8 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

In other words: you have to actually use skill to keep soontir alive, you can't just rely on upgrades.

He's actually MORE powerful than in 1e in the hands of a skilled player; he will be getting shot just as much (i.e. 0, functionally, because in 1e he'd be out of arc and therefore safe (except that he doesn't have PS advantage in 1e), but he will get an offensive reroll he couldn't get in 1e.

More skill yes, more powerful No.

7 minutes ago, jocke01 said:

More skill yes, more powerful No.

More powerful yes.

How is he getting offensive rerolls in 1e?

He should be just as survivable, if you git gud.

7 minutes ago, Astech said:

Predator's the price now of Crack Shot in 1.0, and CS was considered a good EPT. In terms of absolute power yes, classic Predator is better, but relative to the cost - and assuming you're a good enough player to get 3 bullseyes in a game with a high-PS ace like Soontir, new Predator is definitely better.

Lone Wolf is definitively worse, no dout about it. But it was by far the strongest individual card in 1.0, so that's to be expected.

The old (and only ever good) Soontir Fel with PTL, SD and Autos was 35 points. 39 if you include half the cost of the inevitable Palp backup. For this you got a single-modded 3-die attack on a PS 9 frame with a meagre 3 hull. Not only was Soontir absolutely wrecked by all of the wave 8+ meta, he was so innefectual at doing damage that you might as well have taken a huge bid instead of him.

Contrast this to the new Predator Fel (no mods) for just 54 [27] squad points. Double reposition inherent ability, a synergistic and relatively easy to achieve pilot ability and EPT, a PS that's as high as it will (presumably) ever go, and a presence in a meta where all bombs are dropped before movement, and mines are severely nerfed. This new Soontir is in a meta for which he's perfectly suited, and he's there to stay for at least waves 1-2. Of course, now he requires actual skill to fly, rather than the ridiculous token stacks of 1.0.

Wave 8+ yes, that is why I Said att his time. By the time of 8+ waves 1.0 was getting weird.

Predator is cheaper, but worse and harder to trigger. Crack shot is awesome, that fact don't impact predator though. It's not bad, but going from 1-2 re-rolls everytime to 1 in case of bullseye front arc is a huge downgrade in Power.

He is powerful sure, but 3hp and a max blocking of 3 dmg means he can be killed far easier than before.

Either way I feel he is just fine for the game atm.

6 minutes ago, jocke01 said:

Predator is cheaper, but worse and harder to trigger. Crack shot is awesome, that fact don't impact predator though. It's not bad, but going from 1-2 re-rolls everytime to 1 in case of bullseye front arc is a huge downgrade in Power.

On a related matter; what's more powerful, a large jet engine or a balloon? Did I mention that both are in the vacuum of space? All 'power' is relative.

And the new predator, relative to all other passive mods, is very good in 2.0. First edition predator was just an okay card by the time Expertise came out.

Just now, thespaceinvader said:

More powerful yes.

How is he getting offensive rerolls in 1e?

He should be just as survivable, if you git gud.

Palpatine or he didn't. There are of course ways to give target locks, but I didn't seem them used much. He was however so hard to hit.

Just as survivable with a maximum of 3 blocks and no turret protection? Sure I guess you are right.

IMO Sontir is balanced. He is a glass cannon, low hp and good offensive Power and he relies on arc dodging and lucky rolls to survive. Before he was so hard to hit unless hem stood in your front arc at range 1.

Git Gud or not, he isn't as tanky anymore.

2 minutes ago, Astech said:

On a related matter; what's more powerful, a large jet engine or a balloon? Did I mention that both are in the vacuum of space? All 'power' is relative.

And the new predator, relative to all other passive mods, is very good in 2.0. First edition predator was just an okay card by the time Expertise came out.

I don't know about the baloons, but the old predator did had more impact on dice results.

Yeah, sure expertise was another crazy card, but predator was One of the best generic upgrade cards for several waves.

Anyway I like 2.0 and this debate is getting nowhere. Gl and have fun.

Old Fel was nearly immune to damage at range three. New Fel is a delicate flower at range three and dies just as fast as an academy pilot at that range. New Fel is much weaker, but the things he feared most are gone from the game, so he’s probably more viable than wave 13 Fel.