First quarter Reviews

By Ronu, in X-Wing

So wanted to review the factions at least from my perspective. I know other have thoughts and opinions and results vary. This might be wordy so hang in there.

Imperials:

As little as people may be surprised here it’s the Empire who has come out of the gate swinging in this new edition. The biggest thing with the Empire is really a true three prong attack:

  1. Versatility : There isn’t one play style to the Empire. You can change them to fit your preferred flying style. Strait swarms, assisted swarms with a command shuttle (ala Sloan), Aces, alpha strikes, heavy ordinance. Pick what you like and go.
  2. Defined Roles : With each ship having a specialized role, the Empire ships are not only efficient but self sufficient and simply improve with coordinate options.
  3. Known play style : This might surprise some or just be something not thought about. With the Exception of the Decimator very little has changed for ships from the Empire. So everything looks and feels similar to what it was in 1.0. A few mechanics here and there but overall those are easy to adjust to and then solve quickly due to that familiarity. Unlike Rebels or Scum who had numbers of turrets or ships that simply had limited options or key tricks which are now absent.

Empire ships can still be fragile, and frustrating if not flown decently. Though they do seem to have more and more tools now then previous to mitigate those deficiencies.

Scum:

Where the Empire changed the least Scum might have changed the most. I haven’t seen Scum on tables much here locally. What I have seen has been interesting. Where they were dominated by their large base ships, it’s the new medium bases that seem to be key ships for Scum. Both the IG’s and Firespray are not only solid but able to be Maneuverable enough to be impactful. Palob is still up to his old tricks and if you get the Moldy Crow Title on him he’s a good bit scarier though he is still a target but the improved HWK, makes him a bit more versatile. The large base ships are suffering from sticker shock (point cost) and crew, and upgrade option withdrawals. Gone are the K4’s, multi dice turrets, the ability to load up in such a way they can almost solo a list themselves let alone add a wingman who is similarly built. Outside of the Jumpmaster which took a huge change, the large scum ships are fine, they just need a change in perception or practices as previously used tactics and action efficiency is gone, and seem to have some of the largest learning curves.

Rebels:

Overall Rebels go the most improved ships. The problem they currently face is for all the improvements they have very little variance from ship to ship. Take the X-Wing, E-Wing, Arc-170, and Y-Wings. All have similar stats, can take similar upgrades, and effectively want to do the same mission in a similar way. Similar things happen with the Z-95 and A-wings. Even the YT’s are so similar and cost so similarly that neither stands out. This lack of defined roles has the opposite effect of what the Empire currently enjoys. While the Empire can be built to suite, Rebels feel more of a reduced to a common denominator. Costing is not helping as they don’t have enough separation. However, changing cost would simply make something a preferred option rather than separate all the jack-of-all-trades most ships currently show. The biggest thing that may define the ships are the upgrades they are allowed to take, and as more options come available saying a ship can take it but not another will help define the roles a bit better. The other thing Rebels are suffering from is lack of support ships. The U-wing is fantastic but almost desperately needs a Tactical Officer stapled to it, limiting what else to bring with them. The HWK, which is vastly improved, is still not seeing play (locally), as it doesn’t do a ton in a supporting role. The Rebels are not in a Sky is falling mode. They are a product of their own design and have to be flown with a lot of skill. They do a little bit of everything, but are masters of nothing.

Imperials - Redline: The Faction. Maybe little more than half a dozen good pilots but the good ones are very good.

Scum - Loads of strong ships, easily the top faction at present. Palob, 4-LOM, Kavil, Jakku, Han, Boba, Guri, Fenn... it's a long list of perfectly good ships & pilots.

Rebels - utterly gutted as a faction, T-65s are almost all they have left.

1 hour ago, SOTL said:

Imperials - Redline: The Faction. Maybe little more than half a dozen good pilots but the good ones are very good.

Scum - Loads of strong ships, easily the top faction at present. Palob, 4-LOM, Kavil, Jakku, Han, Boba, Guri, Fenn... it's a long list of perfectly good ships & pilots.

Rebels - utterly gutted as a faction, T-65s are almost all they have left.

