficiency joust list beat an aces list.

indeed. I didn't think of it in my first run-through, but it popped into my head when I was looking down the missile options. Picking up a lock for an alpha strike is hard, but picking up a lock mid-skirmish is easy enough - and against 2-3 aces, target locking instead of focusing isn't a death sentence the way it is with (say) a TIE/x1 because you've got a lot more hit points even if you do get shot. Meanwhile, it gives you something which can threaten someone with agility 3+ at range 3, where primary weapons are normally a waste of time.

I liked the idea of Ion Missiles and tractor beams, too, for similar reasons - it gives the T-70 a completely novel capability - an effective control weapon.

First squad I put down on the table was Jessika Pava and three baby blues.

Jessika Pava (52)
R5 Astromech (5)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Blue Squadron Rookie (46)
R4 Astromech (2)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Blue Squadron Rookie (46)
R4 Astromech (2)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Blue Squadron Rookie (46)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Total: 199

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

The lack of symmetry in the blues annoys me though, so next thing I'm doing with the 4 T-70s is 4 blues with HLC. Being able to take a focus every turn and not have to decide whether or not you have to spend it on attack is a massive benefit of i1-2. A HLC with focus averages 3 hits, that's a lot of punch.

I'm interested by the red squadrons, but also in trading in the named low initiative pilots like Bastian to shoot last with a double modded attack.

There was a 4 HLC variant at my local store last night, not sure how it did. The T70 is a high-quality ship for sure though, in 1.0 the 4 reds was very decent.

I own loads of T70s from 1.0 so I'll give it a go some time 😃

37 minutes ago, Dreadai said:

First squad I put down on the table was Jessika Pava and three baby blues.

Jessika Pava (52)
R5 Astromech (5)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Blue Squadron Rookie (46)
R4 Astromech (2)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Blue Squadron Rookie (46)
R4 Astromech (2)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Blue Squadron Rookie (46)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Total: 199

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

The lack of symmetry in the blues annoys me though, so next thing I'm doing with the 4 T-70s is 4 blues with HLC. Being able to take a focus every turn and not have to decide whether or not you have to spend it on attack is a massive benefit of i1-2. A HLC with focus averages 3 hits, that's a lot of punch.

I'm interested by the red squadrons, but also in trading in the named low initiative pilots like Bastian to shoot last with a double modded attack.

Why not all four with R4s? Or is it just that you only get 2 R4s in the box?

11 minutes ago, Magnus Grendel said:

Why not all four with R4s? Or is it just that you only get 2 R4s in the box?

Jess needs a mech with charges on it to get the best out of her ability.

2 hours ago, Dreadai said:

Jess needs a mech with charges on it to get the best out of her ability.

It's still one reroll a turn even without it, though. 5 points to reroll 2 dice over the course of a game seems a little too steep an investment in a 'budget' pilot.

That's why R5, you can use it without charges to flip cards face down like damaged engine, hull breach or fuel leak. Choices seem good!

Also, Jess really wants to be able to reroll twice a turn, she *will* get targeted to neuter her offense, and being able to reroll twice for defence and once for offence in clutch turns really adds to her value

5 hours ago, Dreadai said:

First squad I put down on the table was Jessika Pava and three baby blues.

Jessika Pava (52)
R5 Astromech (5)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Blue Squadron Rookie (46)
R4 Astromech (2)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Blue Squadron Rookie (46)
R4 Astromech (2)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Blue Squadron Rookie (46)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

Total: 199

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

What about dropping the R4's from the two Blues to stick Cluster Missiles on Pava? It would give you a little anti-swarm surprise and allow you to keep the similarity between the rookies. You could also snag an ion missile instead, which would give you a nice control option. Whacking a guy at range 3 and then pouncing him with all four T-70's could be fun!

Here's this list I came to. At PS1 you'll probably have trouble lining up those HLC shots. Not so much when you have a couple of tractor beams lining up the shots for you. I've got 2 points leftover but I'm not sure where to spend them.

T-70 X-wing - Blue Squadron Rookie - 49
Blue Squadron Rookie - (46)
Integrated S-foils (Closed) (0)
Tractor Beam (3)

T-70 X-wing - Blue Squadron Rookie - 49
Blue Squadron Rookie - (46)
Integrated S-foils (Closed) (0)
Tractor Beam (3)

T-70 X-wing - Blue Squadron Rookie - 50
Blue Squadron Rookie - (46)
Integrated S-foils (Closed) (0)
Heavy Laser Cannon (4)

T-70 X-wing - Blue Squadron Rookie - 50
Blue Squadron Rookie - (46)
Integrated S-foils (Closed) (0)
Heavy Laser Cannon (4)

Total: 198/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

18 hours ago, wurms said:

And getting a ship to stress itself by barrel rolling or boosting out of a bullseye arc, but still in your primary gives you an advantage to get behind them next turn as well, limiting their moves.

