Just to make things clear before anyone answers, if your ONLY reply to this topic is going to be pointing out that the morality system sucks, don't bother posting unless you're planning to follow it up with some constructive thoughts and ideas.

On to the topic.

So you character just happened to drop below 30 morality, despite not really going out of their way to do evil stuff, but maybe just spending a little too many dark side pips. Now dark side pips are their standard force power fuel, and as such, regardless of why they're used, Conflict will start adding up at quite an accelerated rate. You character is still not doing evil stuff as such. He's generally quite a nice guy (or at least not terrible), despite his morality plunging down through the single digits.

How would you approach this from an in-game role-playing perspective? Should the GM act a bit as the devil on his shoulder, encouraging him to give into his darker emotions? As he flips a destiny point to the dark side each session, maybe take that and run with it describe his dark side use as, if not malevolent, just wrong, perverting the natural order of things?

Maybe a character shouldn't be able to cross to the dark side without really "earning it" through his actions, instead ending up stuck at 30?

What are your thoughts?

While the Star Wars films have given us Palpatine as one of the quintessential "cackling evil overlords" that seems to have set the standard for full-blown dark siders, I'd say that's not entirely the case.

Count Dooku was a dark sider, but he could still be quite charming and charismatic as the situation warranted. Darth Vader could be a capricious d**k, but he saved the worst of his wrath for the incompetent, and even had a level of respect for those who dared to face him head on (note his line to Ezra Bridger in Season 2 about how the boy, who'd just claimed to not be afraid of Vader and was willing to stand and fight, would die braver than most). Maul in TCW and Rebels was a bit of a loon, but he'd also had a decades' worth of largely untreated PTSD scrambling his marbles. Even the Grand Inquisitor from Rebels' first season could be civil, if a bit condescending, and though he didn't balk at doing some rather horrific things (like executing a pair of bumbling Imperial officials on Tarkin's orders), neither did he delve into 80's cartoon levels of villainy.

I would say that just because a PC has fallen below 30 Morality, that doesn't mean they go straight into full-blown mustache-twirling villainy. Fiction is chock full of villains who apart from their methodology and beliefs can actually be decent people; Vader for instance is well respected amongst the stormtrooper rank-and-file for his willingness to lead from the front and he in turn has a respect for them that most of Imperial command doesn't share.

I would cite Dexter from the TV/novel series of the same name as a good example of someone that is indeed a dark sider (the guy's a serial killer after all, and routinely does some unpleasant things to keep this a secret from his colleagues), but again hasn't sunk into cartoon villainy.

Megatron of the IDW version of the Transformers franchise is an interesting take on a villain whose original goals and ideals were anything but, just that over the ages his desire to "win" got to the point he condoned doing (and did) some pretty horrific things; at one point after a major story arc, he even reflects on how he pretty much lost the moral high ground in the war the moment he gave his followers the order to pick up weapons and fight; much later in the Lost Light series, he effectively gets a "do-over" for his revolution, and notably adjusts the catchphrase from "Peace Through Tyranny" to "Peace Through Empathy" and is rather successful (granted, it helps the group he's leading a revolution against are serious a-holes, so he almost can't help but look good by comparison). Shame that it won't stick once IDW ends its run on Transformers (Megs is just too iconic a villain for him to remain redeemed), but it's been quite interesting to follow.

Point is that there's one way to portray an evil character, even in Star Wars much less in fiction in general.

I don't know if the GM should be offering/suggesting ways for the character to indulge in greater villainy, though perhaps a conversation with the player to see how their methods of doing things might change. After falling to the dark side, it may well be that there are courses of action the character would have once balked at that they now see as no big deal; what's a little excessive cruelty between enemies after all once you go dark side? Or said character might accept a higher level of collateral damage if it helps achieve a larger and generally noble goal.

1 hour ago, penpenpen said:

So you character just happened to drop below 30 morality, despite not really going out of their way to do evil stuff, but maybe just spending a little too many dark side pips...