Rebels are just no longer the TLT faction, they will spring back as soon as their players relearn to fly... shots fired ;)!

Imperial and Scum are about even from what I've seen- both have very strong pilots and ships, each faction has its own identity. Rebels, have a couple of decent pilots and ships, but have had the worst run of 2.0 luck due to the removal of unlimited shield regens and a lack of stellar upgrades.

Imperial- Aside from Punishers/Bombers, this is still the agile faction with a couple of good pocket aces like Soontir and Duchess. Three main playstyles dominate the scene;

A. 4-5 ship lists with Bombers/Punishers set up with barrage rockets/proton torpedoes and a support ship (Jendon or Jonus)

B. 3-4 ships lists that are Ace-heavy (Darth Vader, Whisper, Soontir) and highly maneuverable but fragile

C. A combo of A and B- 2 Aces like Whisper and Soontir with a heavy like Redline

Scum- Sneaky tricks faction, uses Palob and 4LOM to mess with the opponent while Guri and Boba shoot them down.

A. No real set lists, but Boba, Fenn, Palob, Guri, 4LOM, and Kavil are all strong pilots that are in top lists.

Rebels- Having a tough time in 2.0, but still have some good pilots and ships

A. Luke Skywalker and Wedge are constant favorites, with Sabine, Jan Ors, and a few others seeing constant play.

Imperials, what 2.0 should be, nice buffs to all of the classic ships, everything feels unique fun to fly. Swarms are possible, Aces can reign supreme, even the Decimator is easily the best of the large-based ships as its core stats didn't change and it only had to swap to he dual turret. Great to see Lambda's and excellent commanders. All in all a great faction doing lots of things and doing them well.

Scum, lots of cheap tricks and pilots that all still dominate the list of unique pilots with tons of different useful abilities, easily tied for first or just behind the Empire.

Rebel, ......... well X-wings are good again..... Y-Wings are alright.... U-Wings aren't bad..... oh man the rest of the faction though. I agree most of their ships sort of blend together for being similar platforms, with their key 1.0 ships being now the worst in the entire game. K-wings can't do bombing as well as their Empire and Scum counterparts. Fenn Rau has surprisingly remained the same but costed into "you have to be joking" territory alongside Luke gunner. The Ghost/Phantoms lost everything and then some to be crowned as single-handedly the most expensive and worst ship in the game at the moment. All in all fly Rogue One/A New Hope Ships or avoid this faction like the plague.

Rebels: you are underestimating the power of Jake Farrel

Maybe Wave IV will give Rebels Dak Ralter. He'll cost 200 points, but he'll be able to take on the whole Empire himself.

5 hours ago, SOTL said:

Imperials - Redline: The Faction. Maybe little more than half a dozen good pilots but the good ones are very good.

While I like Imperials right now, personaly I can't make redline work for me.

Everyone says he is the best, but for me he is meh. My redline games have all been the weakest my only second edition loss was while playing with redline. Give me a tie v1 any day over redline.

6 hours ago, Ronu said:

So wanted to review the factions at least from my perspective. I know other have thoughts and opinions and results vary. This might be wordy so hang in there.

Imperials:

As little as people may be surprised here it’s the Empire who has come out of the gate swinging in this new edition. The biggest thing with the Empire is really a true three prong attack:

  1. Versatility : There isn’t one play style to the Empire. You can change them to fit your preferred flying style. Strait swarms, assisted swarms with a command shuttle (ala Sloan), Aces, alpha strikes, heavy ordinance. Pick what you like and go.
  2. Defined Roles : With each ship having a specialized role, the Empire ships are not only efficient but self sufficient and simply improve with coordinate options.
  3. Known play style : This might surprise some or just be something not thought about. With the Exception of the Decimator very little has changed for ships from the Empire. So everything looks and feels similar to what it was in 1.0. A few mechanics here and there but overall those are easy to adjust to and then solve quickly due to that familiarity. Unlike Rebels or Scum who had numbers of turrets or ships that simply had limited options or key tricks which are now absent.

Empire ships can still be fragile, and frustrating if not flown decently. Though they do seem to have more and more tools now then previous to mitigate those deficiencies.