7 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

This. I don't really care whether the advantage I gain is smacking you with an extra red die or you not having a token because you've repositioned (or stress because it's a linked reposition). Either way, it's better for me than for you. And more importantly, whilst dodging one bullseye arc isn't hard, dodging a 'firing line' of 4 in a close-packed pinwheel or echelon is a LOT harder.

That's something which hadn't crossed my mind. Init 1 Blue Rookiees can set up zones where an opponent is forced to eat 4 dice or else reposition.

7 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I liked the idea of Ion Missiles and tractor beams, too, for similar reasons - it gives the T-70 a completely novel capability - an effective control weapon.

I'm less sold on these than Homing, but it could work.

Tractors, like many things, are better at higher initiative. Being able to tractor someone onto a rock to prevent a shot is a huge benefit of the tractor effect. An X-Wing can set up position for a future turn, reduce agility, but at Init 1, that extra benefit of denying a shot won't come up too often. It does add some control, but the cost is a 3-dice attack. If all a Tractor does is reduce agility, statistically you'll be losing damage by not having just taken a regular shot (and losing enough that a 50% chance of rock damage doesn't make up for it). If you can deny a range 3 defensive bonus too, or gain a Range 1 attack bonus, that'll work out in Tractor's favor damage-wise. I think it'd kind of need to be felt-out.

Ion Missiles... I dunno. I kinda think Ion weapons aren't as bad as many folks think they are, but it's a tougher sell when it's missiles on a 3-dice ship. I don't think it's so much bad , rather as not as good as what you'd give up in other upgrades/ships.

7 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I'm not convinced initiative 3 is anything to do the happy dance over. However, the bigger deal is that predator/primary (versus heavy laser cannon) works at range 1 - offering 4 dice plus focus plus reroll and it's a darn sight easier to get a bullseye on a range 1 target than at range 3.

It certainly isn't a huge initiative increase. But when you add up the initiative boost, the range 1 option, and subtract the not-too-large difference in expected damage... it's probably close enough that it doesn't really matter, so fly whatever your prefered flavor of initiative is.

I think I'd try running the RedPreds, but it's almost surely a small difference. I can conceive of a metagame where the Init 3 is something to dance over (suppose you're facing lots of Five. Cartel. Marauders.), but that's not really the standard metagame. I do think there are enough 2s and 3s (4-LOM and Palob, some Sabine Wren, Bombers other than Jonus) which could Init-kill a Blue, and enough 1s (Jakku Gunrunners) that you might be able to Init-kill yourself that 3 does matter some. I think it's a benefit. I don't know if it's worth the trade-off against potential higher damage on HLC.

But there's also a potential new-player benefit to just being Init 1, and not having to worry about being blocked by an opponent.

On 12/13/2018 at 10:29 AM, Magnus Grendel said:

• 4 x Black Squadron Ace
  • Can't take any upgrades.
  1. You are initiative 4, which is pretty respectable for generics (it's not bad for limited pilots!), but that's your only advantage. Against initiative 1 swarms, or initiative 5 & 6 aces, you might as well be Rookies.

Thoughts? Preferences? Opinions?

For those who already have T-70s from 1.0 and are getting a conversion kit rather than new models, 4 Black Squadron Aces is not an option since you only get 1 per conversion kit.

This is my baby blues inspired squad. Here are some Red and Black Heroes.

T-70 X-wing - Red Squadron Expert - 49
Red Squadron Expert - (48)
Heroic (1)
Integrated S-foils (Open) (0)

T-70 X-wing - Red Squadron Expert - 49
Red Squadron Expert - (48)
Heroic (1)
Integrated S-foils (Open) (0)

T-70 X-wing - Black Squadron Ace - 51
Black Squadron Ace - (50)
Heroic (1)
Integrated S-foils (Open) (0)

T-70 X-wing - Black Squadron Ace - 51
Black Squadron Ace - (50)
Heroic (1)
Integrated S-foils (Open) (0)

Total: 200/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

On ‎12‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 10:02 PM, Ironlord said:

For those who already have T-70s from 1.0 and are getting a conversion kit rather than new models, 4 Black Squadron Aces is not an option since you only get 1 per conversion kit.

