Talking with my friend today, he made some good points. It's too good at two things to be costed enough to be worth putting in a squad for either.

IS IT A CREW CARRIER?; With 3 crew slots (most likely no gunner) 1 tech if not 2, coordinate, & added jam, along with the most shields in the game to date, it will cost no less than 62 points out of the gate for the generic. Which means to deck it out with Snoke at least 15 points (10 for force user, 5 for informant x2 ability) and / or Kylo at least at 14 (10 force user, 4 ability) that's 91 points base as they lay out possible for the article example. Throw in the named pilot and you're closing in on half your list. That's a lot for a ship that will fire perhaps no more than 3 times a game against a decent player. (Dial is the same and no rear arc.) Compare that to the Imperial Lambda at 43, the YV-666 base generic at 58, and laugh at how terrible it is for the amount of points you're sinking into it. Want to run stress mechanics with Phasma and Thannison? We're paying no less than 8 points each for them (we know Sloane is going to be priced up above that 10 eventually.) Too easy to dodge the primary arc and fly around it at distance with no improvements to the dial. A point trap that will bleed MOV and lose people competitive matches.

IS IT A HAMMER?; Sure, 4 primary is great---when you get to point it at something. Again, maybe 3 shots in a whole game against a good opponent, and probably none of them modified because the utility is better for support. Kinda . Linked battery is a joke; You're paying a cannon tax on the upgrade bar already. Ghost is at 70 points base. It has zero agility, and while it has 2 more health it's in hull that dissolves like butter on Tattooine. That 4 primary and 1 agility we're paying for, no doubt, given the amount that Moldy Crow and Punishing One cost. So what is 62 points might be closer to 64. Really, the math and precedent is there that 66 might be the baseline. And maybe you get one joust with this playstyle, that is, if the opponent is dumb enough to fly towards you. Just flank and eat the Upsilon at range 2-3. Or watch it melt to Jonus bombers or Inferno Squadron or 4 x-wings with pro-torps. Because the First Order's other ships are going to be undoubtedly more expensive than their imperial counterparts by at least 2-3 points a ship, having suitable wingmates to draw aggro off our 80-90 point is a snowball's chance in Mustafar of being combat relevant. Seriously, just shoot this thing anytime it is on the table. Get points easy. If we're not really seeing the VCXs in play right now with a k-turn, synergy crew rebel options and a turret, is it any mystery what will happen here?

So what is it supposed to do best except be too pricey for what it won't get to do well at either?

Yeah, this is where people say the obligatory "BUT WE DON'T KNOW THE PRICES YET" but c'mon. If we've been playing this game for any length of time, we're not going to get this ship for the cost of a scum Falcon. My buddy put it best; This is a ship that should have had a two primary, with that cannon option, and priced as a Lambda perhaps 12 points higher. We don't ever even see it really fire to warrant that 4 primary. Anything north of 60 points to a 66 point spread, this thing is going to collect dust outside of lighthearted casual play with 4 to 5 F/Os or a Silencer or 3 S/Fs.

Swing and a miss on design. Hate to say it but there's just no way they price this at anything reasonable to warrant the MOV bleed. Does anyone really believe they will allow 3 of these to hit the table with a focus on reducing red dice creep in 2.0? No, they had to make it sound really cool with expensive FO crew options and make you want to put half your list into it, and that's why the real price of the base pilot is going to be not 62, not 64 or 66, but... wait for it... 67 points.

You heard it here first.

Off my First Order soapbox. I'm still going to fly the **** thing but never in a tournament. Gimme Kylo as a wingman and a dark red dream of silence to entertain me in the meanwhile.

I will fly it for sure. But alas, I agree with you on all these points. Was hoping it would get the phantom treatment of nerfs so as to make affordable and thus viable. But...

