Assassin is crouched on the roof of a building. Tech-Priest and a Temp Guardsman (The player forgot his character sheet.) a few floors down. And a Scum at another window a few floors down.

Guardsman spots an (Dark) Eldar Jet bike outside an open window of the building across the street. He then lets everyone in the party know.

The Tech-Priest asks the Assassin "Can you jump on to the bike to take him out?" "I'm not sure I'll try." Replies the Assassin. "Ok lets take it out" says the Tech-Priest.

"OK Role Initiative everyone." Says The GM. The Assassin has the highest (Even after she for got to Double her AB due to lightning Reflexes.) "What are you going to do?" Asks the GM. "I'm going to try to jump onto the back of the Jetbike (It was a two seater.) and take him out." Says the Assassin. "You can't do that!" says the Guardsman. "Why?" asks the Assassin. "Because I'm going to open fire on him." Says the Guardsman. "Well you can do that after." The Assassin says "No I'll be doing it as soon as he says fire." Comes from the Guardsman. "But I go first, I have the highest Initiative." The Assassin says.

The Assassin Turn: Leap up lets her stand as a free action, A successful Acrobatics check lets her land on the back of the bike, Quick Draw gets her knife ready and a half-action sticks it in the (Dark) Eldar's neck who then looses his balance and falls. (Breaking his legs when he hits the street below.) The Guardsman fires at the bike and hits the bike, The Tech-Priest Also shoots the bike. The Scum Shoots the engine of the Jetbike with an explosive arrow. "Can I try to Doge that?" The Assassin asks. "You can try to doge through the window as its open, Make a Doge Check followed by an Acrobatics Check to see how you land if you make the Doge." says the GM. (Passed both checks with ease.)

"You land in through the window as the bike explodes behind you. There is another (Dark) Eldar in front of you. He is starting the sacrifice of a naked young woman that is hanging by hooks from the ceiling. Now that everyone else had their turn it's your turn again what are you going to do?" Quick draw My auto guns, Called shot Body, Full Auto both weapons. (The Assassin has 2 recoil gloves and some handy abilities like 2 Weapon Ballistic, Ambidextrous, Sharpshooter, Lightning Attack.) She rolls 34 Her Ballistic Skill is 44 then +20 for going full auto + 10 Special Rules for Red dot on the gun + 10 for short range. She cleaves the body in two. "I didn't shoot him in the head." She calls out the window. "I need some help to get this one down she says Ripping the hooks out of the girl. (She has no medical training and poor fellowship but at least she has stoped sticking her fingers in the holes. She was told that didn't work.)

The problem that we have had is that We haven't stoped arguing about weather or not the Assassin could make it onto the bike. I found some videos of Free runners and if people can do it in RL then I don't see why we wouldn't be able to do it in game.

Now the guy that was the Guardsman says that she wouldn't of been able to Dodge the bullets that he was shooting at the bike and that he would have shot her. (Even though he shot the bike and she made the Doge roll to avoid being blown up by the exploding bike.)

Narissa said:

Awesome story; the GM sounds like s/he's got a good grasp of the game mechanics; and the other player needs to stop arguing both in and out of game.

• First: an initiative order was established and followed.
• Second: The player of the guardsman sounds like he was deliberately attempting to kill your assassin. Tech-priest asked you to do something and the Guardsman continued in his action to shoot the jetbike despite seeing you succeed in boarding it; as did the Tech-Priest and the Scum.
• Third: Your point that you didn't dodge the incoming fire, so much as cleared the blast radius of the detonating bike. If the guardsman wants to argue that you couldn't have dodged the bullets, it clearly needs to be pointed out that he and the others were NOT shooting YOU, but the bike. If he continues to argue, then it's pretty obvious he was intending to kill your PC in the exchange somehow.

Just my thoughts.

-=Brother Praetus=-

Brother Praetus said:

""You land in through the window as the bike explodes behind you. There is another (Dark) Eldar in front of you. He is starting the sacrifice of a naked young woman that is hanging by hooks from the ceiling. Now that everyone else had their turn it's your turn again what are you going to do?" Quick draw My auto guns, Called shot Body, Full Auto both weapons. (The Assassin has 2 recoil gloves and some handy abilities like 2 Weapon Ballistic, Ambidextrous, Sharpshooter, Lightning Attack.) She rolls 34 Her Ballistic Skill is 44 then +20 for going full auto + 10 Special Rules for Red dot on the gun + 10 for short range. She cleaves the body in two. "I didn't shoot him in the head." She calls out the window. "I need some help to get this one down she says Ripping the hooks out of the girl. (She has no medical training and poor fellowship but at least she has stoped sticking her fingers in the holes. She was told that didn't work.)"

