4 hours ago, Henshini said:

Should we be concerned no card pack is advertised? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I had heard X-wing 2.0 was going to have a card pack each wave so we no longer had to buy "the autothrusters expansion pack". Were these only going to cover cards that come with re-releases? If so, that sort of proves that FFG doesn't understand why we wanted card packs.

Conversion kits are the card packs. They come with new content from the re-released stuff.

They have yet to announce a re-released ship that hasn't also had a corresponding same-wave conversion kit announced.

The future holds the packs you want... whenever they re-release another ship. Always in motion is the future, though.

3 hours ago, Henshini said:

I guess then I misunderstood the quotes people took from FFG. I had though they understood that the autothrusters expansion pack with free starviper model was a **** deal and that they were going to address it, like I've heard they do with Legion. Oh well.

Yes, they have said that all faction-neutral upgrades will be available to all factions. As neither you or I knows what ships in the Resistance A-Wing pack or the First Order TIE pack, you are jumping to conclusions months ahead of time.

But hey, it's the FFG forums, so go off, I guess...

Not even released yet and I'm itching to see everything Resistance-wise asap. Give me spoilers and point costs!

1 hour ago, papy72 said:

Was it ever available in a Rebel expansion? I know Kylo's TIE had two copies but never really started collecting Rebel stuff

You are correct, it was never made available in a Rebel expansion. It is also fair to note that the Starviper was Wave 6 and the Silencer Wave 13. So, as long as it doesn't take them 7 waves to offer the cards in a different faction they are technically improving. Maybe it is more fair to admit that the scheme is different in small ways.

I am not convinced 2.0 is a transparent cash grab or anything. I understand that hyper competitive lists are usually going to require more investment than casual play in any possible dynamic system. I just have serious doubts, based largely on the recent Wave 1 releases, that there is actually a real desire to eliminate the existence of important chase cards in X-wing 2.0.

My serious advice that I have already applied to myself is to plan to collect at least some part of each faction if you like to be able to field the most competitive lists for any single faction.

The two main notes that I've taken from what FFG has said at various times:

-"card packs" or whatever other means of getting cards without buying models seems intended specifically for re-released ships so that players aren't re-buying models they already bought in 1.0 just for 2.0 cards.

-there will supposedly be ways for single-faction players to acquire all relevant cards without buying outside their chosen faction. This one has yet to be "proven" true but there are too few expansions available to really set a precedent.

if anyone is expecting there to be ways to get cards from "new" expansions without buying the whole package you're probably setting yourself up for disappointment. it has also been pretty common in the past for popular rare cards to be re released in later waves, such as advanced sensors and crack shot, so patience is often your friend in that regard.

2 hours ago, RebelProfundity said:

The fact that  they immediately    went back to chase card  s i  n X-wing 

But...they haven't.

6 minutes ago, DekoPuma said:

But...they haven't.

Not really. But, apart from Maul, 000, BT1, Moldy Crow we also have the Quadjumper with a Tech slot and exactly zero Tech cards in the Scum conversion kit. So the "fringe cases" start to accumulate.

FFG said forever ago they weren't doing cardboard only expansions.

You know what they NEVER said they wouldn't do? Clone Wars stuff. So don't even try.

What has brought this up again all of a sudden? Is there some new news? I haven’t seen anything new posted about wave 2 in a couple weeks.

3 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

What has brought this up again all of a sudden? Is there some new news? I haven’t seen anything new posted about wave 2 in a couple weeks.

People got confused about what FFG meant about card packs.

What they mean is when say the A-Wing get's re-released on it's own for 2.0, FFG HAVE said that those who already own the older ships will not need to rebuy them, and there will be a way to get those cards. Most have assumed that this means that each re-released ship (NOT in a wave with a conversion pack, as that covers those expansions) will get some sort of card pack, or maybe those waves will come with a mini-wave pack that has all the cards from that wave.

It is true that for a good while in 1.0, FFG said they wouldn't/couldn't do card-only packs. But ever since the first 2.0 release talk, they have said what I said above.

So for now, we shall just have to wait and see what their plans are. Wave 3 (I assume) will have some re-release ships in it, so then we'll know.

37 minutes ago, Managarmr said:

Not really. But, apart from Maul, 000, BT1, Moldy Crow we also have the Quadjumper with a Tech slot and exactly zero Tech cards in the Scum conversion kit. So the "fringe cases" start to accumulate.

There are exactly zero Tech Cards in any Wave 1 expansion or Conversion Kit. The first Tech upgrades don't show up until Wave 2 and, since we don't know what all is in the Mining Guild TIE, we don't know if scum gets them in Wave 2 (along with FO and Resistance, but ahead of Rebels or Empire) or in later waves.

53 minutes ago, DekoPuma said:

But...they haven't.

Afterburners, Moldy Crow, Maul, 0-0-0, and Barrage Rockets. Every one, except for Maul, seems to be pretty powerful in the current state of the game.

