FFG is using an app for X-wing to update points cost for ships, upgraded, etc. They appear also be using an app for their new game Keyfore, presumably to balance decks by handicapping the stronger decks.

Since we already have a restricted list, what about an app to be used to tie the card game even more to the story? Something that tracks the current clan alliances/rivalries and only allows players to pick supporting clans that their current clan is friendly, or at least neutral with?

Yeah I know, "more deckbuulding restrictions is dumb!"

Oh yeah well you're double dumb.....not really. I was just wondering if there were a way to bridge the gap between story and game. I'm cool with how things are, mostly just wondering out loud. We there are relatively few opportunities to play competitively I tend to ponder things from a more casual perspective.

26 minutes ago, Ishi Tonu said:

FFG is using an app for X-wing to update points cost for ships, upgraded, etc. They appear also be using an app for their new game Keyfore, presumably to balance decks by handicapping the stronger decks.

Since we already have a restricted list, what about an app to be used to tie the card game even more to the story? Something that tracks the current clan alliances/rivalries and only allows players to pick supporting clans that their current clan is friendly, or at least neutral with?

Yeah I know, "more deckbuulding restrictions is dumb!"

Oh yeah well you're double dumb.....not really. I was just wondering if there were a way to bridge the gap between story and game. I'm cool with how things are, mostly just wondering out loud. We there are relatively few opportunities to play competitively I tend to ponder things from a more casual perspective.

Its a good idea in theory but as you said extra deck building restrictions are probably not what the game needs, added that what would be the payoff for the effort. Maybe if it incorporated a living FAQ/Errata document there might be value to it but otherwise seems like an investment for minimal return.

1 minute ago, Schmoozies said:

Its a good idea in theory but as you said extra deck building restrictions are probably not what the game needs, added that what would be the payoff for the effort. Maybe if it incorporated a living FAQ/Errata document there might be value to it but otherwise seems like an investment for minimal return.

I'm playing Unicorn. I'm all about large investments for minimal returns.

2 minutes ago, Ishi Tonu said:

I'm playing Unicorn. I'm all about large investments for minimal returns.

Where as my Mantis nature would be let someone else develop it and then acquire it for my own advantage (looking at you :A Deck of Five Rings")

On 8/27/2018 at 8:26 PM, Ishi Tonu said:

I'm playing Unicorn. I'm all about large investments for minimal returns.

It's an old meme now, Unicorn is easily one of the best clans right now.

2 hours ago, Zura said:

It's an old meme now, Unicorn is easily one of the best clans right now.

Not really no.

Improved, yes. One of the best, not even close.

Also, you still have to do a lot of stuff with them to get very little in return. I still enjoy playing them a great deal and they are by no means bad, but, they are still not able to make big tempo swings without doing a lot of stuff, whereas other clans can do this by playing a single card.

12 hours ago, Ishi Tonu said:

Not really no.

Improved, yes. One of the best, not even close.

Also, you still have to do a lot of stuff with them to get very little in return. I still enjoy playing them a great deal and they are by no means bad, but, they are still not able to make big tempo swings without doing a lot of stuff, whereas other clans can do this by playing a single card.

Access to feast or famine with talisman of the sun. Force of the river with shinjo sono/the card that makes everything 3/3 for 3 honor. Spyglasses with master of swift waves. New stronghold that is easily one of the best and a lot easier to activate than lion counterpart. The 2/4 lady that you can play talisman and force of river on fot free and has covert which is super useful im clan like unicorn. Encampment is easily one of the best holdings atm and to ensure you get it you have force of river+satoshi+rebuild to bring it back from discard to a province that is hard to break, which makes for incredible niten-master lvl action economy if you play your cards right. Invocation of ash is new reusable tempo boost unicorn lacked. Last but not least with all the discard support and new 0-cost unit cavalry reserved is just stupidly good sometimes. I disagree about not having tempo swimgs or minimal return. In my opinion they're just behind scorpion (lack of their trickery, counters and attachment hate), but uni plvl wise is on the very top with this cycle.

edit: also the +3 honor holding with rebuild allows them to either downplay the drawbacks of their cards of completely render dishonor strategy orented decks useless

I guess it would depend on what the app does.

Implementing the app for X-wing removed point costs from the physical cards, meaning you must use the app to make legal teams to play what you thought was a purely physical board game.