Surprising - albeit not that relevant; I can't really see anyone going for these guys rather than taking named T-70s unless the Resistance gets a "triggered-by-non-limited-pilots" equivalent to Kath Scarlet.

Do need to have a try with these. I think for a first pass the Heavy Laser Cannon Rookies will probably win out.

They also make for an interesting comparison to their First Order Counterparts: four Zeta Squadron Survivors with Special Forces Gunners and Shield Upgrades:

• T-70s
  • Boost action & Roll/Link/Focus (at a cost of lost firepower outside the boresight)
  • 4th attack die in bullseye arc at range 2-3
  • White Speed 3 turn and Talon roll
• TIE/sf
  • Evade action
  • 7th hit point is a shield rather than a hull
  • Heavy weapons turret allowing 2-dice rearward fire
  • Red speed 1 turn and Segnor's Loops

The T-70 is much better in a 'head-on' pass where it can get shots off from that massive centreline weapon, whilst the TIE/sf wants a range 1 knife-fight where it can be making range 1 shots from front and rear at once, but ultimately both have 3-dice primaries, agility 2 and 7 hit points, so it should be a pleasantly close matchup.

There are a few different options for SFs...

• Zeta Squadron, Init 2
  • Shield Upgrade, as you said. This matches the T-70 statline.
  • Pattern Analyzer. This seems kind of nifty to me. Pulling red moves and still getting actions is a potent effect. Is it worth a hit point on each? Hard to say. But it does seem like an interesting option that a T-70 can't accomplish.
  • Almost any missile. Rear arc shots make them a bit more tempting on the SF than the T-70 in my mind.
    • Both Homing Missile and Fire Control System. Seems like there could be some potential to this, in flying past and grabbing locks and rotating.
• Omega Squadron, Init 3
  • Fanatical. Probably not really worth it. These can't arc-dodge like Silencers.
  • Advanced Optics. With the rear arc being 2 dice, AdvO makes their guns pretty consistent. Again, doesn't really seem worth it. Consistent rear-arc guns don't seem too important.

//

Irksome thing with the SF in the conversion kits: there are 5x Omega Squadron Expert tokens, but only 4x Omega Squadron Expert pilot cards. The awkward thing: there are 7x Zeta Squadron Pilot TIE/FO cards, despite the fact that only 6x can fit into a list.

10 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Almost any missile. Rear arc shots make them a bit more tempting on the SF than the T-70 in my mind.

Indeed. Cluster or concussion missiles have enough charges to almost qualify as a basic 3-dice attack (alright, no 4 dice at range 1), can be fired out the back with Heavy Weapon Turret, Homing Missiles and FCS are a nice idea too.

In both cases, though, I'd pack them in as a 6 point upgrade (ish) and then not take Special Forces Gunner. That turns the TIE/sf into the First Order's 'heavy swarmer', with 3-dice attacks at range 2 - this time front-or-rear - and able to turn up mob-handed with 5 ships.

10 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Omega Squadron, Init 3

• Fanatical. Probably not really worth it. These can't arc-dodge like Silencers.

True, but they do have the evade action - something added since 1.0. Once you're 'shields down', you can evade and still get offensive dice modifiers, which makes finishing a wounded TIE/sf off quite annoying.

10 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Advanced Optics. With the rear arc being 2 dice, AdvO makes their guns pretty consistent. Again, doesn't really seem worth it. Consistent rear-arc guns don't seem too important.

It's a nice-to-have but I agree it's not that amazing. Weapons Guidance was never that awesome in 1.0 aside from a multi-focus upsilon (still a good use) or Wired Zeta Leader.

10 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Pattern Analyzer. This seems kind of nifty to me. Pulling red moves and still getting actions is a potent effect. Is it worth a hit point on each? Hard to say. But it does seem like an interesting option that a T-70 can't accomplish.

Now that one is a good point. You end up a hit point down, but it lets you use your red dial to good effect, making you far more mobile than a T-70. If at any point during the game, you have a focus token on a defence roll you wouldn't have otherwise had, you've probably earned back your hit point right there, and there's enough red on the TIE/sf's dial to make the option very tempting.

7 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

Indeed. Cluster or concussion missiles have enough charges to almost qualify as a basic 3-dice attack (alright, no 4 dice at range 1), can be fired out the back with Heavy Weapon Turret, Homing Missiles and FCS are a nice idea too.

