Need a starter set- depends. I personally only needed the damage deck and various general upgrade cards/tokens from the starter set (got the Scum and Imperial conversion kits, and had acrylic templates ordered).

The business end of the game probably dictated the choice to do a new starter set and conversion kits only, rather than adding in some sort of 2.0 battle-box style set. This is a business out to make money after all, and having to purchase a starter set in addition to conversion sets makes more business-sense for FFG/Asmodee. If they had placed templates, more tokens, all the generic upgrade cards, and damage decks from the starter set in the conversion sets (as a battlebox) you would probably be looking at another $20 easy- and then we would get complaints from those who had to purchase multiple conversion kits about the price being too high because of the duplicate items just mentioned. So I can see how not adding in those components and just keeping them in a starter set that they would have had to produce anyway, due to new players, was simply the easiest way of doing things for FFG because they would most likely get the same amount of griping anyway.

58 minutes ago, yodellingyoda said:

While the idea of an Essentials Kit would be very useful for 1.0 players and single-faction collectors alike, there is still a great purpose for the Core Set. I bought the original Core Set with the knowledge that although I couldn't go to tournaments straight away, I wouldn't go to tournaments straight away. Who would do that? All three Core Sets serve the basic function of a board game. You can't play 100/200-point games, for sure, but you can play games, at least. And then, of course, new players will rarely know what faction they want to collect before they start playing, so although the Core Set only includes 2 of the 7, it's a reasonable introduction. An Essentials Kit, on the other hand, would literally only be a bunch of stuff you get in the Core Set for much cheaper. So from a player's perspective, an Essentials Kit and a Core Set would both serve their own important uses, but from a marketing perspective, there's no actual need for an Essentials Kit. It's redundant and its only result is to have players spend less money, which is hardly want Fantasy Flight want.

Hrm. I don't want the core set to exist anymore, but I see where you're coming from.

Rename it a "two player beginner game." The "beginner game" wouldn't have the same connotation as "core set" in the I-Need-This-To-Play sense, which would be good. However, it'd attempt to do more to present a compelling experience out of the box alone. The Escalation format (however that works, I've never looked at the rules for it...). Perhaps bring back some of the missions.

The core set is only a great deal if you actually want TIE Fighters and an X-Wing. It's a crappy deal if the only faction you're interested in one of the other five expansions. And that's always been the case. I got into X-Wing sometime around wave 8. For ages, the only thing I used out of my original Core Set was R2-D2. I flew a bunch of T-70s and TIE/FOs, and eventually flew some of the X-Wing pilots from the Rebel Transport expansion (and thus needed the X-Wing model).

But Essentials Kits and Squadron Packs get you started into a faction, in something pretty close to the standard game as most folks play it. As to folks being unsure what faction they want, it's the same in any game. I traded my Trollbloods in Hordes for more X-Wing stuff pretty quickly, but I picked the faction because they're a bunch of drunk Scottish rock-men who are kinda the least-jerk of all the factions. If I were to start Warhammer Age of Sigmar, it'd be with Saurian/Lizardmen, because Dinosaurs. A lot of people pick factions in games because they look cool, and that changes from person to person. X-Wing has it pretty easy here, since most folks have favorite ships from the movies. Maybe they find out later they like the gameplay of a different faction, but there are clearly folks who are going to want to fly Luke or Vader or Boba Fett as their first choice. I don't understand them (and that's OK!), but I know there are folks out there who really love the prequels, and want to fly Jedi fighters.

With seven factions, I think it'd be great of FFG to break out of the need to buy ships for factions you don't need. There may be a few cases where tournament-type players want upgrades from other expansions, but by and large, it'd be a better way into the game.

Despite having my core set and my imperial conversion kit, I kinda agree that an opportunity was missed however with a little moderation.

Given that we now have 7 factions, the best way would be a squad pack for each and a special box containing the damage deck, templates, dices and a surplus of basic token (shield, evasion, focus). When I saw the new Runewars essential kit, I had hoped to see a similar box for X-Wing because over time I lost a lot of tokens and replace a old damage deck with a new one.

I know that after seeing the new about Clone Wars and especially "squadrons aces pack" who I will certainly take 2 of each to have a good base for Republic and Separatist.

