speaking mostly for imperials, I'd strongly vouch for significant improvement to the TIE advanced generics, along the lines of:

Tempest Sq. -1
Storm Sq. -2

The generics are just sluggish, they have poor reactivity, and really don't compare to the power of similar point cost options. Why take a 43 point storm sq. pilot when you can take a much more potent Duchess at 1 point less, or a Phantom for 1 more?

I think it is hilarious how the Tie Advanced is the same price as the X-wing. When comparing them side by side, the X-wing is just vastly superior. More health, more options (boost) and a way better shooting mechanic. 3 Dice no matter what for the x-wing. The Tie Advanced gets 2 or maybe 3 if it gets a lock. Woop de doo.

Telling you, its because Vader would be disgusting or too expensive to bother if the TIE Adv and Xwing were actually comparable.

+1agi does not reflect the -1h -1s stats and native 2die (which only becomes a 3die if you lock) and also xwings have torps.

i was hoping they'd just give vader a different ability so the frame itself can be good w/o making him silly strong. Unfortunately we knew of his ability right off the bat so....that didnt last long

6 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:

Telling you, its because Vader would be disgusting or too expensive to bother if the TIE Adv and Xwing were actually comparable.

+1agi does not reflect the -1h -1s stats and native 2die (which only becomes a 3die if you lock) and also xwings have torps.

i was hoping they'd just give vader a different ability so the frame itself can be good w/o making him silly strong. Unfortunately we knew of his ability right off the bat so....that didnt last long

They can keep Vader's price high and lower the rest, right?

7 hours ago, william1134 said:

I think it is hilarious how the Tie Advanced is the same price as the X-wing. When comparing them side by side, the X-wing is just vastly superior. More health, more options (boost) and a way better shooting mechanic. 3 Dice no matter what for the x-wing. The Tie Advanced gets 2 or maybe 3 if it gets a lock. Woop de doo.

Please, FFG allow Vader to drop to 62 points, like his son Luke Skywalker, I promise it'll be a staple in every list I fly ?

This is what I meant.. There is no way that these two ships are comparable despite having the same point cost.

Non-vader Tie advanced really should come down in price, though I think Vader is also unjustifiably expensive.

I think generic Adv should come down, Grand Quis could also lose a point or two and be fine. He runs out of force quickly so SNR isn't as punishing. It shouldn't be about 'punishing' whatever faction is doing well, but trying to make every ship have a viable cost point. Alex Davy has spoken to this a few times, even a 'bad' ship works in a list of costed correctly.

Indeed... Vader also burns through his force tokens so quickly (especially with supernatural) I find that he is quite limp for the following turns, while trying to recharge.. not that in my experience he was able to as everybody was trying to kill him for easy-ish points.

16 minutes ago, william1134 said:

This is what I meant.. There is no way that these two ships are comparable despite having the same point cost.

Non-vader Tie advanced really should come down in price, though I think Vader is also unjustifiably expensive.

I could be totally off base but overall it's pretty close.

Sensor/Missile is comparable to Astro/Torpedo. 3 green and 5 health is comparable to 2 green and 6 health (on average my gut says its better, but I'd have to do the math). The repositioning options are better than S-foils open but slightly worse than s-foils closed (Based on that comparison the tempest probably should have a white boost... but that would make super Vader much scarier than he already is).

The main issue is the need for a target lock to roll 3 attack dice. And that can be built around with Jendon/Tarkin/Coordinate...

I can see them taking off a point but not much more. Five of these suckers would be nasty enough, even without upgrades.

They could fix the TIE Adv without allowing 5 in a squad or errata'ing the ship's stats by adding a 2nd missile slot, making Barrage missiles 2 points cheaper, and increasing the points of TIE Bombers and TIE Punishers. It would still be mostly worse than an X-Wing, but I think that's FFG's way of hinting that you're putting the iconic starfighter that was exclusive to Darth Vader on the table, they want Vader to be in it and not some mook.

im not really convinced 5 TIE Adv would be any harder to deal with than 4 phantoms, even if they got tweaked to not be able to have juke on all of them.

Until it gets its lock, TIE Adv is piss poor and at THAT low of a PS they aint locking jack for the first round of combat.

4 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:

im not really convinced 5 TIE Adv would be any harder to deal with than 4 phantoms, even if they got tweaked to not be able to have juke on all of them.

Until it gets its lock, TIE Adv is piss poor and at THAT low of a PS they aint locking jack for the first round of combat.