How would you approach this from an in-game role-playing perspective? Should the GM act a bit as the devil on his shoulder, encouraging him to give into his darker emotions? As he flips a destiny point to the dark side each session, maybe take that and run with it describe his dark side use as, if not malevolent, just wrong, perverting the natural order of things?

In this case the issue is one of the player, despite not being traditional mustache twirling evil, is still evil. No matter how "good" his intentions are, they shouldn't work out as good in the normal sense. It's rare to see this in media, so it can be kinda tricky, but the idea is you can adjust the overall campaign to have the player being less and less of a good guy, and more of a guy that's out to do good, and it just never works out. It's like an odd mix of Thanos and Jar-jar really..

So like... Jar-jar doesn't try to screw everything up, he's just terrible at everything, but still manages to luck out often. As an opponent it'd be like having an NPC with Adversary 6.

Thanos on the other hand is doing some pretty terrible things, but his base cause is just. There's not enough resources in the galaxy to support it's population, and Thanos thinks he has a way to fix it, or at least delay the inevitable by a few million more years. But of course he method is to murder half the galaxy...

So by the same note, I'd try and look at how to warp the campaign so that the player is no longer a good guy. He might still be doing "good" things, but it'll always be for the wrong reasons at the end of the day, or questionable at best. This doesn't have to be an immediate switch, it should be a little gradual. This is very much in line with the Morality system and your big moral choices the player should already be making, just now it goes a little haywire. His choices are no longer good and bad, but more grey and usually with side effects that some people may not approve of. Think of more insidious, not blatantly obvious "bad" he can do, but that will build up.

So like... OK... Our hero gets word that there's a colony suffering from some new plague of some kind. He shows up, and sure enough there's a colony of (insert highly unusual species here) that's dying of a terrible brain fever disease. The Hero must adventure to find a cure! While searching he finds out it's an old bioweapon from some long forgotten war. It's pretty bad, but there's an easy to produce cure for someone already infected, and a vaccine for use on people that haven't been infected yet, though it's a lot harder to make. Now in the possession of (insert "good guy" organization the player doesn't belong to.) is samples of the cure, and of the vaccine. Player shows up, and the "good guys" insist they don't have it, and never heard of it, full stop. The player is going to have to steal it somehow. He does, with the "good guys" fighting him every step of the way for fear he's trying to use the bioweapon, and not merely the cure.

He gets back to Colony as the grand hero, and administers the cure! Huzzah! The people are super happy, and shortly after recovery, they pledge their loyalty to the player! He now has a new safe haven, and even access to some troops should the occasion arise. The disease still pops up here and there, but is now easy to treat, and rarely gets beyond the initial headache and flu-like symptoms.

Now... later he finds out the reason the "good guys" were fighting him... Turns out, while impossible to actually prove, supposedly the brain fever and cure were a 2-part weapon. Those infected and left untreated would die. Those treated with the cure would be much more open to suggestion. The Vaccine is legit... likely intended to be administered to the forces actually deploying the weapon, and may even sync with the disease to make sure the vaccinated are better at suggesting.

Is that true? Or is it just propaganda from long ago? Do the people he saved really support the player because he saved them, or has the bioweapon coopted their minds? What about the "good guys?" They likely believe the player is out to do some pretty nasty stuff, and will likely return eventually as adversaries...

The big thing though, is never answer the question. There's no way to prove it's a mind control thing, and the loyalty of the people should seem totally normal for the situation, nothing over the top. Even the "good guys" can't be 100% sure, so they won't attack the player outright... yet.

1 hour ago, penpenpen said:

Maybe a character shouldn't be able to cross to the dark side without really "earning it" through his actions, instead ending up stuck at 30?

To speak to this specifically, I think that a character should "fall" once they cross that threshold. Granted, the way the Morality system is set up, it's not likely for a PC to casually slip to the dark side unless they roll really low on that d10 every session, but that's neither here nor there.

