A recent poll portrayed the Decimator as potentially under performing, but to me it looks like the ship is better costed than it was in 1.0 (both chassis and pilots) because of how darn versatile it seems now! So what gives? Are you finding the thing to be more or less powerful than in 1.0? Does it just not have the upgrades that previously kept it alive anymore such as VI and EU?

It also has the added Reinforce as well.

6 minutes ago, Prosk_019 said:

Does it just not have the upgrades that previously kept it alive anymore such as VI and EU?

This.

I don't think it's useless, but look at the upgrades that 90% of the time you saw on the VT-49 in recent waves of 1st edition X-wing:

• Veteran Instincts - gone - not available
• Engine Upgrade - requires an existing red boost action - not available
• Kylo Ren - moved to a seperate faction - not available
• Emperor Palpatine - made less powerful (if cheaper)
• Director Krennic - made much less powerful

I'm not suggesting the armour-plated old juggernaut can't record registries and ram sterns in the new edition, but it cannot do so in any way that resembles the current 1st edition " Chiraneau with stuff ".

People will take time to adapt.

2 minutes ago, RedLeader23 said:

It also has the added Reinforce as well.

Indeed. Chiraneau's ability triggering off reinforce means he gets both impressive offensive and defensive modification for a single action, and Minister Tua gives you a way to make it a free action to boot.

I feel like the action economy of the grand inquisitor would do a fair bit for the thing. Reinforce/rotate arc in the same round with knowledge of the opponent's dial. But I guess that reinforce is all it's really got defensively. Perhaps in a jamming list with reapers or a Vader carrier?

The Grand Inquisitor isn't a bad call either. Range 2 is close enough that you might not know whether the ship will be in front or behind before you see the dial, so using that trigger to set your reinforce token is good, too. (especially if it's a lower initiative pilot and you can clear the stress in your own activation with a green move).

If you're worried about token denial, then you can carry Vader yourself. The Grand Inquisitor is a sort of Imperial version of Luke Skywalker - see your opponent's dial, perform a free (admittedly red) rotate, and then - at the start of the combat phase - vader lets you do a range 2 'jam analogue' and peel off their tokens.

The decimator's not a bad caddy for Grand Moff Tarkin, too - as the only imperial crew carrier with native target lock.

You've got to remember that 2.0 Reinforce =/= 1.0 Reinforce. It doesn't keep you alive it just helps you die more slowly.

33 minutes ago, SOTL said:

You've got to remember that 2.0 Reinforce =/= 1.0 Reinforce. It doesn't keep you alive it just helps you die more slowly.

Plus, as far as I can tell from the rules reference, flanking ships can ignore Reinforce entirely as they're not wholly in either full arc. That's going to make it a lot easier to position around.

1 hour ago, Magnus Grendel said:

This.

I don't think it's useless, but look at the upgrades that 90% of the time you saw on the VT-49 in recent waves of 1st edition X-wing:

• Veteran Instincts - gone - not available
• Engine Upgrade - requires an existing red boost action - not available
• Kylo Ren - moved to a seperate faction - not available
• Emperor Palpatine - made less powerful (if cheaper)
• Director Krennic - made much less powerful

Not to mention:

• Chiraneau's ability: FAR less powerful (dependent on an action, more difficult enemy positioning, and not able to stack with TL in the same round).
• Oicunn's ability less powerful (previously: autodamage, and you could ram someone and shoot someone else. Now, just adding a target, which in 1e you might already have had).
• Crew slots in general less useful, gunners also less useful.
• Price not changed significantly.

Admiral Sloane on a Decimator with a Howlrunner swarm?

199 points. For basic decimator with Sloane, 3 academies and a Naked Howlrunner - or add in ruthless for an even 200

1 minute ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

Admiral Sloane on a Decimator with a Howlrunner swarm?

199 points. For basic decimator with Sloane, 3 academies and a Naked Howlrunner - or add in ruthless for an even 100

Or you could drop the Decimator for Iden Versio and another 2 Academy Pilots...

Not to mention if you want to bring Sloane you're probably better off with a Reaper.

I think all the big turreted ships are overcosted in that they haven't really had a discount applied for switching to mobile arcs. If Luke is an indicative cost of the value of being able to shoot at whatever you want then you'd kind of expect it to be a ballpark for the cost reduction that former turreted ships need in order to compete.

In 1.0 imperial crew almost never helped other ships which made the TIE shuttle and lambda kinda pointless since they did nothing BUT tote around crew, but the decimator was the only offensive ship that had crew.

In 2.0, its the other way around. Imperial have access to some pretty sweet crew...for a support ship

The only crew i'd put on a decimator is Vader (14), Inquis (16), Tua (7), or Kallus (6). Two of those are REALLY expensive on an 88pt ship base.

The pricetag of everything kinda means you're forced to run it semi-naked because if you actually loaded Chirpy up with upgrades he'd break 130pts easily and can even hit 140pts. But at the same token he doesnt seem all that threatening unless hes decked out that like (which invalidates his threat since a single ship is not going to do much in 2.0)

5 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

Oicunn  's ability less powerful (previously: autodamage,  and you could ram someone and s  hoot someone else. No  w, just adding a targe  t    

It is target of potential 4 dice with mod! Add intimidation, his ability is at the very least equivalent to 1st ed ( way better IMO).

