As the title says. The 2.0 Core set should have been a Clone Wars core set right from the beginning.

FFG knew they had Clone Wars in the pipeline, they just decided to have old players buy an unnecessary 2.0 core set just for the damage deck. This would have been avoided entirely if the core set was made around Clone Wars ships. FFG has a knack for double dipping our wallets.

Before anyone answers "nobody is forcing you to buy", I only want to say "you are correct". I haven't bough any 2.0 content and will not do so. I'm keeping 1.0 and spending my gaming dollar on other games. FFG just keeps giving me more reasons to go somewhere else.

Two problems with that:

A: the game it called "X-Wing"

B: a lot of people hate the clown wars.

[sigh] Aren't people tired of crying about 2.0 yet?

It's already here, they aren't going backwards.

If you're doing something else, why are you here?

Go on, git!

1 hour ago, player3137305 said:

FFG just keeps giving me more reasons to go somewhere else.

So go somewhere else then.

Literally no one here cares in the slightest about people who are only here to moan.

I am somewhere else already. I just love to see people moaning about me moaning.

1 hour ago, player3137305 said:

As the title says. The 2.0 Core set should have been a Clone Wars core set right from the beginning.

FFG knew they had Clone Wars in the pipeline, they just decided to have old players buy an unnecessary 2.0 core set just for the damage deck. This would have been avoided entirely if the core set was made around Clone Wars ships. FFG has a knack for double dipping our wallets.

Before anyone answers "nobody is forcing you to buy", I only want to say "you are correct". I haven't bough any 2.0 content and will not do so. I'm keeping 1.0 and spending my gaming dollar on other games. FFG just keeps giving me more reasons to go somewhere else.

Then we would have had posts that were. "why is the new core set clone wars? now I have to buy 2x factions I don't want just to get a damage deck and movement templates"

We already get this from scum only players....

Let me put it to you simple. There is no way to make everyone happy.

Not sure why you are complaining... you said you are done and not spending money stopped at 2.0's release whats your vested interest to come here and complain about something you have now stated does not even effect you?

I wouldn’t have said no to a core, but I’ll take all the ships being in one faction without the damage deck or templates, instead. Yes please ❤️

3 minutes ago, player3137305 said:

I am somewhere else already. I just love to see people moaning about me moaning.

So you are just trolling...

Have to try and stomp on other peoples excitement for the new content just to get your rocks off?

I think Disney told X Wing to add Clone Wars right when they were planning 2.0 and that was why the roll out has been choppy.

6 minutes ago, Shockley said:

I think Disney told X Wing to add Clone Wars right when they were planning 2.0 and that was why the roll out has been choppy.

probably this combined with a few other factors

My guess would be overwhelming with product is a bad idea from a financial perspective, they wanted the release to be about the conversion kits not new factions. it would have been a bad idea to hit with the conversion kits and the new factions as peoples wallets could not take it. Would have been even worse to lead with clone wars and have 2.0 conversions come latter would have been some very pissed people.

You guys bring some good points about the 2.0 core set having to be from the original ships. How about this though:

FFG has not convinced me to get onboard 2.0. Having released a second 2.0 core set, that is a Clone Wars Core Set would very likely have brought me over. As is, FFG has lost a customer.

Also, why am I still here? Because I do own 1.0 and enjoy it. This forum is not for 2.0 only.

18 minutes ago, player3137305 said:

You guys bring some good points about the 2.0 core set having to be from the original ships. How about this though:

FFG has not convinced me to get onboard 2.0. Having released a second 2.0 core set, that is a Clone Wars Core Set would very likely have brought me over. As is, FFG has lost a customer.

Also, why am I still here? Because I do own 1.0 and enjoy it. This forum is not for 2.0 only.

You posted about second edition not about first....

