2 minutes ago, Thrindal said:

Basically anything that references ship size needs to be clarified or a blanket statement needs to be made that anything that applies to large ships also applies to Huge Ships.

Or if it doesn't.

Just as a followup,

How does Gunnery Team or the Advanced Gunnery objective effect the SSD.

Can all 3 shots be made from the same arc? Can only 2 shots come from the same arc and the third must be a different arc.

• Independence - needs a total rework, maybe making it flight controllers but may add "any color die"
• Redemption - lower points
• XX-9 - no change
• Liberty - add a "boosted comms" effect in addition to the normal effect
• All the red objectives that are not Most Wanted, Advanced Gunnery and Station Assault - opening salvo should blue or black for 1st player, remain unchanged for 2nd player; reclassify the station so it may not be moved by grav well
• Fleet Ambush - ships may not deploy with distance 3 of each other
• Redundant Shields - lower points
• Cluster Bombs (a great upgrade really, but it only comes in the mc80?!) - just need a way to get this back, a minimum of two uses would be perfect, or lower points.
• Heavy Turbo Laser Turrets - now that Contain is a thing make this so Contain does not affect normal crit effects
• Ion Canon Batteries (killed by HIEs) - discard one command token & lose one shield
• Expanded Launchers - point slowered to 8 or 9
• Walex Bissex - ship phase, not activation

3 hours ago, LordTesla said:

😅 The biggest reason its always included is because unless you're looking for a carrier (Quasar) or a good flak platform (Raider) there really isn't a better way to spend 100 points or less. and as far as survive-ability goes it has nothing on the Landomition.

I would argue that a GSD II is a great flack boat with a build like this:

Gladiator II (62)
• Agent Kallus (3)
• Ordnance Experts (4)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
• Demolisher (10)
= 84 Points

You have a ship that is good at killing ships and good at killing squadrons, I feel that the empire needs a ship that can challenge demos power more than an faq, something comparable to demo in price, but can still consitantly do damage, but is maybe more durable, so you can't move and shoot, but can take more of a beating, I'm not really sure, but a new ship in demos same weight class is really what is needed.

10 minutes ago, xero989 said:

You have a ship that is good at killing ships and good at killing squadrons, I feel that the empire needs a ship that can challenge demos power more than an faq, something comparable to demo in price, but can still consitantly do damage, but is maybe more durable, so you can't move and shoot, but can take more of a beating, I'm not really sure, but a new ship in demos same weight class is really what is needed.

Maybe not more durable but if you can keep it at long range an Arquitens with Enhanced Armaments and Krennic should be able to put out much more consistent damage than an Arquitens without Vader does today.

I don't see all the issues with Demo, it has been out for as long as the game and has remained strong but not OP in my mind. Brunson is really the only 'new' tech I see folks using. That makes it somewhat more survivable but I don't see it as game changing.

23 minutes ago, Thrindal said:

Just as a followup,

How does Gunnery Team or the Advanced Gunnery objective effect the SSD.

Can all 3 shots be made from the same arc? Can only 2 shots come from the same arc and the third must be a different arc.

It could make all 3 attacks from the front hull zone as gunnery teams is worded "you can attack from the same hull zone more than once" the wording on advanced gunnery is similar, it says "may perform each attack from the same hull zone" so it would work there as well.

30 minutes ago, Thrindal said:

Maybe not more durable but if you can keep it at long range an Arquitens with Enhanced Armaments and Krennic should be able to put out much more consistent damage than an Arquitens without Vader does today.

I don't see all the issues with Demo, it has been out for as long as the game and has remained strong but not OP in my mind. Brunson is really the only 'new' tech I see folks using. That makes it somewhat more survivable but I don't see it as game changing.

I would agree with this for the most part, I was mostly staying why people take demo over other ships, I do think that the best option to make lists more diverse, and indirectly Nerf demo, witch I don't think necessarily needs a Nerf, is to make another Imperal ship in demos wieght class. If the demo title needs a Nerf the only thing that I think could be done is to say "you may not use this ability when attacking squadrons." Then you would start to maybe see more raiders.