Many of the examples I noted are characters that in fiction would certainly qualify as being "dark siders" but aren't cartoony level of evil. Heck, I've seen it posited that Batman, in spite of his generally noble intentions, would be a dark sider under the F&D rules given the methods he employs to fight crime in Gotham, being a rather stark contrast to guys like Spider-Man and Superman who aren't nearly as "pragmatic" about fighting crime as Batsy. Daredevil of the Netflix series could be another case of a character that is on the side of the angels but quite possibly has a Morality score below 30 simply for how he goes about protecting ****'s Kitchen. You've also got the Punisher of Marvel Comics, who started out as a Spider-Man villain, is only barely tolerated by the Marvel hero community, but is in-universe noted as that setting's most successful serial killer given the tremendous body count of violent criminals he's left in his wake.

While there is something inherently cathartic about deranged cackles of laughter (especially that of the levels of Skeletor and BtAS!Joker), that doesn't mean being on the dark side equates to your character automatically donning a black wardrobe and chewing the scenery like it's an all-you-can-eat cheese buffet.

Good thing the Dark Side doesn't necessarily have anything to do with being evil (not the Lightside, good), huh?

The Darkside is acting against the will of the Force. Yes, often that consists of patently evil actions (like murder, and on down to lieing).

But we also know you can do things that are pretty indisputably evil (like indiscriminately killing 10s or 100s(?) of thousands of people on a military base), without moral consequence, if it was the will of the Force.

Like any time a PC takes a lesser Conflict-worthy action (lieing, stealing, murder), and rolls a 10 on their Morality roll. That's the Cosmic Force saying, "Thanks. That's what I wanted to happen." For whatever unknowable reason. The Force is ok with that evil. Just like it was ok with it when Luke indiscriminately killed everyone on the Death Star.

What the Will of the Force (aka the Cosmic Force) can never abide by, is someone making the Force do what it doesn't want to do. Which is what using dark pips is, and what the Darkside is.

So, just because your PC doesn't do explicitly evil things doesn't mean they can't or shouldn't be Darkside. They are consistently disregarding the Will of the Force, and that's what the Darkside truly IS.

I would suggest reading Dark Disciple by Christie Golden, first of all it's one of the better new cannon books and it's not long, as it covers both a character falling to the Dark Side and another coming back too if not the Light at least Grey.

As others have pointed out the Dark Side is a range of behavior from ruthlessly driven sociopath to cackling psychopath so you have a lot of potential for RP. As a side note and somewhat inexpensive observation I'd point out that if a Player let their PC's Morality fall below 30 it's no accident especially considering how easy it is to gain Morality in this system. So yes they earned it and in a way they could just continue as they are currently playing but instead of lamenting choosing to spend those Dark Side pips accept it, relish it in fact...

The Dark Side character is about is about acting without restriction, giving in to emotion and our base instinct to achieve their goal. For a Vader type that goal is order through power so as to not be a victim of chance and instead have complete control over their destiny not mindless destruction or chaos as those things are actually counter to their goal. A Vader will destroy a whole world if it get's him closer to his goal but is also capable of showing mercy if that will also help him achieve his goal. A Vader doesn't necessarily enjoy murder, he likely doesn't even think of the death and destruction he causes as anything more than a tool and step along their path. They may enjoy the rush of combat and the power of the Force but the killing is of no moral consequence. A Palpatine type unlike the Vader type already believe they control their own destiny and see the Force not just as a tool but as a source of ecstatic joy. Power, chaos, destruction, murder etc. aren't just byproducts caused by their ruthless need to reach their goal but often the goal itself. I digress...

A PC slipping into the Dark Side by flipping DP and using DS pips is actually a pretty accurate way to represent it in most cases. Each time that PC uses those representations (DS pips) of Fear or Hate (fear of failing that Attack or hate to increase an effect) or whatever, they are choosing expedience over principal. A Light Side PC would accept and instead trust in the Force to redouble their effort in their next Attack (try again and hope for more LS Pips). So no there is no need to have an specific event to cross the threshold on their decent.