I can't remember if I cried, when I read about Snoke's pricey ride. Don't care who its gonna fly; it kept its 4th red die. So:

I planned on selling my FO stuff anyways. Looks like this is even more reason, not to mention my distaste for the new movies. So am pretty happy that FFG has separated the new movie content from the originals.

I love DOA posts on ships we still don't have the whole information on. Jumpmasters were DOA before they were released in 1.0 too.

While I appreciate the thought you've put into this, I think you're examining the ship in a vacuum. I suspect that we'll get it on the table with either 2x reasonably terrifying wingmen, or 4x chill inducing generics. Again, ignore the wingmen and go for the slow mover, and a good commander will make you pay for it.

32 minutes ago, Cloaker said:

You  heard it here f  irst. 

Yeah, not so much. 9 hours ago, literally the first response to one of the threads announcing the article

Quote

If the new Upsilon costs the same as the 1e Upsilon did, it'll be DOA. 

Of course, everyone else in the thread was saying the ship is good, so....

5 minutes ago, JasonCole said:

While I appreciate the thought you've put into this, I think you're examining the ship in a vacuum. I suspect that we'll get it on the table with either 2x reasonably terrifying wingmen, or 4x chill inducing generics. Again, ignore the wingmen and go for the slow mover, and a good commander will make you pay for it.

True, especially considering the versatility of PTL is gone along with passive mods. It will be more viable than before. But think of the sheer power if it dropped a die for full support!

3 minutes ago, JasonCole said:

While I appreciate the thought you've put into this, I think you're examining the ship in a vacuum. I suspect that we'll get it on the table with either 2x reasonably terrifying wingmen, or 4x chill inducing generics. Again, ignore the wingmen and go for the slow mover, and a good commander will make you pay for it.

Large base for a ship that doesn't want to be stressed that thankfully can't castle any further and do a zero maneuver? A nything but a slow mover.

You're probably right about the vacuum though.... OF SILENCE THAT MUST TERRIFY ?

1 minute ago, Forgottenlore said:

Yeah, not so much. 9 hours ago, literally the first response to one of the threads announcing the article

Of course, everyone else in the thread was saying the ship is good, so....

The points, brother. That's my call shot in the dark. 67. If they dare price it at below 60, then all the talk of it being broken and NPE to play against with the stress mechanisms can commence.

15 minutes ago, Archangelspiv said:

I love DOA posts on ships we still don't have the whole information on. Jumpmasters were DOA before they were released in 1.0 too.

If they throw in a pivot wing configuration I'll happily retract every negative thing I've said. You have my word.

I'm sure that the First Order's only large base ship that can also hold Kylo + Snoke will be DOA. I mean, the best way to get to stop having to print a faction's ships is to ruin it right out of the gate, right?

2 minutes ago, Cloaker said:

If they throw in a pivot wing configuration I'll happily retract every negative thing I've said. You have my word.

I am not saying your post is wrong, you may have the best precognition powers on the forum. I am just saying, lets just wait and see. There is not one ship that has been released in 2.0 that is DOA atm, some are crazy expensive because they are great a la Defenders, but I think FFG are on the right path atm with these ships.

Although I do think some ships are a little overcosted, like Scum Fenn.

...You're joking right? It's a coordinate platform you don't dare get in front of.

56 minutes ago, Archangelspiv said:

Although I do think some ships are a little overcosted, like Scum Fenn.

See, and I think that Scum Fenn is very well costed. I just won a tourney with him, and I only lost him once (to a loose stabilizer crit with 1 hp left facing the edge of the board...).

I'm really hoping the Upsilon clocks in at about 60 points. I ran a for-fun list with Dormitz and two generics, all with hyperspace comms to deploy last and well into the field. I hope to be able to run it again in 2.0.

17 minutes ago, Captain Lackwit said:

...You're joking right? It's a coordinate platform you don't dare get in front of.

Easily flanked. Sabine Wren in an Attack Shuttle can take one out one on one. Maybe even two.