In both cases, though, I'd pack them in as a 6 point upgrade (ish) and then not take Special Forces Gunner. That turns the TIE/sf into the First Order's 'heavy swarmer', with 3-dice attacks at range 2 - this time front-or-rear - and able to turn up mob-handed with 5 ships.

Yeah. I *REALLY* love the way FFG designed the TIE/SF and Special Forces Gunner. Stands out in stark contrast to the TIE Advanced x1.

Both ships have 2 printed red dice, but an "easy" way to get 3 red dice. Advanced Targeting Computer, however, is unreliable, and really costly in terms of actions. Special Forces Gunner requires almost only points. Pay for it at 44, or be cheap at 34. You have to plan ahead your rotates, but they don't cost action economy, you just need to commit. A clever opponent might be able to take advantage of that commitment, but it's not as easy as in the case of ATC.

So the x1 is a ship which struggles to even function, while the SF is essentially two ships in one. A baseline medium fighter/jouster, and a missile-based heavy swarmer. Missile Swarms are kind of lackluster in other factions (Scyk, A-Wing, TAP v1), but they don't have access to rear-arc missiles or to Targeting Synchronizer.

But the 4-ship faction First Order really needed a double-duty chassis more...

7 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

[RE: Fanatical Omega Experts]

True, but they do have the evade action - something added since 1.0. Once you're 'shields down', you can evade and still get offensive dice modifiers, which makes finishing a wounded TIE/sf off quite annoying.

A good point. I might like the Fanatical Omega better as a filler ship than a jousting medium-fighter list, like that sort of slow-dying pest fits better next to a pair of Fanatical Silencers, or Silencer/Upsilon.

11 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

So the x1 is a ship which struggles to even function, while the SF is essentially two ships in one. A baseline medium fighter/jouster, and a missile-based heavy swarmer. Missile Swarms are kind of lackluster in other factions (Scyk, A-Wing, TAP v1), but they don't have access to rear-arc missiles or to Targeting Synchronizer.

But the 4-ship faction First Order really needed a double-duty chassis more...

This. I mean, the Zeta Squadron Survivor is distinctly pricier than the Galactic Empire's Scimitar Squadron equivalent, and can't carry (critically) pack Barrage Rockets, but Heavy Weapons Turret does give it incredible flexibility, and targeting synchroniser providing a lock from a tough-to-remove upsilon or high initiative ace like Quickdraw or Null is great. An extra point of initiative plus 3 shields instead of hull for critical tolerance plus their slightly better dial is awesome.

11 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Stands out in stark contrast to the TIE Advanced x1.

I don't mind the TIE/x1's ability, but it kind of makes the missile slot redundant - certainly it makes cluster missiles (the TIE/x1's iconic weapon and the card which comes in the expansion) utterly pointless. But yes, it's not a patch on specfor gunner, and a Zeta Specfor TIE/sf is only 3 points more than a Tempest Squadron Pilot (which is basically eaten by the Fire Control System you'd inevitably equip the latter with). Yes it has an extra green die (which is unmodified during the engagement round as you need to lock) but it loses a shield token so it's no tougher and arguably more fragile.

It's just a wonderfully flexible ship, much like the T-70, which - whilst nominally "an X-wing" and a pretty decent 'head on' heavy fighter, can mix and match pattern analyser, Black One, Wexley, Asty and Kun's abilities and leave even TIE interceptors going " where the bloody heck did that one come from ?"

On ‎12‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 2:35 PM, Wildonion said:

What about dropping the R4's from the two Blues to stick Cluster Missiles on Pava? It would give you a little anti-swarm surprise and allow you to keep the similarity between the rookies. You could also snag an ion missile instead, which would give you a nice control option. Whacking a guy at range 3 and then pouncing him with all four T-70's could be fun!

For that matter, dropping the two R4s and using up the 1 point bid lets you give Jess an ion cannon rather than missiles. Your opponent gets their range 3 bonus but you don't need a lock to fire it, meaning you can get focus-reroll shots and you can't run out of ammo. Plus, you can lob a 4-dice ion shot at range 1 if you get the opportunity...great for droid pilots like "Chopper".

Oh, the ion cannon is a much better versatility option! I keep forgetting you can mix any of the secondary weapons onto the T-70.

[missed context]

2 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

I mean, it is.

But Blue Rookiees start at 46 points, and Ion Cannon is 5 points, so you can't run 4x Ion Cannon. You could do some sort of a mixed squad, but still.

True, but the original suggestion I made was to drop the astromechs from two of the rookies so that all three were identical, which frees up points for Pava to take some kind of secondary weapon.