As for coming back, that's a different story.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_Disciple

I'd have it emphasized that while they are a good person, they are very much not going to stay good if they keep getting used by their emotions rather than the other way around. One thing I like to stress is that the Dark Side isn't just a tool that you use, though several of its adherents may view it as such, but a corrupting Force (couldn't resist).

The more you use it, the more it uses you . Twisting your behavior until you're nothing but a cruel reflection of your original self. There's a reason it's called falling.

Or you could just ignore it entirely...

7 hours ago, Dayham said:

There's a reason it's called falling.

Only by the blind fools that have never tried it. Don't fall to the dark side; dive right in!

The Morality system sucks! I have no real arguements or statements about it!

But no, seriously and joking aside. If I kill a baby to save a hundred people, or a thousand, or a million. At what amount of saved lives do I stop being a baby killer?

Rught. I don't. The same goes for a character under the Morality system, not performing evil deeds as we know them, but gaining Conflict from using Force powers fueled by Dark Side pips. Narratively, the character is using the Force with negative emotions, and the Star Wars universe is rather black and white in this. Even if saving your own life, through putting up a Force barrier against a blaster bolt, is a neutral thing to do, when you do so when you're calm and at peace (using Light Side pips) or when you're terrified of losing your own life (using Dark Side pips), makes a difference for the narrative part of the Star Wars universe.

So yes, sliding down that Dark Side slope can be done through deeds perceived as 'good'. The road to the infernally hot place which name is filtered out for some reason is paved with good intentions, after all.

The best way of putting falling to the dark side is that the character becomes unable to see everyone else as either an opportunity to exploit to exhaustion, or a hinderance that must be dealt with. That ultimately characterises all Darksiders, big, small, psychotic or sociopathic. The one universal aspect is their capacity to destroy their foes with powers that are unnatural and manipulate the environment so that it benefits them, and anyone they deem useful. To them using their powers at their full is an unbridled joy as they want to be feared and respected and most potently of all; they have no respect for the status quo or the natural order of things. If the Force is the river that flows to an finite end point into the great ocean, the dark side is a dammed river that grows stagnant able to defy fate itself to corrupt it's surrounding environment.

In short, anyone who falls to it's influence will steadily become a corrupted version of themselves the longer they spend immersed in it. While the dark side can manipulate you up to the point of standing on the edge of the abyss however; it can't force you to take a final step into darkness rather the character themselves must make that step. We see it in Anakin who must choice to destroy the entire Jedi order after cutting windu's hand off, the children included. We see it in Dooku who decided, somewhere along the line that he didn't want to be at the beck and call of the force, but wanted to take controlling the galaxy into his own hands. Falling to the dark side is never an accident, but a conscious choice to become corrupted.

Way I see it, falling to the dark side doesn't "just happen." but rather it's the effect of either drawing on the force harshly too frequently or alternatively just simply making enough bad decisions that they become delusional and fall anyway from insensitivity. If a character has fallen to the dark side through the morality system which generally gravitates people toward stability, then they have done something to warrant this.

Now, changes? Depends on the character. Some will be like "by the force, what have I become?" and try and heal their spiritual wounds, others will continue down the dark path, some will hide it, some will justify it and will openly do it until they are stopped. Eventually that character will come into conflict with the light aligned force users as they too will take conflict from the Dark siders excess, eventually prompting a confrontation characteristic of most emotionally charged duels of the series. Everyone should have the expectations of the dark side spelled out to them at the outset of the campaign; falling is a pretty significant event and it should have an effect on the ongoing narrative, either from the player themselves (which is ideal) or imposed on them via tricks of mind via the narrative. After all, that is the pact you signed with the GM on the outset of the game, they are providing the world you are roleplaying in and adversity it is the players obligation to themselves and each other to provide the most entertaining experience imaginable which includes dramas running high and inevitability a convening of the story, or the ending of one.