@eliteone XX-9s already prevented contain.

Redundant shields : 1 point cheaper. You can recover and move a shield. It's even thematic with the name.

Since we're just wishlisting I'll add that I'd like a pony. So if they could FAQ a pony in there for me that would be fantastic.

I´ would guess it's safe to assume that when the SSD comes out there will be a bunch or SSD/Huge ship-related rules and clarifications. I was assuming the premise of this discussion was aside from that, what other FAQs are needed?

3 hours ago, xero989 said:

I would argue that a GSD II is a great flack boat with a build like this:

Gladiator II (62)
• Agent Kallus (3)
• Ordnance Experts (4)
• Assault Proton Torpedoes (5)
• Demolisher (10)
= 84 Points

You have a ship that is good at killing ships and good at killing squadrons, I feel that the empire needs a ship that can challenge demos power more than an faq, something comparable to demo in price, but can still consitantly do damage, but is maybe more durable, so you can't move and shoot, but can take more of a beating, I'm not really sure, but a new ship in demos same weight class is really what is needed.

Definitely a great flak ship! Ask @CommanderDave what you can do when you take Flechette´'s!

On 12/13/2018 at 10:35 AM, CptAwesomer said:

We'll get as many versions as there are upgrade cards, sir! Aptonisher! Acmonisher! ETmonisher! XX-9nonisher! #Palponisher2020, book it.

I don't necessarily have anything against whatever-onisher and totally agree with you that it is so ubiquitous because there is no better option for Imps. It's been seen a lot lately (though "a lot" is not much better than anecdotal evidence at this point) and there is a worry that the reason it's being seen so much is because it's overpowered. As I said and as you point out, jury's still very much out on whether it really is or not.

Going on a limb here, but the difference with facing Demo, as opposed to the other ubiquitous title, Yavaris, is that Demo is often used as a blitz option, whereas Yavaris takes time to develop. People don't like their plastic bits getting blown up turn 2 with no way to retaliate (or so would an unprepared player pretend). It's the same thing with 2-ship Pryce builds at the moment. It handcuffs you and you have little time to do anything to counter it. Which only means you have to come prepared.

Reasonably, IF Demo/Brunson/whatever part of that combo is OP, it will show.... eventually. Chances are, though, the meta will adapt.

Yavaris may be more difficult to setup but its also costs less and is safer because it commands squads from the rear. Whereas with Demo you almost always end up with a 100 point glass cannon that you must fling into the face of the enemy and pray it gets its shots off and runs away to safety - because if all it does is trade with a MC80/75 then you barely come out ahead points wise.

On 12/13/2018 at 4:29 PM, dominosfleet said:

Since we're just wishlisting I'll add that I'd like a pony. So if they could FAQ a pony in there for me that would be fantastic.

I got you a pony, but apparently it died and is being beaten with a "nerf demo" stick....

Too soon?

13 hours ago, LordTesla said:

Yavaris may be more difficult to setup but its also costs less and is safer because it commands squads from the rear. Whereas with Demo you almost always end up with a 100 point glass cannon that you must fling into the face of the enemy and pray it gets its shots off and runs away to safety - because if all it does is trade with a MC80/75 then you barely come out ahead points wise.

Whatever happened to Glad, Demo, OE, APT.... The Cheap Demo, even without ET, was always trading up significantly to ANY large ship, and only trading equally with barebones mediums...

On 12/12/2018 at 8:23 AM, Zamalekite said:

We'll see a fuller picture coming out of the Regionals analysis project that @Truthiness is running but, if early trends are something to go by, roughly half of imperial fleets in tournaments have the same title and most of the top Imperial fleets have the exact same 'DACOE' build. That level of homogenisation isn't good for the game.

DACOE?

47 minutes ago, TTC said:

   DACOE?

Demolisher-ACM-Ord Experts?

Demolisher, APT, Captain Brunson, Ordnance Experts, Engine Techs

DACOE is a little more snazzy than DAPTCBOEET.