Not this convo again....just be happy with whatever they release the way I see it. We’re lucky to get a set of releases each month

19 minutes ago, TauntaunScout said:

Just so's it's corps! 3 corps per faction will be an important line to cross for the game I think.

This whole line of argument about "they aren't different in canon" is lost on me, I've been burned too many times before, in Star Wars and elsewhere.

Yes. Corps, definitely corps!! (But not a Corps with single black die attack if they can help it...)

I guess the issue about canon boils down to this: Disney's canon for Star Wars matters to Disney.

If FFG wants to "go against canon" and say, "Our Hoth Troopers have A-300s or A-280Cs" in order to give them a different weapon stat than Rebel Troopers, Disney likely has to sign off on it.

I mean, I guess FFG could just say, "Forget it. We want a 2 white die, range 1-3 attack on the Hoth troopers. While we've always represented that with an A-300, the Hoth Troopers get it and we still name the weapon A-280" and just have to get over naming inconsistencies with weapons.

I dunno if anybody's arguing canon persay here. But the Echo Base guys are using the A-280 (or comparable variant, that is actually a canonicity rabbit hole, but not a relevant one). However, Snowtroopers are also using an E-11, so that's not an inherent problem. But, if they use the A280, have Nimble and white defense and cost 40 points, etc, then we run into the community split mentioned above. For the aesthetic focused customer, they don't mind at all, they have the sculpt they want to paint and put on a specific board. For the more gameplay focused players, they feel a bit cheated - FFG "wasted" a print run on making a product which arguably isn't new when they could have produced something which has both a distinct appearance and a distinct use (a reason why I've always thought Imperial Navy/Technician unit would probably happen - those are a known look and also should play functionally different from a Stormtrooper). This is why I personally think a compromise will emerge in time - where we can get both the unit and actually add gameplay value - either as an updated rerelease of Rebel Troopers which contains new upgrades or an entirely distinct unit (and I'd prefer the latter because the former is still a bit exploitative). The only "canon" issue which arises is that FFG is still responsible to LFL who have to review the products. We know they allow some wiggle room in accuracy (X-wing models based on sequel films being made on pre-production materials like a year in advance), we know they let FFG draw on Legends materials and even original content - but we do not and probably cannot know where the cut-off point is for the licensor. Something really out-of-place with what we see on screen probably wouldn't fly.

@UnitOmega I could see FFG giving an "Echo Base" trooper some benefit to morale for being in base to base with heavy cover, or some other benefit based on cover, such as "Immune: Sharpshooter" just because they are portrayed in ESB as making extensive use of fortifications.

6 minutes ago, Caimheul1313 said:

@UnitOmega I could see FFG giving an "Echo Base" trooper some benefit to morale for being in base to base with heavy cover, or some other benefit based on cover, such as "Immune: Sharpshooter" just because they are portrayed in ESB as making extensive use of fortifications.

Slap them with Low Profile , and nothing else.

7 minutes ago, Indy_com said:

Slap them with Low Profile , and nothing else.

I could see that as well. Personally I'd like something "new," but I agree that Low Profile would work as well.

I was thinking of like an "Entrenched" keyword to either give them dodge tokens in heavy cover or remove suppression and whatnot, but low profile could just as easily work, especially without the Training slot to give them Duck And Cover.

It's all fine and dandy to dream about what rules "Echo Base Troopers" would have, but the most important question is what unique role would they fill?

Making models just to have a different aesthetic is great...5 years from now when the game is fully fleshed out. Like @UnitOmega said, printing models just to fill an aesthetic slot would be silly at this point.

12 minutes ago, NeonWolf said:

It's all fine and dandy to dream about what rules "Echo Base Troopers" would have, but the most important question is what unique role would they fill?

Making models just to have a different aesthetic is great...5 years from now when the game is fully fleshed out. Like @UnitOmega said, printing models just to fill an aesthetic slot would be silly at this point.

Giving them both Low Profile and Defensive Surge would make them a cheap-ish infantry that is somewhat difficult to remove no matter which part of the board they are located on.

Basically they would be siege defence units.

1 minute ago, Indy_com said:

Giving them both Low Profile and Defensive Surge would make them a cheap-ish infantry that is somewhat difficult to remove no matter which part of the board they are located on.

How is that significantly different than the current Rebel Troopers with Nimble and defensive surge?

Crits will ignore the Cover and Dodge from either keyword. Sharpshooter will ignore the cover from Low Profile as well.

(Welcome to the "we're gonna annoy the people who just want new models" hour)

Alright, so Nimble requires actions most of the time, yours or say a commanders. Low Profile doesn't. But, you have a fair point, Sharpshooter is really effective right now - the best way is to actually model your board with trenches they could hide in. But, since Nimble is a basic corps keyword, having an effect with a similar ceiling isn't bad. That said, while I'm not averse to Low Profile's defensive capabilities - I do think that doesn't necessarily get to the heart of the tactics. Low Profile lets you cross open ground or squat in light cover and still get your bonuses. And with their Standby focus, Fleet Troopers are theoretically good at squatting objectives anyway. So whatever they can do should reinforce the different role we want them to play - ideally endure harsh conditions and make best use of cover? This is kind of why I'm thinking of an inverse of Hostile Environment, they can ignore or shed additional Suppression while in cover - making it hard for them to panic and be forced from cover and also can keep action efficiency up - but if you need to move them you have to very carefully plan to dash from cover to cover.