Doesn't mean they can't be fun. After all, Jendon and/or Grand Moff tarkin are rather fun to play with them, although if you want Tarkin on a shuttle, the title or Krennic is needed. I believe Tarkin is best with strikers, but he is fun nonetheless with the advanced.

i genuinely do not know how to use moff tarkin.

The "Lock requirement" to equip him makes him impossible to run on anything except a Decimator unless you completely waste that other slot for Krennic.

The two dont like each other (well...thats thematic isnt it?). Krennic doesnt want cheap-ship spam, he wants something like a Defender-level of quality to slap OP onto so it doesnt get vaporized immediately.
Moff wants a miniswarm though.

Lambda has no lock and its title is not a lock action so Moff can never go on a lambda
Phantom has no lock so he cant hide in one of those (that'd be amusing)
Reaper, as mentioned, must take Krennic.

Decimator has native lock but Decimator is so bad.....just...so bad... well actually the 0agi ships in general are bad but still

Like I said, just give it access to barrage rockets, 3-dice on the approach with a focus and 3-4 dice while fighting in-close with a lock. You'd just have to make barrages cheaper and TIE bombers more expensive.

You can always use Colonel Jendon, but I do believe that Tie Adv x1 is gimped as a platform just to keep Darth Vader in check...

3 minutes ago, C3gorach said:

You can always use Colonel Jendon, but I do believe that Tie Adv x1 is gimped as a platform just to keep Darth Vader in check...

Darth Vader's costs and upgrade slots are not tied to the generic TIE Adv. They can make the generic TIE Adv cheaper or give it more upgrade slots without changing Vader at all.

1 hour ago, Tvboy said:

Darth Vader's costs and upgrade slots are not tied to the generic TIE Adv. They can make the generic TIE Adv cheaper or give it more upgrade slots without changing Vader at all.

Yes, what I was trying to say is that it is bad game design to specifically gimp a whole Ship just to 'balance' one unique pilot... They could have added a Red Evade Action if they wanted to mitigate Vader Ability abuse for example...

On 10/12/2018 at 3:45 PM, Big k said:

Does anyone take the expensive defenders anymore? At 80ish points I can't justify 1 let alone 2

Is Ryad really wirth 86 points before upgrades?

I'm undefeated with Delta/Delta/OGP+Palp. Mostly fairly casual games, a small kit tourney, but still.

On 10/12/2018 at 1:45 PM, Big k said:

Does anyone take the expensive defenders anymore? At 80ish points I can't justify 1 let alone 2

Is Ryad really wirth 86 points before upgrades?

I am routinely running two defenders,
either twin defenders, with advanced sensors and outmaneuver (ryad and brath)
or two deltas with a 54 pt ace like fel w/ predator, or a gunboat, or a phantom

These squads are very powerful and do very well with a range of opponents.

two defenders, where one plays chicken and runs away lets the second swoop in with OM and just tear things to bits. It's a great ship.

12 hours ago, william1134 said:

This is what I meant.. There is no way that these two ships are comparable despite having the same point cost.

Non-vader Tie advanced really should come down in price, though I think Vader is also unjustifiably expensive.

Need to add the Cartel Marauder and the dials for all three if you're going to try that type of comparison...

Evaluate cost fighter vs fighter from two different factions is nonsense. They are balanced with all the entries of their faction. It is not a simple and direct matter but a multilayer reasoning that decide the point value. There are builds for all ships now. The only changes truly needed are up way in points for some choices that in all factions are far too efficient ruining the whole game reducing the scope and the variances of list building. Since now there are imho very minor necessities in that order of duty. The game is mostly fine as it is.

I think the idea behind the Tie Adv is Vader is always going to be the only good pilot for it. It’s his ship, it’s iconic. They want him on the table in it.

20 minutes ago, Quack Shot said:

I think the idea behind the Tie Adv is Vader is always going to be the only good pilot for it. It’s his ship, it’s iconic. They want him on the table in it.

But Marek is rather decent in it, too. He just needs some Palp support and a reroll mechanic.

Well whatever they are, I am sure there will be plenty of prescriptions of Gonk Zonk handed out when that happens.

Caution: language if you go past the Gonk Zonk gag.

I’m sure every ship I like and run will get point increases. Whisper, Strikers, Defenders, X-Wings, Y-Wings.....all the fun stuff will get pointed where I can’t run my lists.