Scum:

Where the Empire changed the least Scum might have changed the most. I haven’t seen Scum on tables much here locally. What I have seen has been interesting. Where they were dominated by their large base ships, it’s the new medium bases that seem to be key ships for Scum. Both the IG’s and Firespray are not only solid but able to be Maneuverable enough to be impactful. Palob is still up to his old tricks and if you get the Moldy Crow Title on him he’s a good bit scarier though he is still a target but the improved HWK, makes him a bit more versatile. The large base ships are suffering from sticker shock (point cost) and crew, and upgrade option withdrawals. Gone are the K4’s, multi dice turrets, the ability to load up in such a way they can almost solo a list themselves let alone add a wingman who is similarly built. Outside of the Jumpmaster which took a huge change, the large scum ships are fine, they just need a change in perception or practices as previously used tactics and action efficiency is gone, and seem to have some of the largest learning curves.

Rebels:

Overall Rebels go the most improved ships. The problem they currently face is for all the improvements they have very little variance from ship to ship. Take the X-Wing, E-Wing, Arc-170, and Y-Wings. All have similar stats, can take similar upgrades, and effectively want to do the same mission in a similar way. Similar things happen with the Z-95 and A-wings. Even the YT’s are so similar and cost so similarly that neither stands out. This lack of defined roles has the opposite effect of what the Empire currently enjoys. While the Empire can be built to suite, Rebels feel more of a reduced to a common denominator. Costing is not helping as they don’t have enough separation. However, changing cost would simply make something a preferred option rather than separate all the jack-of-all-trades most ships currently show. The biggest thing that may define the ships are the upgrades they are allowed to take, and as more options come available saying a ship can take it but not another will help define the roles a bit better. The other thing Rebels are suffering from is lack of support ships. The U-wing is fantastic but almost desperately needs a Tactical Officer stapled to it, limiting what else to bring with them. The HWK, which is vastly improved, is still not seeing play (locally), as it doesn’t do a ton in a supporting role. The Rebels are not in a Sky is falling mode. They are a product of their own design and have to be flown with a lot of skill. They do a little bit of everything, but are masters of nothing.

One ship you left out for Scum is the Falcon. I haven't played one or even against one, but it's a great value. Also, scum seems to have the most calculate shenanigans and stress control going for it. There's even the potential for major control lists using ion weapons with Scum. They have diversity, but it all really revolves around tricks, which is what Scum should be.

Regarding Rebs, yeah, their ships are sort of omni-ships. They can do everything , but nothing well, and there's a lot of fine tuning you can do to specialize them, but that hasn't really been picked up on yet. There's been an aversion to buying upgrades - I wonder if a liberal addition of astromechs and modifications might make some Rebel ships more appealing and we simply haven't found the right combos yet to extract every ounce of potential from the ships that seem lacking. Though, frankly, I love my X-wings and A-wings and the rest of the faction can go fly a kite. 😛

1 hour ago, JJ48 said:

Maybe Wave IV will give Rebels Dak Ralter. He'll cost 200 points, but he'll be able to take on the whole Empire himself.

He's SO screwed vs Scum though...

6 hours ago, SOTL said:

Imperials - Redline: The Faction. Maybe little more than half a dozen good pilots but the good ones are very good.

Scum - Loads of strong ships, easily the top faction at present. Palob, 4-LOM, Kavil, Jakku, Han, Boba, Guri, Fenn... it's a long list of perfectly good ships & pilots.

Rebels - utterly gutted as a faction, T-65s are almost all they have left.

SOTL, while I cannot say the response surprises me. It does seem very narrow and short sighted. Perhaps your local stuff is seeing lots of Redline, but certainly not the definition or the Empire at large. Also I wouldn’t say Rebels are gutted in any way. They are certainly taking the most time to readjust to that I would agree.

Well, take a look at the results from any of the big events.

Rebels are the large ship crew faction. Once good crew comes out, they will be a terror. So many ships are just lying in wait: Auzitucks, VCX, Falcons, YT2400s, Uwings, on and on. Once good crew can give them passive mods, and better force abilities instead of Ezra garbage and more in line with Vader and 7th Sister then the non-Xwing ships will come out of hiding.