Of course the new core set is not totally bad and having a game mode that you can play with the core set only is good too because to have done initiation most people have appreciate this and we got more upgrade than the previous version.

So it's 50/50 for me, I understand people can be upset about this like I love seeing new player going to the game with the core set and be happy with that.

SKU bloat is a thing. Just because you want to have stuff more convenient for you doesn't mean it's feasible for stores to stock it.

7 factions is already a significant ask for retailers to stock. I assume the squadron box is a way to cut down on that bloat. I have a feeling you probably won't see separate Torrent fighters or B22.

17 hours ago, Vontoothskie said:

yeah its stupid that they didnt have a starter set and then throw the damage deck in the conversion kits

You need multiple conversion-kits, thus people would complain that they were too expensive and that nobody need that many damage-decks.

as stated already an 'essentials kit' was needed. templates, counters and damage deck. no ships. ships could have been added to 'faction kits'. scum. imperials. rebels. FO. resistance.

Well you can't play X-wing 2nd edition with 1.0 templates. I mean I guess you could but some things like barrel rolls you could not do with 1st edition templates.

14 minutes ago, Marinealver said:

Well you can't play X-wing 2nd edition with 1.0 templates. I mean I guess you could but some things like barrel rolls you could not do with 1st edition templates.

im sure u can DIY ur own barrel roll template. isnt it just the 1 forward with a midline down the center?

4 minutes ago, Da_Brown_Bomber said:

im sure u can DIY ur own barrel roll template. isnt it just the 1 forward with a midline down the center?

It also applies to Tallon Rolls (which use the turn templates) and Small base decloaking (which uses the 2 straight). Medium and Large base Barrel Rolls use a different mid line, the one across the thin of the 1 straight, as their ref point. The mid line (the one that splits full front arc from full rear arc) on the Ship's cardboard can't cross then end of the maneuver template for all the sizes.

I made these themed based range rulers at work on our laser cutter. easy enough to etch the center midline onto a range one movement template.

curved templates will be a lil harder but i think i can figure it out. i recall there was someone in the community here who had the design specs but i think i can design some that would work.

Just now, Da_Brown_Bomber said:

easy enough to etch the center midline onto a range one movement template.

That could work, though you'd probably have to do all of them. Especially if you ever plan on using the Dalan Oberos Starviper. He can turn 90 deg after any maneuver for the cost of a stress. Need to line it up on the mid line of the template and his base card.

31 minutes ago, Marinealver said:

Well you can't play X-wing 2nd edition with 1.0 templates. I mean I guess you could but some things like barrel rolls you could not do with 1st edition templates.

Yeah, you'd be forced to do the better version of the barrel roll.

10 minutes ago, Da_Brown_Bomber said:

curved templates will be a lil harder but i think i can figure it out. i recall there was someone in the community here who had the design specs but i think i can design some that would work.

You might be able to get away just doing the first cm of both ends of the curved template.

58 minutes ago, Octarine-08 said:

SKU bloat is a thing.

Yeah, but in a way, this is a way around SKU bloat.

The Essential Kit is for everyone, and thus not as useless as the Core Set for some.

The Squadron Pack should contain 2 Swarm ships and an Ace. Really, they should then just drop the TIE/ln, Vulture, Z-95, Torrent, TIE/FO, et. al. as stand alone packs. Want a swarm? Buy multiple squadron packs. Alternatively, do what they just did--the TIE/ln in the Squad Pack is standard, and the stand-alone is Inferno livery. Now you might want both.

I know a lot of people will disagree, but this game could really use some ship rotation for the same reason. Replace the TIE Advanced with the TIE Avenger for a couple of seasons, and the TIE Interceptor with the TIE Hunter, and the Scyk with the Dunelizard. It would jiggle the meta, keep in-print SKUs to a minimum, allow the same design space to be used multiple times, and give long-term players a perk by having the "old-timey" options.

1 hour ago, RedHotDice said:

You need multiple conversion-kits, thus people would complain that they were too expensive and that nobody need that many damage-decks.

While I completely agree with you, I really would like to have more than 2 damage decks for when I have to provide stuff for multiple people.