For future reference, the Laser Sight does not work with Full-Auto gun fire, only single shots. I'm also fairly certain you cannot Full-Auto both weapons while dual wielding.

Narissa said:

Nice, someone in the party really doesn't like your character.

The first things that I notice here though are that a red dot only works on single shot, two-weapon weilder allows a single attack with both weapons not full auto, and quick draw can be used to ready a single item each round not two.

Having said that, my book isn't with me at the moment and it does make a good story.

Edit: remove repeated quote.

zethliss said:

Red-Dot sights do indeed only work for single shots (although a targeter would give +10 to everything) but both weapons can be fired on full-auto (or any combination of fire modes) when using the Multiple Attacks action. Quick Draw makes readying a weapon a Free Action and there is no limit to the number of Free Actions a character can reasonably take in a round, so readying two weapons at once is acceptable.

{Edited for clarity.}

zethliss said:

Is there errata for the TWF rules on pg197?

• When firing a ranged weapon with each hand, you may fire each weapon on a different mode, for example, one on full automatic and one on semi-automatic. When firing a full automatic weapon in each hand, you may only lay down one area of suppressive fire.

Quickdraw (page 121 DH Core book)

Free action that allows you to have a weapon ready in your hand.

The rulebook doesnt state explicitly that its one weapon/hand only.

If the character was Ambidextrous/2 weapon wielder, then i'd hand wave it and say "sure why not, its more cinematic, they do it the films all the time"

Its not the refs place to debilitate a character if they have talents/abilities that offer great sinergy and make sense.

Unless the player is a whingey little snot then let the assassin have her moment i say!

But if you were point blank, going full auto on some one it's going to be messy one way or the other.

The Recoil gloves allow you to use a Basic weapon (the autoguns your assassin is fond of) single handedly.

Again, it was all very cinematic reading it like that, so kudos to the ref for allowing players to be able to tweak the rules to their fun and enjoyment.

After all, if You can do it, so can the others (with the right talents) and so can the enemy...

Rule one about roleplaying: have fun.

CptCaine said:

She suppressive fired in to the eldars guts

The Assassin did well! Very cinematic, very cool, and all very legal by the rules. I'd say that is what a good combat scene looks like! And to any naysayers that say the assassin can't jump on the bike, the GM said that she could. Case closed.

Anyways, it seems your other fellows have no idea how turn order works. Until you're up, you don't need to be stuck into any actions (outside mitigating circumstances like Deja Vu). Next time you meet your Inquisitor, the Assassin could present a very credible case that her "comrades" tried to kill her. After all, they opened fire on her after the enemy had left the fire zone. They're going to be in for some tough questions.

Velvetears said:

Well, that's the thing about suppressive fire: you can suppress people somewhat with it or suppress them totally and forever if you're aiming to suppress body parts instead of people .

Narissa said:

Like numb3rc said, GM said you could do it, so you could do it. Who cares if it's really possible. Psychic lightning bolts, man portable laser weapons and faster than light travel aren't possible either... but they're part of the game.

Narissa said:

The rules essentially say you can Dodge bullets, las blasts, plasma beams, melta rays, arrows, thrown knives, rocks, broken bottles and anything else someone might toss at you using that Ballistics Skills. That's half of what the Dodge skill is for... melee attacks using Weapons Skill being the other half.

The guy playing the Guardsman is being an (I probably can't use that world here but it starts with "a") and you can tell him I said so.

LuciusT said:

Indeed. It might seem a bit silly, but you can try to dodge any ranged attack. He has to consider that if you can't dodge that attack then no one can really dodge anything most of the time because of how uncommon primitive weapons can be on more civilized worlds. This is about as wrong as you can get with the rules.

numb3rc said:

Bombernoy said:

Just a little

If the Guardsman really wants to cause problems for you, he should just point out the rule violations, lol.

I can empathize with him though; Assassins are just flat out better than the Guardsman to the point where it's rage inducing.

I agree with all of the above - I'm extremely confused as to why they shot at the bike???

maybe they thought as that was thier intent then they had to even if you suceeded?

Very cool, I wish my assasins were that cool!

I'd probably have allowed the DE a dodge roll to get the hell out of thier though fouling your day, depending on if I thought he could see you, but then again with that absolutely cool outcome I think I'd just go for, let him do it.