This would have been a great Wave 3 product structure for me :

Clone Wars Core Set: 2x Vulture + 1x Delta 7

Separatists Expansions: Vulture (second paint), Belbullab-22 and Sith Infiltrator

Republic Expansions: Delta 7 (second paint), V-19 Torrent, ARC-170

It has exactly the same ships and the same paints, but it is more welcoming wave 3 structure for the player wanting to get into 2.0.

My 2 cents. I don't want to get into a pissing contest with the folks around here.

Personally, I don't quite agree.

• Rename "Core Set" into "Beginner Game" and it probably stays X-Wing and TIEs. That's the most iconic set of ships. The Beginner Game, while marketed to new players, isn't pitched as much as the start of a collection, since for 5 of the 7 factions, it's $40 for three ships you'll never use. However, there would be better support for objective play, missions, escalation, and so forth. It's marketed to folks buying the game at Target or Walmart, rather than the FLGS. This is the "I don't really want to get into a miniatures game, but I want to go pew pew with space ships" box.
• Add an "Essentials Kit" which is the damage deck, dice, range ruler, movement templates, maybe a few basic tokens. MRSP $20.
• The new path into the game for most players is an Essentials Kit, and their choice of $40 Squadron Pack.
  • Imperials are two TIE Fighters and a TIE Advanced x1, Vader's trench run.
  • Rebels would be XXY or XYY.
  • So on and so forth.
  • Each would be a much closer entry into standard X-Wing 200/6 play, and while each kit probably doesn't have a worthwhile 200 point list, it'd probably have an 8-threat build associated. Add one more expansion to that, and a new player would probably have something they could play against established players.
    • Lots of other games have pretty similar starter kits.
    • Warhammer Start Collecting [faction] is a leader model, a basic infantry unit, and one extra thing (a few elite commandos, a vehicle, etc)
    • Hordes/Warmachine Battleboxes have a Warlock or Warcaster (the leader), a Heavy Jack/Warbeast, and two Light Jacks/Beasts.
    • Guildball sells faction starter kits.
  • X-Wing hasn't done this, at last not until 2e Wave 3.
    • The Aces and Veterans packs... weren't quite like this. They had upgrades and pilots which kind of presumed you already had the original expansions--indeed a lot of "fix" cards for ships which weren't good. A lot of standard go-to cards got left out.

Seeing what we've seen so far, if they put me in charge, that's where I would have gone with it.

If there was a hypothetical "Essentials Kit", the Clone Wars era Squadron Packs would be such a great way for new players to get into the game. Pick whatever appeals to you aesthetically and thematically, then go. But the Core set requiring someone to buy an X-Wing and two TIEs adds a good deal of cost that most new players don't need to spend. Even if someone is flying Imperials, the two TIEs are often going to be Storage Fodder.

//

There is an appeal to a Clone Wars Core Set, in that it lets a converting player buy the new Core, without having to rebuy the TIEs and X-Wing. That much would have been nice, but I think there would have been a better, more thought-out way to go where the Core Set is essentially optional.

@theBitterFig thanks for the very well-thought comment. I think you hit the nail. Your approach most certainly would have been the best.

Your scenario BitterFig does sound like probably the best from the consumer perspective. However it sounds like a nightmare from both FFG's and retailer's perspectives. They're already making (and asking stores to stock) a very large number of different products quickly, your suggestion replaces one product, the Core Set, with four: Beginner Game, Essentials Pack, Rebel and Imperial Squadron Packs. That's a lot more to make, ship and stock, a lot harder for stores to figure out how many of each they need (instead of just roughly: 1 existing or potential new player = 1 core), and more potentially confusing for people getting into the game.

2 hours ago, rawbean said:

Your scenario BitterFig does sound like probably the best from the consumer perspective. However it sounds like a nightmare from both FFG's and retailer's perspectives. They're already making (and asking stores to stock) a very large number of different products quickly, your suggestion replaces one product, the Core Set, with four: Beginner Game, Essentials Pack, Rebel and Imperial Squadron Packs. That's a lot more to make, ship and stock, a lot harder for stores to figure out how many of each they need (instead of just roughly: 1 existing or potential new player = 1 core), and more potentially confusing for people getting into the game.

