The card is extremely powerful, but most of its benefits come from high Initiative. Paying 12 points for the ability on lower IN pilots is not worth it, and I doubt anyone will use it for the generic Inquisitors for example, or in the future, generic Jedi.

I think a price adjustment based on IN is reasonable, to something like this:

IN 1-2: 6 pts

IN 3-4: 8 pts

IN 5-6: 12 pts

37 minutes ago, Commander Kaine said:

The card is extremely powerful, but most of its benefits come from high Initiative. Paying 12 points for the ability on lower IN pilots is not worth it, and I doubt anyone will use it for the generic Inquisitors for example, or in the future, generic Jedi.

I think a price adjustment based on IN is reasonable, to something like this:

IN 1-2: 6 pts IN 3-4: 8 pts IN 5-6: 12 pts

No thanks, I think it is properly priced for what it can do and whom can use it. The ability to boost or barrel roll before activation is a powerful mechanic in the re-positioning game, it can allow you to barrel roll away from obstacles, other ships or even bombs; the ability to boost could give that pilot the ability to push into R1 one or skirt just far enough away to get either to R3; that also doesn't take into account all the arc dodging possiblities. In a game now where the repositioning aspect has a great impact. Pricing this card based on "IN" is possibly game-breaking but also NPE likely.

Generic Inquisitors will use it. Trading a force for a reposition and a focus is pretty good.

No.

The ability to boost or barrel roll is more valuable the more inrofmation you have when you perform the action, so it shouldn't cost the same at all initiative levels IMO.

That being said, I don't think it needs a variable cost now, but it might be something worth looking at after the Republic faction will introduce significantly more Force user pilots.

3 hours ago, Commander Kaine said:

Paying  12 points for the ability on lower IN pilots is  not worth  it  ,

This is the assumption I disagree with.

But right, it is way better on a high initiative pilots.

Comparing the costs of high initiative force pilots , I think the huge cost they imply support this difference.

What about Intel sources like Sense and Informant ? Don't those also increase the potential advantage of Supernatural Reflexes? And then there's Advanced Sensors.

There are other compounding factors besides init.

4 hours ago, Tbetts94 said:

Generic Inquisitors will use it. Trading a force for a reposition and a focus is pretty good.

Definitely. You also get an action if you do a blue move. So focus and lock or focus and evade. If you are rocking a missile the first could be good, otherwise the latter is strong.

It’s a 2 dice attack though so it might not be worth the overall points.

High Initiative pilots have already paid a hefty premium. It's taken into account, so, no, Supernatural Reflexes, nor Advanced Sensors, should have variable costs.

Good idea. But price it at 10:12:15 imo. Or leave as is. It’s not a big problem yet. But it might be.

It's on my radar. Start where it is, then go up for each init range. Will wait for tournament data to come back before panicking.

I`'m somewhat wary of having too many variable costs, or costs based on too many additional factors. So I'd be hesitant to introduce initiative as a factor (at least initially), since it hasn't yet been used to scale costs. I also don't think it's the purpose of every ability to be viable on all potential takers.

It’s not just an init advantage — it is precious action economy that doesn’t exist nearly as much in 2.0

I think it’s priced fairly even at generic Inq levels.

I really like variable pricing in general, and kind of want FFG to lean into it more.

I'm not sure I'd have the same splits, though. Perhaps 8-10-12, since this is basically a better Advanced Sensors. Spending less for a better effect seems like a problem to me.

I suppose this opens a pretty direct Slippery Slope, however. Should Advanced Sensors also have a variable cost? Here, my gut says no, so perhaps I'm wrong on Supernatural Reflexes.

The only issue could be Vader where he spends Force to do a few actions after he does the reflexes action. But it is pretty prohibitive as it is.

low I gets Sense, high I gets Supernatural

seems okay to me

High initiative pilots are already paying a premium and supernatural reflexes is just as good on low initiative pilots as it is on high. I think it's a great force power and is priced appropriately, it's just that the other force powers are so bad that nobody is going to use them, which makes reflexes look so much stronger by comparison.

13 minutes ago, HolySorcerer said:

High initiative pilots are already paying a premium and supernatural reflexes is just as good on low initiative pilots as it is on high. I think it's a great force power and is priced appropriately, it's just that the other force powers are so bad that nobody is going to use them, which makes reflexes look so much stronger by comparison.

I don't know I think Instinctive Aim will see a lot of table time; especially on Luke with his defensive regen of force tokens; I don't even seeing Luke ever having a problem being able to adjust with his ability to regen them every time he becomes a defender.

Luke Skywalker + Instinctive Aim, Proton Torps, S-Foils, R2D2 is extremely strong especially with 2 charges for Proton Torps.

9 hours ago, Tbetts94 said:

Generic Inquisitors will use it. Trading a force for a reposition and a focus is pretty good.

Pretty expensive for a 2 dice attack on IN 3.

7 hours ago, SOTL said:

No.

Oh, yeah I can see that. Come to think of it, you are right. You have convinced me, good sir. You don't even need to expand on anything you say ... like ever. You could even try to convey your message in even fewer words... Maybe the total absence of your comments will send the right message?