59 minutes ago, Archangelspiv said:

I am not saying your post is wrong, you may have the best precognition powers on the forum. I am just saying, lets just wait and see. There is not one ship that has been released in 2.0 that is DOA atm, some are crazy expensive because they are great a la Defenders, but I think FFG are on the right path atm with these ships.

Although I do think some ships are a little overcosted, like Scum Fenn.

I agree wholeheartedly overall. I love 2.0 and 95% of what has been put together.

1 hour ago, JasonCole said:

I'm sure that the First Order's only large base ship that can also hold Kylo + Snoke will be DOA. I mean, the best way to get to stop having to print a faction's ships is to ruin it right out of the gate, right?

If it clocks in over 95 points? Yup. Pretty much a non starter. 48 points half pointed puts it over the 33 / 41 baseline for trade point play.

We’ll see what other crew options it gets. If it has a way to manage the stress so that it doesn’t spend three turns trying to get turned around, then it’ll be fine.

A Pivot Wing title or something equivalent would go a long way. Not just competitively but also in the 'feels like the ship' sense, since it seemed pretty comfortable sitting above the gun line in TLJ indefinitely.

yeah the upsilon feels weird...

They gave it a cannon slot? With a beefed up cannon baked in ability...on a 4die ship? What? Who the **** is going to use a tractor/ion cannon instead of their main 4die gun? Only time id ever see that used is HLC but its going to be uber hard to land that attack. Atleast Stridan is still a thing, his ability was dope.

Also imo snoke is horrible. R1 is the main range you'd want that ability, not the only one but the main one. That shouldnt be a 2 crew slot for such a meager ability.

1 hour ago, MortalPlague said:

I'm really hoping the Upsilon clocks in at about 60 points. I ran a for-fun list with Dormitz and two generics, all with hyperspace comms to deploy last and well into the field. I hope to be able to run it again in 2.0.

I am the same, I just started using a Stridan, Omega Ace and 2 PS 1 TIE/fo's before 2.0 hit. I really enjoyed it, with comm relay the fo's were really hard to kill.

I am guessing Basic TIE/fo's will be about 27-28 points, meaning the base Upsilon should be around 60ish at a guess.

BUT.... I am just waiting like a crazy person for the Silencer and the FO Interceptor to be dropped.

I don't think we should count this out yet.

Kylo is a pilot on this thing with two force, right? That means when able this thing can look at 3 dials.

Secondly, with supernatural reflexes on the kylo pilot and the sizeable health to risk it, this thing can get around pretty fast.

Lastly, if the force isn't used up, here is another ship that has 3 force available.

I bet this combo is very expensive, but we will have to wait and see how powerful.

7 minutes ago, Bodacious2182 said:

Kylo is a pilot on this thing with two force, right? That means when able this thing can look at 3 dials  .

We don't know if Kylo is a pilot for the Upsilon or not yet. Only the two pilots have been spoiled so far.

6 hours ago, Cloaker said:

You  heard it here  first  .

Ah yes, that‘s the point of your post isn‘t it. The reason you made it, so you can claim a ‚first‘

Ok, but then I expect another thread if the generic is cheaper than 62pt, if Snoke is below 15, if Kylo is below 14, if Phasma is below 8, or generally if the Upsilon places in a Top8 of a large tournament.

6 hours ago, Cloaker said:

i  t  will cost no less than 62

6 hours ago, Cloaker said:

that's  why the real price of the base pilot is going to be not 62, not 64 or 66, but... wait for it... 67 points.

5 hours ago, Cloaker said:

If  t  hey dare price it at below 60, then all the talk of it being broken and NPE to play against with the stres  s mechanisms can commence.    

So below 60 is broken and NPE, 67 is DOA. 62 is your safety net so you can hedge your bet.

That leaves FFG 60 or 61pts. Even if we don‘t know the upgrades in the pack or future ones.

You heard it here first. 60 or 61, everything else is

6 hours ago, Cloaker said:

S   wing  and a miss on design.