On 10/10/2018 at 6:50 AM, penpenpen said:

So you character just happened to drop below 30 morality, despite not really going out of their way to do evil stuff, but maybe just spending a little too many dark side pips. Now dark side pips are their standard force power fuel, and as such, regardless of why they're used, Conflict will start adding up at quite an accelerated rate. You character is still not doing evil stuff as such. He's generally quite a nice guy (or at least not terrible), despite his morality plunging down through the single digits.

How would you approach this from an in-game role-playing perspective? Should the GM act a bit as the devil on his shoulder, encouraging him to give into his darker emotions? As he flips a destiny point to the dark side each session, maybe take that and run with it describe his dark side use as, if not malevolent, just wrong, perverting the natural order of things?

The morality system sucks! There is a flaw in the morality system. Certain kinds of conflict generators -- committing atrocities and using dark side powers -- necessarily inform the fiction, yet spending strain to use dark pips does not. It is therefore incumbent upon the GM to impose negative consequences for using dark pips if this incongruity is to be avoided. It's not hard to do and appears in fiction all the time. The road to Perdition is paved with noble intent, and this is even present in the story of Anakin Skywalker himself. Make bad stuff happen, and encourage the player to get himself out of the hole by digging. He'll then be faced with a meaningful choice between the hard way and the easy way.

For me the equalization between objective evil and the dark side as well as the light side and objective good has always been a bit hamfisted. But that's a personal opinion, not how it is in Star Wars. So using the Dark Side and eventually falling to it means you're evil. It's not the only ways to be a villain, after all Tarkin is not a force user and he's still a villain. It's not the only way to fall either, Wullf Yularen goes from an ally to the Jedi and a person who seems good to one who is ok with Tarkin blowing up Aldeeran and with intimate information on everything that the Empire does in the shadows.

Anyway, for me, falling to the dark side is not the same as becoming a mustache twirling villain trope. Those are boring, both to play for any length of time, as well as antagonists. It's more interesting to see how this thirst for power in the force can lead to new developments. Interesting villains want power for a reason, they don't just want power for the sake of having power. Power is meant to be used, it's meant to be seen and acknowledged by others. Otherwise you might as well not have it. So as a dark sider you need a goal, something that you work towards and that you're willing to go to quite extreme measures to attain. As a member of a group this should be something that aligns with the groups goals, but working towards it should have them questioning their own motives. You can become a dark reflection of what they could be, as well as a warning to what can happen if you let something consume you.

Another thing is that becoming "evil" shouldn't mean that you think your actions won't have consequences. Police won't stop chasing you when you flash them your "evil" ID card, they especially won't stop when you keep causing mayhem and start killing cops as well. So you should keep your villainy to people you can get away with being a nick-name of Richard to, because life is already hard enough without making it harder. And make sure to form bonds with the other characters in the group, not just that you get to know the other players, form bonds in character. Things that can make the eventual showdown all the more heart wrenching and the final fall or triumph over evil make the character question at what cost they attained their goal.

In this.. and any RPG... all those playing should be in agreement on how to approach morality in-game.
That said, this game does have a default setting that it uses as a baseline and one that (depending on your opinion) may not resemble the world we actually live in.

Simply put, as a Force Sensitive either you are actively working against the darkness (and likely putting yourself through the wringer in the process) or you are allowing the slow encroachment to overtake you... eventually.
In many ways "I'm not a bad guy, its just easier to be good in this way" is the point.

But again, if the gaming group collectively finds that undesirable or (worse) just no fun, then they should alter or even jettison the whole thing.

EDITED TO ADD: Arguably, the game wants you to debate the nuances and the RaW provide a point from and around which these debates can occur.

37 minutes ago, Darth Revenant said:

Police won't stop chasing you when you flash them your "evil" ID card, they especially won't stop when you keep causing mayhem and start killing cops as well. So you should keep your villainy to people you can get away with being a nick-name of Richard to, because life is already hard enough without making it harder.

Note that this does not apply if your Evil ID was issued by the Inquisitorius. They only died out because no PCs joined them. Your game can be different; be that difference!