If an L5R app was something similar, where, say, influence costs were removed from the physical cards and the values were shifted over time so that the app would be required to splash cards in my deck, then I’d say no thank you.

2 hours ago, Zura said:

Access to feast or famine with talisman of the sun. Force of the river with shinjo sono/the card that makes everything 3/3 for 3 honor. Spyglasses with master of swift waves. New stronghold that is easily one of the best and a lot easier to activate than lion counterpart. The 2/4 lady that you can play talisman and force of river on fot free and has covert which is super useful im clan like unicorn. Encampment is easily one of the best holdings atm and to ensure you get it you have force of river+satoshi+rebuild to bring it back from discard to a province that is hard to break, which makes for incredible niten-master lvl action economy if you play your cards right. Invocation of ash is new reusable tempo boost unicorn lacked. Last but not least with all the discard support and new 0-cost unit cavalry reserved is just stupidly good sometimes. I disagree about not having tempo swimgs or minimal return. In my opinion they're just behind scorpion (lack of their trickery, counters and attachment hate), but uni plvl wise is on the very top with this cycle.

edit: also the +3 honor holding with rebuild allows them to either downplay the drawbacks of their cards of completely render dishonor strategy orented decks useless

Do you PLAY Unicorn? Because while all of those things do sound powerful, it's not exactly the easiest thing to pull off. We still have to contend with Scorpion dishonor (it's a struggle, even with Yurts), Phoenix, Dragon,... all the top decks that are still top decks. Granted, I haven't had a chance to play with the new cards yet (my gaming group is... sporadic, at best), so I can't say with first hand experience how good Newnicorn is, but I'm betting it's still pretty darn hard.

I have to disagree there. Ive played seven games with the new unicorn, ive lost only one. And ive played (not using unicorn) against 3 unicorns and lost the three matches. I wouldnt say unicorn is the best clan currently, but I agree with Zura it is one of the best clans.

Also dragon splash with hawk tattoo and covert monk is better than crab splash imo

I want the following in an L5R app:

1) A calendar to announce and remind me of events in my area. Give it variable distance settings so I can be notified of basic OP kit tournaments within say 20 miles while also finding out about Koteis within 100 miles or maybe more if I feel like it. Give me 5 mile/km increments up to worldwide that I can select for each tier of event. Also remind me when new products release.

2) A deckbuilder with Influence-level measurement, integrated Restricted List, errata, and clarifications. Easy decklist export to PDF and/or email for submitting to Tournament staff is a must. Additional functions like tracking popular splash cards and Clans could be fun too.

3) A store-finder so people can find places to buy and play. Which ties in to:

4) An opt-in player finder to see other active players in an area. Should definitely give a good idea of players in or near that area, not necessarily broadcast where those players are right at this moment unless those players want to be found. Maybe have active players select a favorite store or place to play (pub, park, coffee shop, etc.), or even a few favorites.

5 hours ago, Zura said:

Access to feast or famine with talisman of the sun. Force of the river with shinjo sono/the card that makes everything 3/3 for 3 honor. Spyglasses with master of swift waves. New stronghold that is easily one of the best and a lot easier to activate than lion counterpart. The 2/4 lady that you can play talisman and force of river on fot free and has covert which is super useful im clan like unicorn. Encampment is easily one of the best holdings atm and to ensure you get it you have force of river+satoshi+rebuild to bring it back from discard to a province that is hard to break, which makes for incredible niten-master lvl action economy if you play your cards right. Invocation of ash is new reusable tempo boost unicorn lacked. Last but not least with all the discard support and new 0-cost unit cavalry reserved is just stupidly good sometimes. I disagree about not having tempo swimgs or minimal return. In my opinion they're just behind scorpion (lack of their trickery, counters and attachment hate), but uni plvl wise is on the very top with this cycle.

edit: also the +2 honor holding with rebuild allows them to either downplay the drawbacks of their cards of completely render dishonor strategy orented decks useless

I bolded the important stuff here and corrected your edit, and yes you did list some of the really good cards that Unicorn has. I'm not disputing that. I never said Unicorn doesn't have good cards, or lacks a way to swing the tempo of the game, or that they don't get any strong returns on their cards. It's about what they have to invest in order to get their desired results.

