58 minutes ago, player3010587 said:

You do realize that its the punisher's linked actions? Redline is nasty because he does it without the stress or can focus into lock.

Yeah, I've played against Redline plenty and played against 4 Redline lists at Crossroads...I'm intimately familiar. I'm saying it's dumb that it can done at all, linked or not, in conjunction with TS bombs.

54 minutes ago, Kelvan said:

Also for the record for like 2 years I was Smittle's bogeyman until last store championship season. He barely got me then too.

I know it doesn't make sense but It's still accurate.

He's joining us because he can't beat us! It was mentioned somewhere that, to our recollection, no one has come into St. Louis and sniped one of our store champs. Smittle and Doug Howe took umbrage and tried this year...and didn't make the cut.

Great discussion on Imperials. I'm with Tyler about Admiral Sloane. Super strong card, but can definitely be played around. I brought Sloane on Captain Feroph with 4 Sentinels to a local tournament and managed 3-1, but my MOV put me at 5th out of 13. I think there's something there, but you HAVE to protect that Sloane carrier. I got her killed first thing in 2 of my games: I lost the first and barely squeaked by with a win in the other match.

I'm not good enough with TIE phantoms to put Sloane there, but it seems to be a solid spot.

1 hour ago, Kelvan said:

I'd be down to do the shirt swap like those Soccer players do. Just way less sexy.

Less sexy for you, maybe.

1 hour ago, Kelvan said:

Also for the record for like 2 years I was Smittle's bogeyman until last store championship season. He barely got me then too.

I know it doesn't make sense but It's still accurate.

We're 1-1 in Regional meetings. I pretend that means I'm about as good as he is.

1 hour ago, gennataos said:

Yeah, I've played against Redline plenty and played against 4 Redline lists at Crossroads...I'm intimately familiar. I'm saying it's dumb that it can done at all, linked or not, in conjunction with TS bombs.

He's joining us because he can't beat us! It was mentioned somewhere that, to our recollection, no one has come into St. Louis and sniped one of our store champs. Smittle and Doug Howe took umbrage and tried this year...and didn't make the cut.

I was hoping to see more Redline than the 2 I have encountered, as I had the tools to counter him: Whisper dancing to the side or behind rocks, Rexler tanking on approach, and Soontir never getting caught in the Punisher's locked sights. Also, that initiative Juke on both I5's messing with him and dealing a faceup card before the torpedo is epic. It felt so good and certainly makes up for the times I foolishly attempted I4 ships or anything rebel. Now Fenn Rau wielded by an amazing player whose Han carrier and 2 tugs must die....geez. I guess I have two options: git gud or futilely advocate a meaningful change in a mechanic's rules as everyone else has since release. I will attempt the former option, but getting eliminated by skillful play instead of the ghost in "sod you, your decisions don't matter in this 1.0 regional"--at the same venue only months later--feels so, so relieving and cathartic.

2.0 (not meaning Nick's 2.0 2nd edition aka 4.0) is ******* amazing.

1 hour ago, player3010587 said:

I was hoping to see more Redline than the 2 I have encountered, as I had the tools to counter him: Whisper dancing to the side or behind rocks, Rexler tanking on approach, and Soontir never getting caught in the Punisher's locked sights. Also, that initiative Juke on both I5's messing with him and dealing a faceup card before the torpedo is epic. It felt so good and certainly makes up for the times I foolishly attempted I4 ships or anything rebel. Now Fenn Rau wielded by an amazing player whose Han carrier and 2 tugs must die....geez. I guess I have two options: git gud or futilely advocate a meaningful change in a mechanic's rules as everyone else has since release. I will attempt the former option, but getting eliminated by skillful play instead of the ghost in "sod you, your decisions don't matter in this 1.0 regional"--at the same venue only months later--feels so, so relieving and cathartic.

2.0 (not meaning Nick's 2.0 2nd edition aka 4.0) is ******* amazing.

I beat 3 of the 4 Redline lists I faced, kinda lost on a dumb setup to the 4th, so it's not like it can't be dealt with. Those Redline/Whisper lists are just an unfortunate combo of some feels familiar stuff.