GM let ya. Ya rolled realy well. It lead to more cool stuff and mad fore great story telling. Tell the others to stuff it. That was ausomesauce!

Indeed!

Dodge can be used to move into cover, as per special rules in the Inquisitors Handbook. Dodging blast or flame weapons also lets you move up to your Agility Bonus in metres away, so I see no problem with dodging through a window.

The only thing that was "wrong" in this story was that you cannot make called shots to a specific body part with auto-fire. And so he might very well have shot him in the head...

Lasers said:

Lasers said:

What rule violations? The red dot site? Sounds like that is something the gm allows in his game and that is that. One cannot pull "rule violations" on the gms house rules - creating house rulings is his right. As others have pointed out, everything else on the Assassins side seems legit.

Perhaps the gm is one of those that says "state your actions at the beginning of the round and no changes", that is the only reason I can imagine why the others would start firing at the bike ... especially considering the tech priest told the assassin to do just that.

As GM I would look the players directly in the eye after their little stunt and say "he magically survives your ooc attempts to kill him - you both lose one fate point."

Edit: There seems to be some odd problems occurring with the quote system, ignore that.

Darth Smeg said:

While this point about called shots is true, it sounded to me like the Assassin wasn't doing a true "called shot" but simply stating the obvious - when you draw a gun on someone and fire, especially at point blank range, you're aiming for the body. And unless there was a good reason for destroying the Eldar's head, why punish your players by enforcing - what was under those circumstances - a pointless rules detail.

Jack of Tears said:

I told them to shoot at the bike anyway as I was tring to avoid the whole argument and said that it would all happen more or less at the same time with seconds between any actions made and I was sure I could Doge our use a fate point to stop myself from being faitly wonded by my team mates.

The Tech-Priest and Guardsman was in the middle of the lobby of the building (I thought they were a few floors up but I have been told they were on the ground floor.) The Scum was on the second floor and I was on the roof. The Dark Eldar was on a two seater bike outside the window of the 4th floor of a building on the other side of the street. It was raining. (All mods were applied to my rolls.)

Our Gm asked what we were doing after a brief argument about what point turns begin.

The Guardsman past a perception check based on sound to hear the bike, told our Tech-Priest leader that he heard it, and set an ambush. During that conversation the Tech-Priest had said "Can you jump onto the bike and take him out?" To me and I said "I'll try." (Which now according to the guardsman was after he had already started shooting.) I use Leap up and start to run readdy for the leap once my initiative phase starts. Tech-Priest also get into a position to fire, and says "Take it out." Our Scum smashed the window that was in front of him so he would have a clear shot with his crossbow.

Our guards man said that as he was in position he would of started firing before initiative was applied and that the GM was wrong to say that we get a free action to get into position but then it goes in initiative Order.

The GM said that the Guardsman does not decide when initiative becomes relevant.

and that our Free actions prior to going into Initiative were:

Guardsman: Relays info about what he has heard on the coms and moves into position to fire.

Tech-Priest: Asks "Can you jump on the Bike?" Moves into position to fire.

Assassin: Starts her run ready to leap onto the bike, knife in hand.

Scum: Smashes window and readies weapon to fire.

Tech-Priest: "Take it out."

Combat begins in order of initiative.

I don't see a problem here but maybe that's because I am the Assassin...

Oh I hadn't realised about the called shot thing I think our GM had either decided I was quite close so It hadn't mattered, or was upset by the Argument about my leaping onto the bike that he hadn't realised just what I'd done at that point.

Narissa said:

Sounds to me like the Guardsman needs to get smacked upside the head with the fact that he is not the GM. The GM gets to decide these things. That's what the GM does and the GM is not wrong. Even when the GM is wrong, the GM is not wrong.

I'm confused. Is a player really still arguing, after the game, that he should have hit/killed another player when "supposedly" that was not his intention. Sounds to me like someone needs a Krak Grenade in their morning cereal. Just to remind them that everyone's supposed to get along. I think the Assassin's actions are what games are all about... crazy stunts, acrobatics and shooting holes in lots of things really fast. Bravo!

(I note that the IG was not using his main character so maybe feels that he can act irresponsibly without consequences...)

You're an assassin. Kill him and take his stuff.

If I had GMed this scene, I would have ruled the assassin spends one turn freefalling before she gets to the bike (I don't know how big that building was but I guess there are a few floors between the roof and the 4th). So, by the time she hits the bike, it would probably already have exploded and she would be headed for the street (I would have allowed her an Agility roll to catch the window, with appropriate damage for the strain on muscle and sinews). Bad coordination in a team is a killer...