1 hour ago, Marinealver said:

Well you can't play X-wing 2nd edition with 1.0 templates. I mean I guess you could but some things like barrel rolls you could not do with 1st edition templates.

Not in a tournament or any kind of competitive setting, but for most games, sure you can. It’s not like it’s hard to eyeball the middle of a template end. No one I’ve yet played has minded me using my old acrylics until I can get them modified.

23 minutes ago, Darth Meanie said:

and the Scyk with the Dunelizard  .

Add yes, replace heck no... The two are very different ships, not just a progression of a design (IE Advanced - Avenger and Interceptor - Hunter).

16 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

Add yes, replace heck no... The two are very different ships, not just a progression of a design (IE Advanced - Avenger and Interceptor - Hunter).

Wookieepedia disagrees.

Quote

The Dunelizard fighter was based upon the M3-A Scyk fighter , retaining that vessel's wedge-shaped wings, though the later model included a number of advanced features.

The Dunelizard added heavier payload and shields, but retained the swiftness and maneuverability that made the Scyk popular with Hutts and other criminal organizations including space pirates such as Erkon the Vile .

In any event, even with subtle variations, the point is that the one ship could sub in for the other for awhile, then tag out.

I think that would be better than never seeing some ships at all, "for lack of design space."

2 hours ago, Darth Meanie said:

Yeah, you'd be forced to do the better version of the barrel roll.

Don't get mad at me, I am not the one who made that decision.

Either way I am still scratching my head on why they decide to make movement in the table top game more snap in and added the bullseye arcs with this rigid movement instead of a more free form style movement. It seems counter-intuitive if you ask me.

2 hours ago, Da_Brown_Bomber said:

I made these themed based range rulers at work on our laser cutter. easy enough to etch the center midline onto a range one movement template.

2 hours ago, Da_Brown_Bomber said:

curved templates will be a lil harder but i think i can figure it out. i recall there was someone in the community here who had the design specs but i think i can design some that would work.

Sure, I mean we had 3rd party templates in 1st edition so I am certain that we will get 3rd party templates for 2nd edition soon. It is not too hard to make templates.

I still think FFG missed an opportunity to add a 4 speed bank just to keep dials open and add a little more flexibility to designing flight path maneuver profiles. Oh well, this is good enough. Time to get ready for Wave 3 and everything that is bringing to the game.

Good point Marine, if they were gonna revamp the templates why not add something different. they reprinted all the movement dials anyway so could have snuck in some new turns onto existing ships they wanted to buff or open up some design space for future releases eh?

9 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Would have been nice to have had an "Essentials" kit like in Runewars. Tokens, dice, templates, etc, but no miniatures. In Runewars, in US prices, it's $25 for the essentials kit, but $100 for the army kits. I'd figure an equivalent kit for X-Wing could have easily cost $20, with just the new center-line templates and damage deck, some dice, some obstacles, some tokens.

It'd also be great for folks starting into factions other than Rebels or Imperials.

Actually, maybe they should have abandoned the starter set entirely? Create an essentials kit, and then the "Squadron Packs" for each faction.

• Rebel: 2 X-Wing, 1 Y-Wing
• Empire: 2 TIE Fighter, 1 TIE Advanced x1
• Scum: At least 1 Fang, with... Kihraxz or Scyk as the other ship?
• First Order: 2 TIE/FO, 1 TIE Silencer (if Luke and Vader and Fenn Rau and maybe Poe are in their faction's Squadron Packs, shouldn't Kylo Ren be in the FO?)
• Resistance: 2 RZ-2 A-Wing, 1 T-70 X-Wing

*edit* one huge benefit: buying in for two players to try it out is a bit more expensive, but buying in as a single player is $60 and you'll have 3 ships in the same faction, making it a lot easier to get to 200/6 style standard play.

I like the idea, but I guess they thought about this quite long and hard and decided for good business reasons to go down this route. I mean, they knew they were going to do 7 freaking factions when they went about designing 2.0, so the thought MUST have crossed their mind.

big no.

I'm probably gonna sell my Core set. Only thing I'll really miss are the moving wing Xwings.