The thing is: it's like how most other games do factions. This is how Warhammer 40k and Age of Sigmar do it. How Guildball does it. How Warmachine/Hordes does it. There exist giant boxed games for two players, but most folks starting out will grab a single-faction intro box.

I get what your saying about some of the retailer aspects (really wasn't something I'd thought about), but it really don't think it would be harder for a new player to get into the game. Right now, new players are essentially in the wilderness. Sure, a Core Set, but what next? Squadron Packs for each faction would be a great way for a new player get into decent squadrons.

incorrect,

1.) **** wasn't ready

2.) game is called x-wing

3.) there can be more than one core...and there really oughta be (one per era)

There should be one core set per era + a scum. Allowing players to start with whatever faction they want.

3 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

3.) there can be more than one core...and there really oughta be (one per era)

That this isn't the case is baffling.

I can't believe the opportunity FFG missed.

Putting the unique Red 5 repaint in the OT core was a genius move, and could have easily been replicated in the other eras. It would have been the perfect excuse to put Black One in the ST core set and leave the standalone T-70 the standard blue. It would have let them split the 9 named pilots across the standalone and the core without people moaning too much (nobody ever really moaned about the T-65's named pilots being split), which would have left more room for upgrades in the T-70.

People would have bought ST core sets even when they already had the OT one just as a cheaper way to get multiple ships (I know people who bought a second or even third 1e OT core set to build up their TIE Swarm more cheaply, that it also gave them a squad of four X-Wings with the standalone was a bonus).

It also lines up perfectly with the PT. Put Anakin's unique paint job in the core with a pair of Vulture droids and then make an executive decision on whether the Vultures get the Ep1 or Ep3 paint job. The 'standard' Obi-Wan Delta-7 is the standalone. Similar pilot split to the squadron pack.

Again, people don't mind buying extra core sets (too much) because it's usually a good deal for the ship count so you're not cutting off the veteran market and you're making it way easier for anyone who wants to get into the game to pick their faction.

The squadron packs are still a cool idea, and FFG could still have done them alongside. Just give the Sep pack whichever Vulture paint isn't in the core, and make the standalone match the core. May as well give the Rep pack Plo Koon's Delta-7 as there's so many variations.

I think FFG went halfway with these "squadron packs" which are basically like warmachine battle-boxes...

issue is they do NOT contain the pieces you need to play X-wing (templates)...so that's a little scummy

12 hours ago, player3137305 said:

My 2 cents. I don't want to get into a pissing contest with the folks around here.

Doesn't want to get in pissing contest but also admits he came here to troll.

....k

The problem with a Clone Wars Core Set is that existing players may not want to buy another core just to get the pilots/upgrades from it.

It's a dammed if you do/dammed if you don't situation.

To me, the best choice would be to have an "accessories pack" with rules, damage deck, dice and tokens, and no ships or pilots. BUT I don't think it's a wise business decision.

2 minutes ago, DerRitter said:

The problem with a Clone Wars Core Set is that existing players may not want to buy another core just to get the pilots/upgrades from it.

I think the 1e ST core set shows that they would.

And as I said earlier, people buy multiple core sets as cheap squad filler. Buying three core sets and two standalones, or two standalones, two core sets and a gozanti to get an 8 TIE Fighter swarm with all possible pilots was not unheard of.

For new players a second core set is advisable anyway, as it gets you a more reasonable number of dice, spare templates and damage decks so you can give newbies a game with both players having full kit, more obstacle tokens so you can customise exactly what you bring for each list a little more and an extra range ruler that you can cut down into range 1 and range 2 lengths (super useful - hence why all the acrylic template sets come with them). Plus it does all that while giving you more ships.

14 hours ago, player3137305 said:

I am somewhere else already. I just love to see people moaning about me moaning.

That's a really crappy, sad way to get your kicks. Entertain yourself in a more constructive way.