2 hours ago, Bad Idea Comics said:

High Initiative pilots have already paid a hefty premium. It's taken into account, so, no, Supernatural Reflexes, nor Advanced Sensors, should have variable costs.

I think you are getting it mixed up. Higher IN pilots would pay the same, lower IN pilots would pay less (because they get less of a benefit).

About being taken into account... I'm not sure. It can't be fair on all price levels, because it provides different levels of benefit for different pilots. Either low init pilots pay too much, or high init pilots pay too little.

With your argument, we could disregard all variable upgrade costs, because the price of ships already takes their stats into account.

57 minutes ago, Archangelspiv said:

The only issue could be Vader where he spends Force to do a few actions after he does the reflexes action. But it is pretty prohibitive as it is.

There would be no change for Vader at all.

9 minutes ago, Commander Kaine said:

.There would be no change for Vader at all.

Was saying it would only be an issue on Vader and it is priced appropriately.

To be perfectly frank, I dont actually rate supernatural that highly

HESERSY, I know, but I've never found a premanuever roll to be particularly difficult to plan for (sure you could boost and kill yourself for me...). It's good, sure, but it's not world endingly potent

Now the Inquistor is monstrously potent with supernatural (boost makes all the difference PLUS linked focus!) but he's also pricey AF at 70 or 75 (cool detector) not counting bid

EDIT: NVM, bombers save the day again

No One Expects...

(58) Grand Inquisitor
(12) Supernatural Reflexes
Points 70

(36) Captain Jonus
(6) Barrage Rockets
Points 42

(28) Scimitar Squadron Pilot
(6) Barrage Rockets
Points 34

(36) Lieutenant Kestal
(6) Barrage Rockets
(1) Ruthless
(6) Ion Cannon Turret
Points 49

Total points: 195

14 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

To be perfectly frank, I dont actually rate supernatural that highly

HESERSY, I know, but I've never found a premanuever roll to be particularly difficult to plan for (sure you could boost and kill yourself for me...). It's good, sure, but it's not world endingly potent

Now the Inquistor is monstrously potent with supernatural (boost makes all the difference PLUS linked focus!) but he's also pricey AF at 70 or 75 (cool detector) not counting bid

Grand Inquistor is 58

Inquistor is 40

I could put a pretty formible loadout on the "Inquistor" for 60 points and that includes (supernatural Reflexes, Cluster Missiles and FCS) Grand Inquistor would be pushing 70-75, but then why not just take Vader and run 2 Inquistor's with him?? Btw the way why we're taking about Supernatural Reflexes there are only 6 pilots who can equip it so it is restrictive (the points cost is perfectly set IMO currently) those pilots ~ Darth Vader, Grand Inquistor, Inquistor, Seventh Sister, then the two Rebel pilots Luke Skywalker and Ezra Bridger.

Vader + 2 Inquistor List here

https://raithos.github.io/?f=Galactic Empire&d=v4!s!171:74,113,98:-1:-1:;173:73,113,98,-1:-1:-1:;171:74,113,98:-1:-1:&sn=Unnamed Squadron&obs=

11 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

To be perfectly frank, I dont actually rate supernatural that highly

HESERSY, I know, but I've never found a premanuever roll to be particularly difficult to plan for (sure you could boost and kill yourself for me...). It's good, sure, but it's not world endingly potent

Now the Inquistor is monstrously potent with supernatural (boost makes all the difference PLUS linked focus!) but he's also pricey AF at 70 or 75 (cool detector) not counting bid

EDIT: NVM, bombers save the day again

No One Expects...

(58) Grand Inquisitor
(12) Supernatural Reflexes
Points 70

(36) Captain Jonus
(6) Barrage Rockets
Points 42

(28) Scimitar Squadron Pilot
(6) Barrage Rockets
Points 34

(36) Lieutenant Kestal
(6) Barrage Rockets
(1) Ruthless
(6) Ion Cannon Turret
Points 49

Total points: 195

It's good that with Imps, I can be relatively safe by fielding a bomber or two next to my jank.

My BOMBERS used to be the jank I field next to something competitive, unless I just wanted to be wiped off the board.

Happy times.

Plus, now all bombers can do this: (barrel roll, lock, cluster missiles)

I love it.

Really not sold on a supernatural not-so-grand Inquisitor derping around with two dice (short of low Initiative Target-lock dependency)

Now Instinctive aim...oh, Emperor YES!

Anyway, supernatural draws attention because it's an additional preactivation action (Allentown balanced by consuming Forcus, which is a great way to balance things imo) that slightly resembles 1st Ed stuff like sensor + PTL kylo

EDIT: **** yeah for Bombers!!!!

Also Kestal is criminally overlooked. She's a Jedi Hunter extraordinaire

28 minutes ago, Commander Kaine said:

It's good that with Imps, I can be relatively safe by fielding a bomber or two next to my jank.

My BOMBERS used to be the jank I field next to something competitive, unless I just wanted to be wiped off the board.

Happy times.

Plus, now all bombers can do this: (barrel roll, lock, cluster missiles)

I love it.

FFG needs to make her into a pilot. "You may make more than one bonus attack per round"