Example you gave: Shono or UtD + FotR

That's a three card combo on it's own and you didn't even take into account that you need to spend fate to buy other characters to have in play so Shono can buff them or that the very least you purchase a shugenja to play FotR, probably one that is at least 3 fate on so it doesn't get Assassinated. So if you get all these things at the right time, yeah you'll get a really big play. But if we are going to base our opinions on "what ifs" then what happens when you do all that work and get crushed by a single AFWtD? You've invested probably 6 or more cards and double digit fate to be undone by one card.

None of those cards on their own create the big tempo swings that other clans get off their cards for similar costs.

Invocation of Ash is great, but the meta is heavily leaning on Dragon splash for Let Go and Hawk Tattoo, at the moment. Not to mention having it stolen by Scorpion is just horrible, and Scorpion is still a major player in the metagame. I'm still going to run it, but, it's not a card that is without it's flaws.

Master of Swift Waves and Shahai are great cards...........keep in mind this is now a time where Phoenix is very strong and with their spell stronghold will simply crush those characters and a big portion of your strategy in the process.

Encampment is a good holding, but, "easily one of the best" how far are you going on that list? or did you mean easily the best for the Unicorn? It's good, at least above average, but, there are far better holdings in the game at the moment. It certainly helps Unicorn with a problem they have of not being able to ready bowed characters easily, but, that doesn't make it better than other holdings. If we removed clan alignment and let people just pick whatever holding they want, it's not making the top 5.

Crab splash is good, but, Phoenix and Dragon are arguably better splashes, and Crane splash is surprisingly good as well, so you can't count on self dynasty mill and rebuild tricks unless you're forcing Crab. If you to, you have to give up some important things that those other splashes give you and that cannot simply be ignored.

"0 cost dynasty personality is stupidly good sometimes" ........... but you forgot to include how much of a dud it is the majority of the time that your losing tempo to play a free character with no stats and give your opponent a fate advantage to do so. If you hit the dynasty discard lottery and pitch your 0 cost pleebs randomly so you can get that amazing Cav Reserves late game........well yeah she seems like an amazing card, but, that is not the norm.

Talisman is a great card. Sadly, as with most splashable Unicorn cards, it works better out of other clans..........if they choose to run it, since it's not even getting play with Hawk Tattoo and Let Go being the preferred splash. There are other clans that can run a far better province line up to abuse Talisman, but, yes it's good when you can keep it on the table.

*

Again, Unicorn are much improved, but, one of the best clans is a major stretch in the current meta. They have some powerful, but, fragile combos. They can attack on an axis that no other clan can. However, when your best cards force you into deck that is almost an auto loss vs one of the top clans in the current metagame, you can't really be considered top tier. I love playing the Unicorn. I've done it since release and will continue to do so until I have a playable Shadowlands deck. Unicorn is at least at the point were they are properly balanced. The issue is that Dragon, Scorpion, and Phoenix are not. Unicorn is certainly not in a class of their own on the bottom, but, they need things to open up a bit more before they can crack the top tier.

I don't like to derail threads but I think this one is important enough to attempt again to clarify my stance, as you seem to be missing my point. I'm being as objective as I possibly can with Unicorn, or any clan for that matter. I'm not hating on Unicorn or complaining about any other clan, just stating my observations

*

back on topic

Great Ideas BC. If I could like that post more than once I would

6 hours ago, twinstarbmc said:

Do you PLAY Unicorn? Because while all of those things do sound powerful, it's not exactly the easiest thing to pull off. We still have to contend with Scorpion dishonor (it's a struggle, even with Yurts), Phoenix, Dragon,... all the top decks that are still top decks. Granted, I haven't had a chance to play with the new cards yet (my gaming group is... sporadic, at best), so I can't say with first hand experience how good Newnicorn is, but I'm betting it's still pretty darn hard.

I don't play unicorn myself but i have a fairly competitive playgroup and one of our best players is running new unicorn and keeps dominating. He's running crab splash so dishonor is not a concern and to get encampents back and crab 1 cost covert unit.

@Ishi Tonu just a few answers: imo encampent is 3rd best holding behind iron mine and imperial palace. If i'm understanding correctly your argument about Shono+Ftr or Ftr+UtD is that you need to assemble the pieces for it to work and can be stopped in several ways. While that's true, the thing is that those combos are just another way of using already great cards that need no combo (maybe aside of utD but it's not a 3-off card anyway) to work. And while shono can get FtDed... anyone can, it's L5R equivalent of mtg "dies to removal". At least uni rarely has to pay for shono regularly as you can just charge/reserve him into for lower price costs and then ftd becomes a reasonable trade. I'm not thinking that you're hating on unicorn nor i'm really trying to sway your opinion it's just the whole "unicorn is so bad lol" meme is annoying to me at this point as it's clearly better than lion and crab and arguably in line with phoenix, crane and dragon.

