So here I have a few questions to discuss about the Jumpmaster.

1) Which is the best pilot?

2a) Is the punishing one title worth it?

2b) Is the Punishing one title worth it over proton torpedoes?

3) How Valuable is I6 for Dengar?

4) Is expert Handling a must?

5) What role does it best play?

6) Who's her best wing mate?

All other questions are welcome.

To go through the my own questions I would say 1) Me personally I think Tel is probably the best with proton torps and hull upgrade and expert handling. 2) No because atm crew are so much better then droids and you get much better value with proton torps as it gives you a 2 4 dice attack and doesn't remove the crew for 1 point more. 3) This one I'm really not sure about as I've not been able to play 2.0 at all yet and Im not sure how important initiative will be with the pre-meta seeming to be going towards generic swarms. Saying that being able to move after aces is a huge counter to those specific lists. 4) Yes. The reason I say this is because atm there isn't really that many good EPTs so for what expert handling does and especially with the new dial it makes it a must. 5) The role I feel the JM5K is no longer the ship that carries in a battle but is more the wingman that can hurt and is Tanky 6) Like I said just before I think she is more of the wingman for a ship like Boba or maybe a 3 ship list with two cheap aces.

This could be decent:

(60) Tel Trevura
(4) L3-37
(9) Proton Torpedoes
(6) Expert Handling
(5) Hull Upgrade
Points 84

(38) Palob Godalhi
(8) Lando Calrissian
(12) Moldy Crow
Points 58

(42) Kavil
(4) Han Solo
(2) R4 Astromech
(2) Expert Handling
(6) Ion Cannon Turret
Points 56

Total points: 198

In isolation you can make a Jumpmaster that looks halfway decent. Then you compare it to the Lancer you can buy for the same price and you realise it's bad. Then you remember that the Lancer is bad already. Then you put the Jumpmaster down and do something else instead.

17 minutes ago, SOTL said:

In isolation you can make a Jumpmaster that looks halfway decent. Then you compare it to the Lancer you can buy for the same price and you realise it's bad. Then you remember that the Lancer is bad already. Then you put the Jumpmaster down and do something else instead.

I see your comparison to the Lancer and raise you the Lando Falcon...

Yeah, and then you compare it to the Lando Falcon and go 'man, power creep right from wave 1 sure is aggressive'.

4 minutes ago, SOTL said:

Yeah, and then you compare it to the Lando Falcon and go 'man, power creep right from wave 1 sure is aggressive'.

Personally I think 'the designers are actively penalising stuff which was considered highly overpowered in 1e with the intention of them not being meta staples'.

How about I call your Lando Falcon then add the Jumpaster with a bid to have 2 I6 Ships?

I think that's happening for sure, but I also think Landos Falcon is out ahead of the curve already.

I tend to figure Dengar could be decent. With Punishing One (not sure if it's worth on non-Dengar ships...), he's 72 points before anything else, and double-attacks for that cheap seems potentially viable. Personally, I kinda think Expert Handling is worthwhile on Dengar--he's got Init 6, so you might as well leverage it. R5-P8 seems like a decent droid. Charges aren't great, but consider: something like Predator might only trigger 2 or 3 times in a game, so is a full-arc ability which can be used only 3 times that much worse? Anyhow, that'd be 82 grand total for a double-attacking Init 6 who can white barrel roll and get rerolls without actions. Maybe the dial is bad enough that it won't work out on table, but on paper, I think it looks like a decent enough use of points.

Here's an odd thought: how would R5 Astromech be on Tel? He probably has longer time-frame for chucking damage cards than most ships. Probably not good enough, but it was running through my head.

1 hour ago, SOTL said:

I think that's happening for sure, but I also think Landos Falcon is out ahead of the curve already.

How do people get around its low damage output?

Really with the Lando falcon? In practice, I've found it an utter waste of points outside role as a cheapo blocker and Xizor sponge

Obstruction is NOT easy to engineer with Han or anyone

Anyway, let's compare JM5k

New Squadron

(64) Dengar
(8) Punishing One
(3) Fearless
(4) R5-P8
(6) Shield Upgrade
Points 85

OR

(68) Sabine Wren
(3) Fearless
(6) Shadow Caster
(10) Perceptive Copilot
(2) Tactical Scrambler
Points 89

OR

(80) Boba Fett
(4) L3-37
(3) Marauder
(4) Han Solo
Points 91

---------

+

(38) Palob Godalhi
(8) Lando Calrissian
(12) Moldy Crow
Points 58

(43) Serissu
(5) Ion Cannon
Points 48

Dengar's points are weird in that they're cheaper but not enough to add a fourth ship worth a ****. Can fit elusive on Seri

So far, actually had the most fun with Sabine just acting as a ****** wall for Palob/Seri. List gets ridiculously tanky

Havnt tried dengar yet. Idk, not confident in that dial + statline (no big defensive mods) despite offensive potential

2 hours ago, SOTL said:

In isolation you can make a Jumpmaster that looks halfway decent. Then you compare it to the Lancer you can buy for the same price and you realise it's bad. Then you remember that the Lancer is bad already. Then you put the Jumpmaster down and do something else instead.

This is exactly my experience so far. I think they’ll reduce the price.

27 minutes ago, Admiral Deathrain said:

How do people get around its low damage output?

1. Stack +1 dice mods
2. Keep it cheap so the opponent doesn't make it your priority
3. Skirt around rocks and pew pew inwards to the main fight

I think it's essential to keep the cost down because the second that the scum Falcon becomes your opponent's target priority it loses a ton of value - you stop getting obstructed shots, you start having to burn actions on boosting or rotating arcs instead of modding your attacks. I run it at 68pts so I'm bringing a Falcon to the table for 34pts (old money) and that's crazy good value.