1 minute ago, HappyDaze said:

Note that this does not apply if your Evil ID was issued by the Inquisitorius. They only died out because no PCs joined them. Your game can be different; be that difference!

Yeah, but that means being a stooge to a rather boring villain. I mean I loved the grand Inquisitor, dude was pretty **** entertaining and cool. Palpatine is just rather meh though, and Vader isn't really boss of the month material. Especially not if you're an inquisitor, he hates those guys almost as much as himself. So clearly the best way as an inquisitor is to fake your own death, go freelance and kill the Emperor and his mad dog.

Just now, Darth Revenant said:

Yeah, but that means being a stooge to a rather boring villain. I mean I loved the grand Inquisitor, dude was pretty **** entertaining and cool. Palpatine is just rather meh though, and Vader isn't really boss of the month material. Especially not if you're an inquisitor, he hates those guys almost as much as himself. So clearly the best way as an inquisitor is to fake your own death, go freelance and kill the Emperor and his mad dog.

Well, Rebels tend to be stooges of Mon Mothma the Dull, and prequel Jedi council had some real non-persons in charge too, so if Inquisitors are stooges then so are the rest.

Or you play a group of Inquisitors with Imperial agents (and possibly with bounty hunters) on retainer if you're mixing lines, and go out on missions far away from the "bosses" you mention. Of course, mixing in some elements of Office Space and Horrible Bosses can add to the game too.

1 minute ago, HappyDaze said:

Well, Rebels tend to be stooges of Mon Mothma the Dull, and prequel Jedi council had some real non-persons in charge too, so if Inquisitors are stooges then so are the rest.

Or you play a group of Inquisitors with Imperial agents (and possibly with bounty hunters) on retainer if you're mixing lines, and go out on missions far away from the "bosses" you mention. Of course, mixing in some elements of Office Space and Horrible Bosses can add to the game too.

Don't have to be on the side of the rebellion just because you're a light sider. Or freelance dark sider. You could just try to survive and figure out what's up with that whole moving stuff with your mind powers and general strangeness while trying to stay one step ahead of all the bad things in the galaxy that are after you. I actually kind of prefer those stories, they tend to be more introspective and spiritualistic where you explore the essence of the force rather than just clash laser swords. Clashing laser swords is also fun, but if that's the only focus then I'm probably not going to stay interested for very long.

23 minutes ago, Darth Revenant said:

I actually kind of prefer those stories, they tend to be more introspective and spiritualistic where you explore the essence of the force rather than just clash laser swords. Clashing laser swords is also fun, but if that's the only focus then I'm probably not going to stay interested for very long.

I find that introspective stories tend to be unsatisfying to me as the group gets larger. Beyond 3-4 players, they are less likely to appeal to me.

There's a lot of interesting viewpoints here, and it gave me enough food for thought to localize where the rub is.

If there's anything pretty much all sources agree upon it's that the dark side is dangerous .

The sith might tell themselves they're breaking their chains and setting themselves free, but they invariably end up slaves to their own urges and ambitions. Falling to the dark side in game... it's at worst inconvenient . Now, the mechanic in earlier games where players were supposed to be kept in check by the threat of the GM nabbing their PCs and adding them to his rogues gallery if they went darkside might be a bit extreme, but it was a clear indicator that if you strayed too far down that path, things would inevitably turn to sith (semi-pun brought to you courtesy of the profanity filter). I'd like some kind of mechanic to represent the actual threat of the dark side. A single destiny point flip is a nice touch to represent the effects of unbalancing the force, but as a drawback, it's somewhat meh.

As a GM, I might be tempted to reinstate the confiscating PC-rule on hitting zero, leaving 1-30 open for those who want to play darkside anti-heroes, but I'd rather not if I can find something that's more conducive to character play. Maybe once you go dark side (sub-30) you can no longer use darkside pips for selfless acts? Sure, you can still aid your allies working for a goal that benefits you, but not if it means putting yourself in danger. Allies are nice and all but what's important here is your goals, and you need to be around to fulfill them.