32 minutes ago, Zura said:

I don't play unicorn myself but i have a fairly competitive playgroup and one of our best players is running new unicorn and keeps dominating. He's running crab splash so dishonor is not a concern and to get encampents back and crab 1 cost covert unit.

@Ishi Tonu just a few answers: imo encampent is 3rd best holding behind iron mine and imperial palace. If i'm understanding correctly your argument about Shono+Ftr or Ftr+UtD is that you need to assemble the pieces for it to work and can be stopped in several ways. While that's true, the thing is that those combos are just another way of using already great cards that need no combo (maybe aside of utD but it's not a 3-off card anyway) to work. And while shono can get FtDed... anyone can, it's L5R equivalent of mtg "dies to removal". At least uni rarely has to pay for shono regularly as you can just charge/reserve him into for lower price costs and then ftd becomes a reasonable trade. I'm not thinking that you're hating on unicorn nor i'm really trying to sway your opinion it's just the whole "unicorn is so bad lol" meme is annoying to me at this point as it's clearly better than lion and crab and arguably in line with phoenix, crane and dragon.

Honestly I put alot of the current Unicorn resurgence down to players weren't used to dealing with them so they are getting caught out by the new tricks that they bring to the board. The issue is once they get used to facing them the performance tails off significantly as they become just another swarm faction. Cancel the Cav Reserves and Clouds the "clutch" pieces and they are a lot less scary. Especially if you are on Crab splash so have no attachment hate of reliable cancel of your own to fight back with.

2 hours ago, Zura said:

I don't play unicorn myself but i have a fairly competitive playgroup and one of our best players is running new unicorn and keeps dominating. He's running crab splash so dishonor is not a concern and to get encampents back and crab 1 cost covert unit.

@Ishi Tonu just a few answers: imo encampent is 3rd best holding behind iron mine and imperial palace. If i'm understanding correctly your argument about Shono+Ftr or Ftr+UtD is that you need to assemble the pieces for it to work and can be stopped in several ways. While that's true, the thing is that those combos are just another way of using already great cards that need no combo (maybe aside of utD but it's not a 3-off card anyway) to work. And while shono can get FtDed... anyone can, it's L5R equivalent of mtg "dies to removal". At least uni rarely has to pay for shono regularly as you can just charge/reserve him into for lower price costs and then ftd becomes a reasonable trade. I'm not thinking that you're hating on unicorn nor i'm really trying to sway your opinion it's just the whole "unicorn is so bad lol" meme is annoying to me at this point as it's clearly better than lion and crab and arguably in line with phoenix, crane and dragon.

I never said Unicorn was bad.

"I'm playing Unicorn. I'm all about large investments for minimal returns. "

I'm simply pointing out that what you invest into your big cards for Unicorn does not net you the same payoff (card for card) as other clans get from their big cards. They have been this way since core. The Elemental Cycle didn't change this. Was I being a little snarky in my statement, sure, but, your interpretation of my intent entirely false. I think Unicorn are much improved. Not top tier, but, certainly a big step up from the absolute bottom where they were.

That doesn't change the fact that playing Unicorn is still somewhat of a gamble. It lacks the consistency of other clans. It has some really swingy plays that are really strong if you can pull them off. If you fail, you get crushed. Self cycling your dynasty to get to an Encampment and fill your discard with characters for a Cavalry Reserves is going to be a game changer, of that there is no doubt. Shono + FotR is a big play, for sure. Either of those combos could generate double-digit skill bonuses, but, the set up for something like that is a ton more involved than playing Way of the Lion, which would net nearly the same results off one card and ton less set up. Missing a piece of a random flip or not finding the cards you want while burning through your dynasty, not getting all of your charge/reprieve in hand, or getting any part of the combo disrupted is a much bigger loss than someone of another clan losing 1 card. Hence they risk more for less/equal results. At their very best they are a boom/bust gambit and that's traditionally not very good, especially in a game that doesn't favor pure aggro. If Unicorn could put reliable pressure on an opponent from the onset of the game, then some of those big gambles could be worth it, because you force your opponent to have an answer immediately. In a typical game of L5R both players are crafting their boards and jockeying for that big moment. Unicorn have to do more to get their edge and thus they stand to lose more if they get disrupted by anything.