Only source of Afterburners outside of multiple Core Sets is the Fang Fighter, which can't even equip the upgrade outside of quickbuilds. Not sure if you consider the core a purchase specific to one faction, but it could have easily and appropriately been included with the X-wing and the Advanced, but they chose not to do that, for some reason.

Barrage Rockets are only available in the Imperial conversion kit. I am pretty sure it's two per conversion pack. It is obviously very powerful ordinance that features strongly in the Jonus bombers list that many folks also feel is very strong in the current meta. It requires more than two copies to be most effective. It is so close to copying the situation many players found themselves in with Harpoons that it just doesn't actually seem like coincidence at all.

I see that the conditions that make a rock solid chase card are pretty subjective. How can we know for sure barrage rockets or Afterburners are an important card to have 3+ copies of before the official app even releases? Costs can be rebalanced and competitive formats can be tailored to exclude the possibility of even taking more than two copies of the card.

I admit that we can't know for sure, but we can talk about what we think will happen and put appropriate faith in those conclusions. Barring some major point reworks or the TIE Bomber losing a missile slot, my best guess is that it will be a powerful card and best in TIE Bomber swarms. Its sheer existence makes the Rebel K-Wing an actual consideration.

I think that the sheer fact that copies of the card were not included in a single other expansion shows how little commitment FFG actually has for the idea. If you bought one of everything that came with 2.0 Wave 1, you would end up with two copies of one of very few upgrades that actually seem really powerful in the current meta. It's just too ridiculous to be coincidence. There will be a ton of Ion Missiles to spare. I think that if their playtest team is worth their salt, and I do believe they are, they knew very well that this would be the case. That's exactly why Barrage Rockets are only available in limited quantities in one relatively expensive package.

2 hours ago, InterceptorMad said:

People got confused about what FFG meant about card packs.

But this is all old news. Even the announcement of the the wave 2 products is more than 3 weeks old. Why the sudden activity. Everyone in this thread is been talking like there was new news recently, not just rehashing month old information.

6 hours ago, Managarmr said:

Not really. But, apart from Maul, 000, BT1, Moldy Crow we also have the Quadjumper with a Tech slot and exactly zero Tech cards in the Scum conversion kit. So the "fringe cases" start to accumulate.

Maybe we should wait to see what the Quadjumper releases with before complaining that it's lacking something. The conversion kits are not the same as the full releases.

5 hours ago, RebelProfundity said:

Afterburners, Moldy Crow, Maul, 0-0-0, and Barrage Rockets. Every one, except for Maul, seems to be pretty powerful in the current state of the game.

Only source of Afterburners outside of multiple Core Sets is the Fang Fighter, which can't even equip the upgrade outside of quickbuilds. Not sure if you consider the core a purchase specific to one faction, but it could have easily and appropriately been included with the X-wing and the Advanced, but they chose not to do that, for some reason.

Barrage Rockets are only available in the Imperial conversion kit. I am pretty sure it's two per conversion pack. It is obviously very powerful ordinance that features strongly in the Jonus bombers list that many folks also feel is very strong in the current meta. It requires more than two copies to be most effective. It is so close to copying the situation many players found themselves in with Harpoons that it just doesn't actually seem like coincidence at all.

I see that the conditions that make a rock solid chase card are pretty subjective. How can we know for sure barrage rockets or Afterburners are an important card to have 3+ copies of before the official app even releases? Costs can be rebalanced and competitive formats can be tailored to exclude the possibility of even taking more than two copies of the card.

I admit that we can't know for sure, but we can talk about what we think will happen and put appropriate faith in those conclusions. Barring some major point reworks or the TIE Bomber losing a missile slot, my best guess is that it will be a powerful card and best in TIE Bomber swarms. Its sheer existence makes the Rebel K-Wing an actual consideration.

I think that the sheer fact that copies of the card were not included in a single other expansion shows how little commitment FFG actually has for the idea. If you bought one of everything that came with 2.0 Wave 1, you would end up with two copies of one of very few upgrades that actually seem really powerful in the current meta. It's just too ridiculous to be coincidence. There will be a ton of Ion Missiles to spare. I think that if their playtest team is worth their salt, and I do believe they are, they knew very well that this would be the case. That's exactly why Barrage Rockets are only available in limited quantities in one relatively expensive package.

If you buy a Core Set (which they seem to be considering a required purchase for every faction), you will have access to the card.

Furthermore, several of your examples deal with ships that aren't even releasing immediately. The card may do well on TIE Bombers, but TIE Bombers haven't even been announced yet. We simply have no idea what the Empire will or won't have access to when the TIE Bomber drops. You can't expect a brand-new game to be fully fleshed-out from the get-go.

11 hours ago, DekoPuma said:

I disagree. Look at Runewars. Look at Legion. Look at Armada even.

Counterpoint: look at current X-wing 2.0 products. There are several cards only avaliable to a single faction at the moment.

Edit: at least some of them won't be available to others for a while. Do you see Moldy Crow for Scum coming before Hwk re-release? Or Maul for Rebels before Ghost re-release?