1 hour ago, wurms said:

Rebels are the large ship crew faction. Once good crew comes out [...]

"Are" implies present tense. Currently rebels have the worse crew by a significant margin.

2 hours ago, SOTL said:

Well, take a look at the results from any of the big events.

What, the four or five we've had?

Where Rebels won one?

And one had forced card selection that skewed the results?

Is that your sample size?

3 hours ago, SOTL said:

Well, take a look at the results from any of the big events.

Nordics, 112 participants, Rebels won.

Dutch Nationals, Rebels took second in a tight game, 75 ish participants.

Rebels is certainly in the worst position of the three factions right now, no argument from me, but some rebel lists/players are making headway.

1 hour ago, prauxim said:

"Are" implies present tense. Currently rebels have the worse crew by a significant margin.

With cost reductions the Rebel crew will be pretty useful, they're just not worth the points right now.

7 minutes ago, GuacCousteau said:

What, the four or five we've had?

Where Rebels won one?

And one had forced card selection that skewed the results?

Is that your sample size?

Nerfherder
Mynock
Nordics
Crossroads
Spanish Nats
Gold Squadron

6 off the top of my head excluding Coruscant, and I may be missing 1 or 2?

13 hours ago, SOTL said:

Imperials - Redline: The Faction. Maybe little more than half a dozen good pilots but the good ones are very good.

Scum - Loads of strong ships, easily the top faction at present. Palob, 4-LOM, Kavil, Jakku, Han, Boba, Guri, Fenn... it's a long list of perfectly good ships & pilots.

Rebels - utterly gutted as a faction, T-65s are almost all they have left.

Hey! I enjoy punishers actually being good! But in all seriousness, there is a lot of good stuff in empire that is not Redline. And unlike the other factions, they are mobile enough to offer a large window to counterplay him. That or the likes of their tanks can roll up to him whilst the flankers tear him up.

9 hours ago, Redblock said:

Rebels: you are underestimating the power of Jake Farrel

How so? I've tried Jake a few times; I FULLY accept that I may just being flying horribly, but I just don't know what I should be doing with him. He feels so far removed from his first edition splendor, and I feel as though the general feedback is that Rebel A-wings are "meh".

I say this as an ardent fan of flying a first edition Garven, Kyle, and Jake focus synergy list.

15 hours ago, Ronu said:

Gone are the K4’s, multi dice turrets, the ability to load up in such a way they can almost solo a list themselves let alone add a wingman who is similarly built.

The scum large ships are no longer fearsome, but everything in this sentence is still alive and strong on ships like palob and kavil.

15 hours ago, Ronu said:

Overall Rebels go the most improved ships

Rebel ships might have improved from 1.0 (certainly the U-Wing is much more interesting now) but the faction as a whole is very much on the back foot. As you say, all their ships feel very same-ish and they don't have many tricks to stand out from the crowd. Their core faction identity feels very weak - while imperials have agile ships and scum have dastardly tricks, the rebels have ...ships with more shields and some mediocre fat turrets? If I had to pick one "rebel" mechanic it would probably be damage mitigation/sharing, but spending points sets rebels far behind the highly efficient ships available in other factions.

1 minute ago, gadwag said:

If I had to pick one "rebel" mechanic it would probably be damage mitigation/sharing

That is exactly what the Rebel mechanic is, keeping as many of their guns on the table as long as they can by spreading out the damage.

Just had a thought....

Although the Rebel’s faction indentity is supposed to be focused on defense and cooperation, they are oddly very vulnerable to token disruption. FFG should double down on the defense mantra and give the Rebels a way to protect their tokens from being taken away, or at the very least make the opponent pay for doing so. This would also make the faction more distinct from the others.

Edited by Wraithdt
1 hour ago, Hiemfire said:

That is exactly what the Rebel mechanic is, keeping as many of their guns on the table as long as they can by spreading out the damage.

It's either that or fat turrets.

Unfortunately, the enemy offensive options are so efficient and powerful that a rebel damage mitigation build is just not efficient enough to win. That's not the worst, I guess, since damage mitigation is a bit boring, but it would be nice if rebels on the table had a defining trait.