Dam said:

She's a nun. She has an undying devotion to God, and there is no way she could be corrupted enough to attempt to help the ancient one trying to enter the world! ;-)

johnwatersfan said:

One God is as good as another God, no ? (good used relatively here)

I think it's pretty funny that the source image used for "Joining the Winning Team" is entitled, Wizard of Yog-Sothoth . For those outside the loop, Yog is the only AO immune to this mission!

Tibs said:

What was the final verdict on Yog vs Messenger? As in, could you use him to complete JtWT vs Yog?

Dam said:

I wouldn't allow it. Even tossing The Messanger, you're still in Lost in Time and Space, and therefore devoured . I don't think Yog's power kicks in when you merely become lost in time and space.

I have a relevant question—when you become lost in time and space, you lose your next turn. Does that mean that the first Upkeep that you're in Lost in Time and space, you can't pay your Joining the Winning Team sacrifice—don't you have to wait until the upkeep of the next turn, right before you return?

Tibs said:

I do the same or similar modifications to these three. Mandy is very similar, but even for her I only give a normal re-roll. You are too kind.

Wendy: Deputy rule is very thematic. In addition, I tie her elder sign to her automatic evade. Everyone who first played her thought that's how it worked anyway. After she dumps her elder sign, she becomes more normal.

Daisy: Again similar. Once per phase she can read a tome or cast a spell with one less sanity cost or loss. Also she no longer has the Livre. I give her Necronomicon instead. Now there's a book! Actually I don't see why she has the spell casting ability at all. Now we really need a tome reader who can do it while both chewing gum and carrying her books. In other words, with one less Movement cost and 1 less sanity cost. Then give her a random unique tome to begin with.

Dexter. Loses one random spell and he gets to choose one spell. The problem with this (and with real Daisy) is if some inexperienced person gets them. It's a real game slower.

Vincent: He can cure 1 Stamina to anyone in the same town he is in.

Amanda: Apparently she does better than most think she does. I'd probably just let her choose two skills from four (instead of 3) and the beginning.

Jim Culver: I let him demand a green otherworld encounter. Also, as long as he has his magic trumpet he gets +3 vs undead for both horror and combat. I've played him twice with these rules and he has yet to even meet an Undead.

Sister: I just let her keep her Blessing without rolling. I like the added complication mentioned earlier that that's only for her original blessing. However, everyone who's ever drawn her thinks this is too good so I let them pay a clue token if they want to.

Discussion question: Who are the most par investigators? That is, which ones were made just right?

Dam said:

Three :'D hee hee hee. And not alchemy, alchemies ;'D

Tibs said:

I guess those boxing lessons really paid off :')

Dam said:

AgrIAIACTHULHUFTHAGNd.

Avi_dreader said:

He was drunk.

Tibs said:

I believe that is how ColtsFan interprets it, though I'm too lazy to look up the relevant post.

Tibs said:

Yog-Sothoth's power...

"In addition, any investigator Lost in Time and Space is devoured."

The Messenger's ability...

"Discard The Messenger to avoid being devoured."

Base Rules pg. 17

"LOST IN TIME AND SPACE
Any investigator who is lost in time and space is imme-
diately moved to the Lost in Time and Space area of the
board. The investigator is now delayed , and the player
should place the investigator marker on its side. The
investigator l oses his next turn , remaining in the Lost in
Time and Space area. The player may only stand his
investigator marker back up during the Movement
Phase. On the following turn, at the start of the Upkeep
Phase , the player may move his investigator to any loca-
tion or street area of his choice in Arkham."

DW rules pg. 5

"However, for Missions, the investigator must additional-
ly discard or spend the listed sacrifice at each location at
the start of the Upkeep Phase ."

I would allow discarding "The Messenger" to avoid being devoured by Yog-Sothoth's power. Also looks like you have two things that happen at the same time at the start of the upkeep. One being return from LiTaS and the other Sacrificing the ally. So you could chose what order they happen. Further more it would be a epic task to get four allies and then being lucky enough to have The Messenger as one of the allies. My group has not even completed JtWT under normal circumstances.

MrsGamura said:

Yes, but does " any investigator Lost in Time and Space is devoured " mean:

"any investigator who is Lost in Time and Space..."

or

"any investigator who becomes lost in time and space..."

Is "Lost in Time and Space" primarily an action, or a status? This will determine whether or not The Messanger will save you from being devoured.

And since the Mythos card Missing People Return! reads:

"All investigators currently lost in time in space immediately return to Arkham..."

Then it must be a status, in which case The Messanger can not save you, because even after you discard him, you're still Lost in Time and Space , and therefore, dead.

Likewise, you could not discard The Messanger to prevent being devoured from running out of sanity and stamina at the same time, from reaching 0 maximum sanity or stamina, or from reaching 0 sanity or stamina during final combat, because there's no "OK so I'm not dead—what happens to me now" condition to fulfill.

How could being LiTaS be a action?

Yea its a status just like being in Arkham is a Status.

To me Yog's ability triggers only once at the time of being LiTaS and I'm sure this was the intent because at the time all investigators could only be devoured once.

So if Yog's ability just mean LiTaS status how would it work if your "Beloved of Bast" i.e. can't be devoured unless you allow it?

By LiTaS being an action, I mean that you get lost in time once, and then you spend your remaining time on the square. That is, the being Lost in Time in Space is a thing that happens, is prevented, then you wait out your time in limbo. I have shown that this not the case, and since LiTaS is a status, you are lost in time and space as long as you are—a one-time prevention of being devoured won't protect you for the entire continuum you're LiTaS.

As for Beloved of Bast, there are some ways of being devoured it cannot prevent:

0 maximum sanity or stamina
0 sanity and stamina simultaneously
0 sanity or stamina during final combat—though I don't remember if you lose this protection during final combat

In the above cases, what happens to you if you live? there's no precedent saying you gain 1 maximum back so you're not at 0. If you lose all of your sanity and stamina at the same time, you can't go to both the hospital and asylum at the same time. do you lose 2x the items? do you get back 1 sanity and stamina? Too complicated—you're just dead.

However, with Lost in Time and Space... I guess being Beloved of Bast does protect you. There's no reactive effect of being devoured for being Lost in Time and Space.

So if you're against Yog-Sothoth, and you are Beloved of Bast (and not Sister Mary), I guess it's possible to join Yog-Sothoth. What a strange consequence of cooperating forces. (Once again, Bast proves to be worse than useless )

I don't see the timing issue you are complaining about.

Turn 1 Other World Encounters Phase: Something happens, you are moved to Lost in Time and Space and Delayed.
Turn 2 Upkeep Phase: You stand up and do your Upkeep required stuff.
Turn 3 Upkeep Phase: You move to a location in Arkham of your choice.

dkw said:

You forgot to Yog Sothoth to this mix. Also, you can get LiTaS'd during Arkham Encounters and Mythos phase as well (IIRC). Additionally, regarding #2, don't think you do that:

"The investigator loses his next turn, remaining in the Lost in
Time and Space area." (p. 17)