Case in point, my Seattle Kotei experience. My Unicorn/Phoenix deck was literally two plays difference between 1-3 and 3-1. I did everything I needed to do, crafted my board, let provinces go when I needed to and turned the game to my advantage only to lose to a Consumed by 5 Fires in one game (that was meant to counter Dragon decks) and a Crane player that drew into the 5 perfect cards he needed to counter my hand of 12 cards. Granted this is before the Elemental cycle release and Unicorn has improved some, but, the big things they are lacking have still yet to be resolved. I'll address that last.

*

I bolded the parts I disagree with as I think placing encampment at 3rd best holding in the entire game is way too high.

While the Unicorn did get some good new cards, most are only great when used in combination with each other and actually very weak on their own.

*

They are still the only clan that lacks any good payoff card for having the favor, or at the very least their own way to deny others the favor.

They lack good searching or repeatable recursion engine. While they can splash for Rebuild or get one time uses out of Cav Reserves, they don't have an in clan permanent threat that has to be answered like Swordsmith, Spiritcaller, Envoy, Niece, etc. They have Spyglass, which is solid, but, it's in a meta that is leaning to attachment hate/steal for the most successful decks.

They still lack enough characters with abilities that impact your opponent's cards in battle. The vast majority are movement, and they are lacking statwise when compared to other clans.

These things just are. It doesn't mean cards like Master of Swift Waters is not a great card, it just doesn't impact the board the same way as Doji Challenger or LPB. Unicorn can get into and even out of a battle relatively well, but, when they do, they still need their conflict cards to carry them when facing a good opponent who understands the movement tricks. And again to be very clear, this is not me complaining. I like where the Unicorn are at, I'm just not going to go ahead and crown them as one of the best when they have not yet shown they are deserving of being mentioned along with the other top clans, yet.

Yes Unicorn is far better now.

But still, we are one of the last, if we talk about competitive battle.

Many of our good cards cost a lot of fate, and they need other card for combo for work at 100% (or they will work only at 35%). Shahai is very very good, but if you don't have neutral cards, she works only at the 75%, or less. I love her and play her a lot. But for example, Shono needs other cavalry for works at 100%, and many times they can get assassinated, or I have no fate for play all what I want, or they are a 0-0, that is not so useful. And remember, we also need to defend! Or feast of famine is great, but if I let my opponent destroy all my province, for be able to attack and hope to destroy my opponents province... well, I will lose the game anyway.

We don't have cheap card for the conflict deck. Cav.Res. needs 3 fate, and needs many cards in your discard pile. I love the new serpentine scouts! And they are so expensive, and not so useful... Ash and other meishodo attachment needs shugenja or Shahai, and without Shahai (that can not have all the attachment) will still a 1 fate cost cards. I am ready is ok, but not so great: because you risk to lose your character on the field, and next turn need to pay it again. You can splash Lion for FGG, but you will lose Charge!: is it a good exchange?

Finally, I need to have more character than my opponent for use the new stronghold (win the conflict and sacrifice someone). As I said, I need fate for do it. And Unicorn cards are not cheap, and/or not so strong for what you pay.

We got a lot better now, but not so much as you said. I like Unicorn and still playing them. The best cards we have now are Moto Neguri, Iuchi Shahai. In the future we will have Utaku Tetsuko, and she will be great for sure. We still lack of a good courtier: Ide Tadaji is not bad, but he is not good by any means. I am waiting for a good Ide character (because I was always an Ide in the GDR).

I am happy with it, but I am also realistic: we got better, we still have much to do for get at top tier.

And now I will wait for the possibility to make a full Battle Maiden decks :D

I think I should start a thread called “Are Unicorn Good Now?” and see if the discussion focuses on an app for L5R.

22 hours ago, Ishi Tonu said:

Again, Unicorn are much improved, but, one of the best clans is a major stretch in the current meta.

Unicorn - now easily in the top 7 most competitive Clans in this game.

9 hours ago, Suzume Tomonori said:

I think I should start a thread called “Are Unicorn Good Now?” and see if the discussion focuses on an app for L5R.

What and ruin the proud tradition of derailing threads with unrelated discussion.