Heavy Weapons options is also something to consider - I don't know of any which are particularly thematic or well known to the Echo Base guys, but that can change how one plans a unit.

1 hour ago, Caimheul1313 said:

@UnitOmega I could see FFG giving an "Echo Base" trooper some benefit to morale for being sitting ducks in a doomd base with heavy cover, or some other benefit based fighting a losing dellaying battle with low odds of survival , such as "Immune: Sharpshooter" just because they are portrayed in ESB as making extensive use of fortifications.

I slightly altered this post, in bold.

43 minutes ago, NeonWolf said:

It's all fine and dandy to dream about what rules "Echo Base Troopers" would have, but the most important question is what unique role would they fill?

Making models just to have a different aesthetic is great...5 years from now when the game is fully fleshed out. Like @UnitOmega said, printing models just to fill an aesthetic slot would be silly at this point.

Good question. My answer:

Hoth Troopers are most oft remembered for their steely determination while entrenched awaiting the onslaught of the advancing Imperial forces. Corps units, to date, have always had a single ability. How do we give them the feel of the Battle of Hoth within existing parameters but make them different?

I personally think we need to shy away from one black attack die. I would design them with a 1-3 ranged weapon that throws 2 white dice. White defense with Surge to Block. This gives us a nice intermediary between the Rebel Troopers and the Fleet Troopers.

What else do I do to give them a unique roll that plays tribute to ESB? That's where the ability comes into play and we have two that I feel, fits the bill. Sentinel is a good approximation to reflect the troops finding their foxholes and awaiting the enemy. It solves the issue we see with Standby being a "mostly useless" action with most units and really makes them play quite differently than other corps units. Alternately, Danger Sense X is another great way to represent them digging into the trenches and facing down incoming laser fire while remaining steadfast. It also approximates the additional cover provided by trenches and since they are likely going to remained suppressed, they are likely not moving - just sitting there firing away.

50 minutes ago, NeonWolf said:

printing models just to fill an aesthetic slot would be silly at this point.

Being aesthetically repetitious with plastic models just to tweak non-corporeal rules (which can be accomplished with releasing new upgrade cards) is silly at this point.

Personally I think they should have Courage 2. I don't think the rules should reflect them being in trenches in the movie, this isn't a CCG. Unless maybe they have that tripod laser machine gun that would benefit from being braced against a wall or trench edge, in which case such a benefit should be about the weapon itself. Not the whole unit.

2 hours ago, FSD said:

naming inconsistencies

They won't be named "Echo" or "Hoth". Nothing else in the game has been thusly named so far. They'll be called "Rebel Garrison Troops" or something.

5 minutes ago, TauntaunScout said:

Being aesthetically repetitious with plastic models just to tweak non-corporeal rules (which can be accomplished with releasing new upgrade cards) is silly at this point

I think you may have misunderstood my point. I'm not saying to make new models to incorporate new rules. I'm saying that creating a new unit should fill a specific role that a faction currently lacks. Units should be unique from one another in more than just aesthetic, at least at this point in Legion's lifespan.

55 minutes ago, NeonWolf said:

I think you may have misunderstood my point. I'm not saying to make new models to incorporate new rules. I'm saying that creating a new unit should fill a specific role that a faction currently lacks. Units should be unique from one another in more than just aesthetic, at least at this point in Legion's lifespan.

That I can get on board with. (As long as it's corps 😋 )

3 minutes ago, TauntaunScout said:

That I can get on board with. (As long as it's corps 😋 )

I think that's something we can all agree on (for once)

48 minutes ago, thepopemobile100 said:

I think that's something we can all agree on (for once)

Oh no. If that happens they shut down the forum. Quick:

I want Duloks. They're canon and would fill a unique role.

13 minutes ago, TauntaunScout said:

Oh no. If that happens they shut down the forum. Quick:

I want Duloks. They're canon and would fill a unique role.

Shoot. He’s right!!

Uhhhhh... I want Noah and Teek as Operatives.

1 hour ago, FSD said:

Shoot. He’s right!!

Uhhhhh... I want Noah and Teek as Operatives.

Don't be silly. Max Reebo and Sly Snootles would make a much better operative pairing.

FFG, make this happen immediately!

Are we fighting enough yet?

I think ewoks should be brought into the game solely as a specialist style mini that provides extra morale to the unit to represent their canon use as therapy companions for veterans of the GCW following the Battle of Endor (brought into canon by Aftermath: Life Debt).

(That ought to do it.)

8 hours ago, Caimheul1313 said:

I think ewoks should be brought into the game solely as a specialist style mini that provides extra morale to the unit to represent their canon use as therapy companions for veterans of the GCW following the Battle of Endor (brought into canon by Aftermath: Life Debt).

(That ought to do it.)

Oh geez. Just when I forget why I stopped reading SW novels...

28 minutes ago, TauntaunScout said:

Oh geez. Just when I forget why I stopped reading SW novels...

It does make sense when you think about it.

IIRC, only ex-Rebels have therapy Ewoks. Most ex-Imperials have Ewok PTSD, meaning they would steer clear of any Ewok they saw. This would prevent the ex-Rebels from having there own PTSD attacks.

Just now, Indy_com said:

It does make sense when you think about it.

IIRC, only ex-Rebels have therapy Ewoks. Most ex-Imperials have Ewok PTSD, meaning they would steer clear of any Ewok they saw. This would prevent the ex-Rebels from having there own PTSD attacks.

What about the ewoks' PTSD? Do they think they have a therapy human or are they just companionship slaves?