Savage gors questing on a Sack to Aendris

By Dedal, in Warhammer Invasion Rules Questions

Savage Gors : Battlefield. This unit deals 2 additional damage while attacking if you have 2 or more developments in your battlefield.

Sack to Aendris : Quest. Any unit questing here may attack as though it were in your battlefield

Does it mean that a Savage Gors questing on a Sack to Aendris, assuming that there is 2 developments in my battlefield, deals 2 additional damage while attacking from the quest zone, as it would do while attacking from the battlefield zone ?

At first, I would say, no, I don't think it does. But I could argue for both interpretations.

If the effect allowing the Unit to attack as it was in the Battlefield does mean : for every purpose, this unit is considered as located in the Battlefield, then, yes, the Battlefield condition would be satisfied and il would gain its additional powers.

If the effect only allows to attack from anywhere, then not.

At the very end, I'd say.. It gains its additional powers. Without additional explanation, I think it's best to stick to a strict interpretation of the Quest card. I'm converted. ^^

no, it wouldnt get the bonus from devlopments if not in Battlefield & even if it was on Sack Tor Aendris.

the Battlefield text of course means those abilities are only considered when the card is literally in the Battlefield zone. Sac TA doesn't get around this - it would say 'this unit counts as being in the Battlefield" or something similar if it were the case. its text of "may attack as if it were in the Battlefield" is a way around the rule that only Battlefield units may attack, a seperate rule.

Artemus Maximus said:

no, it wouldnt get the bonus from devlopments if not in Battlefield & even if it was on Sack Tor Aendris.

the Battlefield text of course means those abilities are only considered when the card is literally in the Battlefield zone. Sac TA doesn't get around this - it would say 'this unit counts as being in the Battlefield" or something similar if it were the case. its text of "may attack as if it were in the Battlefield" is a way around the rule that only Battlefield units may attack, a seperate rule.

I would disagree.

Savage Gors reads:
"Battlefield. This unit deals 2 additional damage while attacking if you have 2 or more developments in your battlefield."

Sack Tor Aendris reads:
"Quest. Any unit questing here may attack as though it were in your battlefield.
Quest. You may spend resources on this quest to pay for cards and effects.
Quest. Forced: At the end of any turn in which the questing unit participated in an attack, place a resource token on this card."

Zone Specific Effects (pg. 16 of rulebook) reads:
"Some card effects are preceded by an italicized zone name. (Kingdom, Quest, or Battlefield.) Such effects are only active when the card is located in the specified zone."

Artemus Maximus I would agree with your line of thinking if the card read "...may be declared as an attacker as though it were in your battlefield".
However, the quest just says "may attack". So, while a unit on STA quest is attacking, it is in the battlefield for all intents and purposes until it is no longer attacking. This also means it looses any effects it may receive for being in the quest zone.

So, if Savage Gors are attacking from this quest, they do get the bonus to power for 2 or more developments in your battlefield zone. Just watch out for Brutal Offering because they are part of the battlefield at this point :)

I have to agree with Artemus Maximus. The Battlefield text allows abilities when only in the battlefield zone. Any unit questing on Sack Tor Aendris is in the quest zone. However, during the battlefield phase that particular unit can still participate in attacks as though it were in the battlefield zone, but it's still in the quest zone, so the ability does not become active. I would need an official ruling before I believe differently...

I appreciate your critical thinking on this Toberk, but still I'd have to stick with what i said.

as you pointed out, the rules state (as you underlined) the text after Battlefield (Quest/Kingdon) only apply when a unit with that zone specific effect is in that zone. We all agree on that, i think. A unit is either in a zone or not. There are no rules stating that a unit can exist in two zones simultaneaously. So we'd need a card to override that.

Sac Tor Aendris says "...attack as though it were in your battlefield". (now i must admit that my background in languages may be causing me to read it not how they intended, BUT: )

the structuring of the bolded words is in the subjunctive tense. Meaning that the phrase is not fact, but unknown / undetermined / hypothetical / etc. If the unit moved to the Battlefield, the card would literally say so. Which also means that it can't go back on that quest. But it doesn't say it is in your battlefield when it attacks, it says it can attack (like your battlefield units) but doesn't have to be in your battlefield to do so. A Brutal Offering wouldn't affect ANY questing unit, be it on Sack Tor Aendris, Defend Tor Aendris or Wolves of the North, or Dragonslaer (unless the questing unit had the ability to be in more than one place at the same time).

All that being said, ohhh James....got a question ;)

Yea give it to James.

Still, the wording is so clear on Dragonslayer and Greyseer that I think they had a different intention with this quest (otherwise, why not just use the same wording?).

I agree with Toberk. Dragonslayer and Grey Seer Thanquol both specify they may attack from the quest zone/any zone respectively. Sack Tor Aendris specifically states it attacks as though it were in your battlefield. As such, I think Savage Gors would deal "2 additional damage while attacking if you have 2 or more developments in your battlefield" while on this quest. However, I would say this only applies to Savage Gors because their ability specifically occurs while attacking. I don't think the Fledgling Chaos Spawn ability (Battlefield. Forced: After this unit is destroyed, deal 1 damage to one target unit in any player's battlefield.), for instance, would trigger if attacking from Sack Tor Aendris.

RM

If the savage gors can deal additional damage then I should be able to Blood for the Blood God them, hmmm

Artemus Maximus said:

Sac Tor Aendris says "...attack as though it were in your battlefield". (now i must admit that my background in languages may be causing me to read it not how they intended, BUT: )

the structuring of the bolded words is in the subjunctive tense. Meaning that the phrase is not fact, but unknown / undetermined / hypothetical / etc. If the unit moved to the Battlefield, the card would literally say so. Which also means that it can't go back on that quest. But it doesn't say it is in your battlefield when it attacks, it says it can attack (like your battlefield units) but doesn't have to be in your battlefield to do so. A Brutal Offering wouldn't affect ANY questing unit, be it on Sack Tor Aendris, Defend Tor Aendris or Wolves of the North, or Dragonslaer (unless the questing unit had the ability to be in more than one place at the same time).

All that being said, ohhh James....got a question ;)

Sorry, but your logic sent you in a bad way. :)

You are right till that "Meaning that the phrase is not fact", but I think you are wrong in the assumptions after that.

The unit is not physically moved into the BF, but count as being there for every game effect. This is what "as thought it were in your BF" means. So it will be affected by Blood for the Blood God, Brutal Offering etc.

Just my 2 cents. :)