3 hours ago, Biophysical said:

Less sexy for you, maybe.

We're 1-1 in Regional meetings. I pretend that means I'm about as good as he is.

That's how i lie to myself to. Like my 1-1-1 record vs. Paul Heaver. All lies to myself.

12 hours ago, gennataos said:

I beat 3 of the 4 Redline lists I faced, kinda lost on a dumb setup to the 4th, so it's not like it can't be dealt with. Those Redline/Whisper lists are just an unfortunate combo of some feels familiar stuff.

Do you feel like you have to have either higher initiative or second player to beat redline?

1 hour ago, Kelvan said:

Do you feel like you have to have either higher initiative or second player to beat redline?

I think it depends on the list. Like, Boba?....he probably wants to go first, range control Redline and get inside torp range. Even if he misses it, with Debris gambit and focus tokens and maybe a rock, he's not losing a lot, even with a bomb the next turn. Adv Sensor Rexler seems like he can deal with Redline moving first as well. Other lists I5s might struggle more since they can put a hurt on him, but will eat that torp and probably a bomb in exchange. In a mirror, the Redline which moves first is almost 100% way behind from list building.

I had Fenn/Old T/Palob and was moving last, but Palob was usually the first target, so it's not like I could dodge with him...my best hope was to be token stacked and behind a rock at a uncomfortable angle for my opponent and survive long enough to provide value for the fangs. Old T might have been fine going first, since he can move so fast.

43 minutes ago, gennataos said:

I think it depends on the list. Like, Boba?....he probably wants to go first, range control Redline and get inside torp range. Even if he misses it, with Debris gambit and focus tokens and maybe a rock, he's not losing a lot, even with a bomb the next turn. Adv Sensor Rexler seems like he can deal with Redline moving first as well. Other lists I5s might struggle more since they can put a hurt on him, but will eat that torp and probably a bomb in exchange. In a mirror, the Redline which moves first is almost 100% way behind from list building.

I had Fenn/Old T/Palob and was moving last, but Palob was usually the first target, so it's not like I could dodge with him...my best hope was to be token stacked and behind a rock at a uncomfortable angle for my opponent and survive long enough to provide value for the fangs. Old T might have been fine going first, since he can move so fast.

Honestly I'd imagine it's 2nd player each time to know to avoid the torp.

36 minutes ago, Kelvan said:

Honestly I'd imagine it's 2nd player each time to know to avoid the torp.

For the most part, I agree, but it really depends on the list. Not all have the bid flexibility to guarantee that, so the question for those lists is can they handle Redline while moving first? If the answer is that they can’t, then that’s probably a list one can’t field competitively, in Extended Format, and expect to do well.

25 minutes ago, gennataos said:

For the most part, I agree, but it really depends on the list. Not all have the bid flexibility to guarantee that, so the question for those lists is can they handle Redline while moving first? If the answer is that they can’t, then that’s probably a list one can’t field competitively, in Extended Format, and expect to do well.

Interesting. I always figured Boba was the bogeyman.

6 minutes ago, Kelvan said:

Interesting. I always figured Boba was the bogeyman.

He’s a bogeyman, for sure. I think Crossroads showed us that people have more confidence in (their ability with?) imperial wingmates for Redline than Boba.

Me, I’m more scared of Boba. For the most part, I’ve seen Redline joust to get off the torp, launch/drop a bomb or two then die. Boba is gunna be around a while.

That’s not an endorsement of Redline, though. The punishers just make some list archetypes obsolete, which I think sucks. Boba doesn’t do that.

Boba, with Han Gunner, may want to go first. Otherwise, no Han focus when defending against Torps.

Is that worth giving up a positional advantage? Should you be good enough to range control anyways? Not sure.

1 hour ago, Q10fanatic said:

Boba, with Han Gunner, may want to go first. Otherwise, no Han focus when defending against Torps.

Is that worth giving up a positional advantage? Should you be good enough to range control anyways? Not sure.

i can somewhat follow that logic, I still like going 2nd as it's not easy to pull the lock when you're moving first.