1 hour ago, penpenpen said:

As a GM, I might be tempted to reinstate the confiscating PC-rule on hitting zero, leaving 1-30 open for those who want to play darkside anti-heroes, but I'd rather not if I can find something that's more conducive to character play. Maybe once you go dark side (sub-30) you can no longer use darkside pips for selfless acts? Sure, you can still aid your allies working for a goal that benefits you, but not if it means putting yourself in danger. Allies are nice and all but what's important here is your goals, and you need to be around to fulfill them.

Lame. Would you do a similar move on somebody that hits Morality 100? At that point they're too light side to be real people too, right?

Note: all instances of * are for footnotes rather than filtering

In a game we are just starting to assemble... none of my players haunt the forums so I can type freely... will contain a different but related situation: A Jedi character (takes place during the Clone Wars) starting off having fallen to the Dark Side u nbeknownst the others characters/players (the actual player knows this of course but the character himself is in blind denial). The character is amicable if austere and believes firmly in "the will of the Force". Sadly, the war has taken its toll and the character cannot feel the Force as clearly as he once did. To make matters worse, he is mistaking his own impulses for the will of the Force (it is a more comforting than the idea that Force might just be ignoring him). Simply put, the character really believes that he is on the exact right path even when having veered off of it (how this will actually manifest in game remains to be seen) and that is ultimately what the player wants to explore: a road to doom paved with good intentions.
The actual plot involves rumors of artificially inducing Force Sensitivity. The intended end game (with various paths that can avoid it) is for this wayward soul to be the "final boss"* so to speak as he decides, with much sorrow if little hesitation, to kill the party rather than risk the secret** getting out.

Anyhoo... The idea of evil being unaware that it is evil*** feels like it fits right in that 0 - 30 Morality spot.

* We created the game working backwards from this twist

** Added tragedy: its all false anyway

*** Some comics writers have enjoyed portraying the likes of Sinestro and even Lex Luthor this way, clearly villians to the reader but in their own minds convinced that they serve the greater good

2 hours ago, Darth Revenant said:

Don't have to be on the side of the rebellion just because you're a light sider. Or freelance dark sider. You could just try to survive and figure out what's up with that whole moving stuff with your mind powers and general strangeness while trying to stay one step ahead of all the bad things in the galaxy that are after you. I actually kind of prefer those stories, they tend to be more introspective and spiritualistic where you explore the essence of the force rather than just clash laser swords. Clashing laser swords is also fun, but if that's the only focus then I'm probably not going to stay interested for very long.

That's interesting, a dark side Force user that's aiding the Rebellion, using their power to topple the Empire, even if only for self-preservation given the Empire's zero-tolerance policy for active Force users that aren't on Palps' payroll. Maybe not as extreme a Saw Guerrara's crew, but probably a lot more willing to get their hands dirty than saw the Spectres of SW:Rebels. I've toyed with the idea myself a few times for a few different campaigns, but never opted to follow through on concerns that such a character would clash with the other PCs who were generally more noble-minded.

As for introspective/spiritualistic, those can be interesting, though the trick is to not overdo it and wind up having the bulk of your adventures be extended navel-gazing sessions. This is after all Star Wars, a setting that owes its existence to the action-fueled 40's film serials, where the heroes rarely get deeply introspective. Not saying it can't be done, but there's bound to be nights when your players are more keen to smack around some bad guys than they are to contemplate their place in the grand galactic design.

23 minutes ago, penpenpen said:

Also, you're posting style makes you come off as a Richard. If this is intentional or something you take pride in, you might very well be one. Might I suggest that you try a more polite tone, if not a friendlier one? Behavior reminiscent of a petasum asinus is not overly conducive to an open debate climate.

You've been reported. Now you're being Ignored too.

9 hours ago, HappyDaze said:

You've been reported. Now you're being Ignored too.

Thanks for clearing up any any confusion towards your intended tone.