• Han Solo - Trick Shot, 0-0-0, Lando's Falcon, Rigged Cargo Chute (68)

Skirt around the outside throwing dice in, then at the right point change it up and dive in for spreading stress with 0-0-0 and RCC. In the ultimate magical christmas land you can throw 6 red dice at somebody, say if they dropped into your RCC behind you... 2 dice + range + Han + Trick Shot + Stress = 6 dice. 34pts.

2 hours ago, SOTL said:

I think that's happening for sure, but I also think Landos Falcon is out ahead of the curve already.

Not really, if you add 2 hull upgrades to a K-Wing, it has the same cost, hp, attack dice, and firing arcs of the generic. If you factor in that the generic mods are supposed to be inefficient, that makes up the rest of the difference. The named pilots feel pretty cheap, but none of them have ball bustingly good pilot abilities either, you're mostly paying for the Initiative with an occasional bonus.

At worst, it's off by 2, maybe 4pts on a stretch.

I think too many people read Falcon and mentally conjure attack 3, but it only has situational ways to roll more than 2 dice and a 2 dice 46pt ship is suboptimal.

12 minutes ago, MasterShake2 said:

Not really, if you add 2 hull upgrades to a K-Wing, it has the same cost, hp, attack dice, and firing arcs of the generic. If you factor in that the generic mods are supposed to be inefficient, that makes up the rest of the difference. The named pilots feel pretty cheap, but none of them have ball bustingly good pilot abilities either, you're mostly paying for the Initiative with an occasional bonus.

At worst, it's off by 2, maybe 4pts on a stretch.

I think too many people read Falcon and mentally conjure attack 3, but it only has situational ways to roll more than 2 dice and a 2 dice 46pt ship is suboptimal.

That was definitely my opinion before I put it into the table. Those situational effects happen pretty often.

46 minutes ago, SOTL said:

1. Stack +1 dice mods
2. Keep it cheap so the opponent doesn't make it your priority
3. Skirt around rocks and pew pew inwards to the main fight

I think it's essential to keep the cost down because the second that the scum Falcon becomes your opponent's target priority it loses a ton of value - you stop getting obstructed shots, you start having to burn actions on boosting or rotating arcs instead of modding your attacks. I run it at 68pts so I'm bringing a Falcon to the table for 34pts (old money) and that's crazy good value.

• Han Solo - Trick Shot, 0-0-0, Lando's Falcon, Rigged Cargo Chute (68)

Skirt around the outside throwing dice in, then at the right point change it up and dive in for spreading stress with 0-0-0 and RCC. In the ultimate magical christmas land you can throw 6 red dice at somebody, say if they dropped into your RCC behind you... 2 dice + range + Han + Trick Shot + Stress = 6 dice. 34pts.

Using that ship then minus the RCS (Can't Afford it)

What about this:

Keeping them all as cheap as possible I was able to put in more than expected! Starting from the top we have Han who will be able to circle the fight as he shouldn't be the primary target with Pablo on the table! This allows him to get those bonus dice via either stressed ships or asteroids. Second is The standard Pablo that looks really strong in 2.0 for 58 Points!! with stealing green tokens and using them for landos rerolls. Finally Dengar with his title and as much rerolls as he can get as he will be. On the plus side because dengar is I6 he will be able to rotate his arc after everyone has moved and still get a focus for a stress. Thinking about it he is kind of like luke Gunner as he will always be able to focus/TL and still shoot for the cost of a stress.

3 hours ago, thespaceinvader said:

Personally I think 'the designers are actively penalising stuff which was considered highly overpowered in 1e with the intention of them not being meta staples'.

Ill see that and raise you a "They also want ships people don't already own to play a larger role, because 'sales'"

@Dengars Toilet Paper

You're very close to what is so far unbeaten for us: https://raithos.github.io/?f=Scum and Villainy&d=v4!s!89:133,-1,63,-1,83,96,-1,152:-1:-1:;155:-1,-1,45,36,-1,96,-1,-1:-1:-1:;112:119,43,-1,-1,-1,-1,156:-1:-1:&sn=Junkyard Falcon II&obs=

5 minutes ago, SOTL said:

That was definitely my opinion before I put it into the table. Those situational effects happen pretty often.

And all of them cost you points and setup (upgrading to Han or someone that can take trick shot, title, etc). I've seen and played against it. It's good, but it's not anywhere near poweful enough to be called above curve.

TBF I was conflating two things - I think the Lando Falcon expansion is ahead of the curve, and that includes things like the Falcon itself but also the Escape Craft, Lando crew, Han Gunner...

Scum Falcon is def ahead of the curve of other turreted ships though, it's about the only big fat Turret I'd give the time of day to.

With a Torp boat, I like Contraband Cybernetics, since it lets you red turn/sloop and still launch torpedos.

4 hours ago, Dengars Toilet Paper said:

How about I call your Lando Falcon then add the Jumpaster with a bid to have 2 I6 Ships?

You could do this with Fenn Rau, a third ship AND a bid, instead of playing bad ships.

1 hour ago, nikk whyte said:

You could do this with Fenn Rau, a third ship AND a bid, instead of playing bad ships.

True but where's the fun in that ?

3 hours ago, SOTL said:

TBF I was conflating two things - I think the Lando Falcon expansion is ahead of the curve, and that includes things like the Falcon itself but also the Escape Craft, Lando crew, Han Gunner...

Scum Falcon is def ahead of the curve of other turreted ships though, it's about the only big fat Turret I'd give the time of day to.

After playing Rebel Han and Lando, I think this assessment is very shortsighted.

19 minutes ago, MasterShake2 said:

After playing Rebel Han and Lando, I think this assessment is very shortsighted.

They seem very fragile on paper, though I really want Han to be good. Do please elaborate!