Would 50 points be feasible? It closest resembles the scurrg but with a better dial and different slots. And the impression I get is that the scurrg is over-costed right now, right?
Would you say the crew that the infiltrator will get will out-weigh the turret of the scurrg? (assuming either ship pays a tax for the slots)
Furthermore, what do you think Maul will cost?
I'm expecting Maul at around 80. The most obvious comparisons would be Rey and Asajj, both with large bases and reasonably similar statlines. Maul lacks the turret, but seemingly gets some sort of cloaking device.
17 minutes ago, Prosk_019 said:Would 50 points be feasible? It closest resembles the scurrg but with a better dial and different slots.
Sith Infiltrator is a large base (distance from maneuver template nubs to side of base is to great for medium) so I don't think the Scurrg is a good comparison.
What we can gather from what is shown is that it has at least 1 Cannon Slot and 1 Torpedo Slot, possibly a device slot (the Dark Side Droid template), and a title slot or a configuration slot (base ship doesn't have the Cloak action, but article and token strongly imply it can get the ability to cloak). It has a really nice dial for a large base. I believe 50 pts for the I2 generic would be a bit low. 55-60 more likely, if not a little higher depending on how the ship specific upgrades are costed.
Maul being less than 80 is extremely unlikely, his ability is a force charge powered optional use blend of Bossk gunner and Bistan without the stress that Bossk gunner accrues. I'm thinking 85 at the minimum.
Edited by Hiemfire10 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:.
What we can gather from what is shown is that it has at least 1 Cannon Slot and 1 Torpedo Slot, possibly a device slot (the Dark Side Droid template), and a title slot or a configuration slot (base ship doesn't have the Cloak action, but article and token strongly imply it can get the ability to cloak). It has a really nice dial for a large base.
Maul being less than 80 is extremely unlikely, his ability is a force charge powered optional use blend of Bossk gunner and Bistan without the stress that Bossk gunner accrues. I'm thinking 85 at the minimum.
This is a good analysis. I also believe because of the above mentioned reasons it'll probably be between 78-82 right in that sweet spot. If it gains a Cloak ability as we assume then the ship becomes even stronger with the force ability attrached.
5 minutes ago, Cgriffith said:between 78-82
For the I2 or for Maul? 78 seems a bit steep to me for the I2. Not enough to render it completely useless, but steep.
1 minute ago, Hiemfire said:For the I2 or for Maul? 78 seems a bit steep to me for the I2. Not enough to render it completely useless, but steep.
Maul of course. My response was directly related to Darth Maul. I like your analysis of the ship and your assumption attached to Maul based on that given information.
1 minute ago, Cgriffith said:Maul of course. My response was directly related to Darth Maul. I like your analysis of the ship and your assumption attached to Maul based on that given information.
Okay, I can see that ballpark. I just prefer to lean towards more expensive at the moment until we get more info and see how and/or if He'll work in a CIS squad as a synergistic piece or a fat finisher.
Just now, Hiemfire said:Okay, I can see that ballpark. I just prefer to lean towards more expensive at the moment until we get more info and see how and/or if He'll work in a CIS squad as a synergistic piece or a fat finisher.
I want to see what type of "Cloak" mechanism it receives; does the cloak give the normal cloak rules or for in this instance (being a large base) do for large base ships that changes, how much is the upgrade, do you lose any slots because of equipping it. As for Maul., his ability is good and he's a force user. Definetley interesting how he works when we get all the information. Him and some vulture droids could be a very interesting list.
Maul will probably be the only force user interested in hate atm, since his ability will devour the charges, even more so if he is ferrying Dooku. So whatever I5 3F gets you (presumably a lot of points), staple 3 more points to that, just as one sees Vader's base cost as 82 and not 70.
4 minutes ago, Cgriffith said:I want to see what type of "Cloak" mechanism it receives; does the cloak give the normal cloak rules or for in this instance (being a large base) do for large base ships that changes, how much is the upgrade, do you lose any slots because of equipping it. As for Maul., his ability is good and he's a force user. Definetley interesting how he works when we get all the information. Him and some vulture droids could be a very interesting list.
Large bases follow the same cloaking/decloaking rules as medium bases. It's in the Cloak section of the Rule Ref.
14 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:Large bases follow the same cloaking/decloaking rules as medium bases. It's in the Cloak section of the Rule Ref.
Oh that makes it, on Maul scarier
18 minutes ago, player3010587 said:Maul will probably be the only force user interested in hate atm, since his ability will devour the charges, even more so if he is ferrying Dooku. So whatever I5 3F gets you (presumably a lot of points), staple 3 more points to that, just as one sees Vader's base cost as 82 and not 70.
Hate Ventriss + Maul crew might also show up, would make a good tanky setup piece for a Lando's Falcon.
Crap I forgot about base sizes.
As for price, is there any reason why the cloak title/config couldn't eat some of the cost to make the base chassis cheaper?