As everyone stated, everything burn faster, so 2 arc 3 primary is quite good for this cost.

I admit I kind of like the v2 Oicunn. I may be biased

As ludicrous as it sounds for a ship of its size and role, the Decimator lived by being able to arc dodge at least some of its enemies. In 2.0 it will literally melt to enemy fire.

Reinforce means no modded attacks, unless you bring Tua, who is of no use against alpha strikes, locks you to blue maneuvers after that, and conflicts with the ship’s title.

27 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

• Chiraneau's ability: FAR less powerful (dependent on an action, more difficult enemy positioning, and not able to stack with TL in the same round).

Not entirely true except when considering Chiraneau without further upgrades - it needs a free action to support target lock plus reinforce (achievable via The Grand Inquisitor or Minister Tua), and it does need correct judgement of enemy positioning, but it also functions at range 3 in second edition, where it currently doesn't.

I'm not saying it's not weakened, but I contest that it's far less powerful.

2 minutes ago, Jehan Menasis said:

Reinforce means no modded attacks, unless you bring Tua, who is of no use against alpha strikes, locks you to blue maneuvers after that, and conflicts with the ship’s title.

Seeing the previous comment about Admiral Sloane, if you have a number of academy pilots supporting the decimator, Ruthlessness is not a bad way to add some dice modification.

For that matter, an oicunn/intimidation decimator and chiraneau ruthlessness decimator might be a nasty pairing.

19 minutes ago, player2422845 said:

It is target of potential 4 dice with mod! Add intimidation, his ability is at the very least equivalent to 1st ed ( way better IMO).

As everyone stated, everything burn faster, so 2 arc 3 primary is quite good for this cost.

I admit I kind of like the v2 Oicunn. I may be biased

It's not though.

1e Oicunn does autodamage and you can shoot freely.

2e Oicunn does almost nothing that he couldn't do already; his ability is only better if you only have one target AND it's bumped into you. In particular, 1e Oicunn excels at being able to bump someone, then have them move away from him afterwards, which makes him a predator for higher-init low-hull aces.

2e Oicunn might as well not have an ability, if you can't actually BLOCK someone. Because avoiding the ram is honestly pretty trivial.

A few thoughts for m a guy who couldn't be happier that pwts got sent back to whatever lazy **** spawned them

1.) New mobile mechanic arc is amazing, requires ACTUAL DECISION MAKING and the ability to plan ahead

Pinch me, I'm dreaming

2.) Reinforce is great, but you still burn FAST.

3.) I had been under the assumption that nerfed pwts were going to get cost reductions to around the Lancer's cost (approx health the list)

They didn't, I think they need it (except Dash; too easy to get out of hand)

The Deci nowadays is basically just a slightly better YV, I think the base cost REALLY needs to come down. Imo, I'd start it out priced the same as the VCX (70)

The Deci should also be cheaper than the yts because it can't reposition

Ran Cheri with Vader crew + trickshot + tua. Really good loadout (even after I got a string of crits resulting in five stress AND damaged sensor array...), just feel it's overcosted

44 minutes ago, SOTL said:

Or you could drop the Decimator for Iden Versio and another 2 Academy Pilots...

Which defeats the purpose of this thread talking about the Decimator.

Just now, That Blasted Samophlange said:

Which defeats the purpose of this thread talking about the Decimator.

OR perfectly encapsulates any discussion about the Decimator.

37 minutes ago, SOTL said:

I think all the big turreted ships are overcosted in that they haven't really had a discount applied for switching to mobile arcs. If Luke is an indicative cost of the value of being able to shoot at whatever you want then you'd kind of expect it to be a ballpark for the cost reduction that former turreted ships need in order to compete.

In the grand scheme of things they'll almost certainly fall somewhere between their old costs and the old Shadowcasters, I'd guess closer to the former. Mobile arcs are a very welcome change but we already know from the Shadowcaster that they're not a dramatic reduction in power.

44 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

Not to mention if you want to bring Sloane you're probably better off with a Reaper.

Unless I am waiting for the inevitable rerelease of the reaper.

4 minutes ago, YourHucklebrry said:

In the grand scheme of things they'll almost certainly fall somewhere between their old costs and the old Shadowcasters, I'd guess closer to the former. Mobile arcs are a very welcome change but we already know from the Shadowcaster that they're not a dramatic reduction in power.

Sort of. A mobile arc when you've got a fixed primary is one thing, a mobile arc without that solid locked arc that the Lancers benefit from is definitely much worse.

Balance wise, I'm not sure they're "correctly" costed to be competitive.

But, RAC has been my favorite second edition 2.0 ship. Slowly burning down taking 1-2 per shot you don't dodge, instead of just being a large base boosting boring turret is really interesting.

8 minutes ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

Unless I am waiting for the inevitable rerelease of the reaper.

That's a long wait for a train don't come.