Edit: Also, comparing him to Rey, I'd wager he's a fair bit cheaper than her. Considering that she's tankier, has access to white boost and a bowtie primary. (This is of course assuming that the price of being able to cloak comes with the title/config itself)
Edited by Prosk_019Infiltrator (Maul specifically) is closest to Dengar, probably? Large base, (effectively) both forward primary ships with a double tap.
Infiltrator has +1 shield but -1 agility, so it's a bit less tanky. Same action bar (rotates aside). Better dial (white 2 and 3 hards; is an ambiturner). Three force charges, and ability is... arguably a bit better? Close to a wash?
Dengar+Title is 72, and seems to be considered overpriced, so if Maul used charges instead of force he'd probably be in the 60s? Add in the force, and he's in the 70s somewhere?
Rey at 80 points has a better statline, for one less force charge and no 1-hards. Bowtie and boost are really strong, so even at 3 force with in-built shooting efficiency, it's hard to see him costing as much or more than Rey.
If maul is hitting 80 points something may have gone wrong. Asajj is 84 and one of the most overpriced ships in the game. Maul should be mid 70s at most.
23 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:If maul is hitting 80 points something may have gone wrong. Asajj is 84 and one of the most overpriced ships in the game. Maul should be mid 70s at most.
Maul is +1I, +1 force, a better ability, better upgrade bar, repositioning and presumably better access to force talents as well as cloaking, though. He should clearly be more expensive than Ventress, but I agree she could stand to drop a few points.
He should be more than a correctly priced Asajj sure. But a correctly priced Asajj probably falls somewhere in the low 70s unless they offer a better range of stress gaining options to make use of that dial.
38 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:He should be more than a correctly priced Asajj sure. But a correctly priced Asajj probably falls somewhere in the low 70s unless they offer a better range of stress gaining options to make use of that dial.
Yeah, that's the thing. The Lancer pays a premium for an amazing dial, but only has a single red maneuver and no linked actions. There's no gunner slot, they've removed the mod (which would likely be a config i 2.0), illicits in general are subpar, and barely any of the force talents work on her. Fix a couple of those things, and Ventress' cost of 84 would make more sense. Right now she's just a bad Scum Rey.
Ketsu isn't useless though. Just throw on Predator, 0-0-0 and the title and ram into things.
$39.99
This is a very hard ship to gauge cost on. Maul has a strong ability and 3 force tokens which looks quite good with Hate, but the base chassis itself without a cloak is just.. eh.
With a cloak and collision detector (sensor slot seems like highly likely for an advanced prototype ship) the chassis becomes much better.
I think this may end up being like the HWK in that its a below average base chassis and therefore relatively cheap, with a strong but quite expensive title card to bump up its power level.
14 hours ago, BVRCH said:I think this may end up being like the HWK in that its a below average base chassis and therefore relatively cheap, with a strong but quite expensive title card to bump up its power level.
Dude I hope you're right. I like to think of this ship as a sort of swiss army knife between the cloaking, crew and the dark eye drone things.
As for a sensor slot, I wouldn't blame them if they decided to go a bit conservative with it; collision detector on the first large base ship with a proper cloaking feature could get out of hand in my mind. Adv. sensors with that red b-roll is a whole other beast.
Though again, makes it a better swiss army knife so I'm all for it
1 hour ago, Prosk_019 said:Dude I hope you're right. I like to think of this ship as a sort of swiss army knife between the cloaking, crew and the dark eye drone things.
As for a sensor slot, I wouldn't blame them if they decided to go a bit conservative with it; collision detector on the first large base ship with a proper cloaking feature could get out of hand in my mind. Adv. sensors with that red b-roll is a whole other beast.
Though again, makes it a better swiss army knife so I'm all for it
Yeah I think they'll do something similar to what they did with the Delta-7B title, in that it changes the whole dynamic of the ship with that config.
Cloak and Collision Detector on a small ship is an extremely powerful combo I agree. On a large base where decloaking is just a normal barrel roll or boost, its not such a big deal. Advanced sensors would actually really help this single fixed arc large base get around so I don't see that as bad or OP. It will be a factor in its costing though, and you're right in that they may choose to be little more conservative to start off.
Edited by BVRCHThat's why I'm so hyped for the ship and faction. Even the worst case scenario where they try to reel it in as much as possible, we'll still get unique and original concepts in the game. There's only so much that over-pricing will do to keep the mechanics from being fun
18 hours ago, BVRCH said:This is a very hard ship to gauge cost on. Maul has a strong ability and 3 force tokens which looks quite good with Hate, but the base chassis itself without a cloak is just.. eh.
With a cloak and collision detector (sensor slot seems like highly likely for an advanced prototype ship) the chassis becomes much better.
I think this may end up being like the HWK in that its a below average base chassis and therefore relatively cheap, with a strong but quite expensive title card to bump up its power level.
I understand it's a prototype etc, but I don't we'll see a lot of system slots for the prequel era much like how tech slots don't really exist outside of the sequel era. I could be wrong, but it would make sense a way to distinguish the (admittedly slow) advance of technology across eras.