3 minutes ago, defkhan1 said:@Biophysical what is your current working build for Rexler? Juke, HLC, FCS, Homing Missiles? Or something cheaper? If you had to start dropping upgrades for points where would you start?
That's the build. I think (with the expectation that multiple ships will initially be more common than lower ship count lists) that I'd drop FCS first. It doesn't do a ton vs high ship count lists. Then I'd probably drop HLC. FCS vs Homing is pretty meta dependent, though.
New Squadron
(84) Rexler Brath
(4) Juke
(3) Fire-Control System
Points 91
(40) "Howlrunner"
Points 40
(23) Academy Pilot
Points 23
(23) Academy Pilot
Points 23
(23) Academy Pilot
Points 23
Total points: 200
10 minutes ago, DXCrazytrain said:New Squadron
(84) Rexler Brath
(4) Juke
(3) Fire-Control System
Points 91(40) "Howlrunner"
Points 40(23) Academy Pilot
Points 23(23) Academy Pilot
Points 23(23) Academy Pilot
Points 23Total points: 200
I've been looking at Miniswarms on paper, but haven't tried any yet. I kind of like the idea of 3 named ones. It's worse at blocking, but it's usually putting put more dangerpus shots.
Some combo of 3 of Wampa, Scourge, Mauler, or Hask fit easily, and all have conditional extra dice.
the few people ive seen locally playing 2.0 with gencon stuff the imperial player ALWAYS had howlie + 3 ties, be it with Vader, a Defender, Phantom + some more TIEs, etc etc and it...rarely worked.
Granted, none of these people are ultimate xwing pros however they arent exactly bad players either. Two of them were people i couldnt beat for quite awhile when i started playing.
2 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:the few people ive seen locally playing 2.0 with gencon stuff the imperial player ALWAYS had howlie + 3 ties, be it with Vader, a Defender, Phantom + some more TIEs, etc etc and it...rarely worked.
Granted, none of these people are ultimate xwing pros however they arent exactly bad players either. Two of them were people i couldnt beat for quite awhile when i started playing.
Can you explain why it didn't work? Was it bad matchups, poor play, bad dice, difficulty coordinating squad elements?
The TIEs just died in droves. They never survived 2 hits and any 4die attacks (ptorps, 4die rebel ships, R1) almost always just removed them.
I chalked it up to bad luck at first but it happened in 6 different games. Course the one with Vader still won because...vader...lol
Just now, Vineheart01 said:The TIEs just died in droves. They never survived 2 hits and any 4die attacks (ptorps, 4die rebel ships, R1) almost always just removed them.
I chalked it up to bad luck at first but it happened in 6 different games. Course the one with Vader still won because...vader...lol
Maybe they need Iden instead of Howl. Lower offense, but it keeps them in the game longer.
Probably.
I think the locals forget that Iden cancels the entire attack, not 1 damage. Even still, hes 16pts over an Academy so i could see if you have the points to just take another academy instead. However, Iden can prevent a heavy alpha-strike. Which would have helped against the ptorps most lists seem to be using around here, preventing them from deleting a TIE at R3 before they could even attempt to fight back.
So many fun looking options.
They're all Init 5, so Whisper softens the target, Maarek can pick out some crits, then Rexler can expose them.
7 hours ago, Bad Idea Comics said:How were the Defenders kitted out? Were they pulling the Boost+K routine? I'm understandably curious!
He had FCS in this particular game. However, I played it like as if he had Adv Sensors to head sim it as much as I could. A good defender player can outfly a tie swarm. Big thing locally is people will fly these things like the 1.0 defenders and get crushed.
3 hours ago, Vineheart01 said:The TIEs just died in droves. They never survived 2 hits and any 4die attacks (ptorps, 4die rebel ships, R1) almost always just removed them.
I chalked it up to bad luck at first but it happened in 6 different games. Course the one with Vader still won because...vader...lol
Have you heard the good news about our Lord and Savior, Iden Versio?
I've been think about using by this defender list. I will probably go with Rexler eventually but think that swarms will be heavy in the early meta, with all the excitement surrounding them. With this build can Col Vessery use his lock to launch a cluster missile, get a lock and spend it on that attack to reroll, attack a second time per the card rule and spend the lock on that attack?
(88) Colonel Vessery
(5) Cluster Missiles
(4) Juke
Points 97
(45) Zertik Strom
(3) Fire-Control System
Points 48
(50) Maarek Stele
(3) Fire-Control System
Points 53
Total points: 198
21 hours ago, Mattman7306 said:I'm not too sure about this. It kinda ruins the flavor FFG intended for the ship, but I also think there can be an interesting choice with x/7 vs TIE/D.
Oh also I agree with Wiredin's suggestion above.
The defender has the biggest guns of any starfighter in Star Wars.
In terms of "flavor" it should be 4/4/3/3 at least, as the whole point of it is that its better than any fighter in every single regard but it costs a preposterous amount to manufacture. I get that its difficult to fit into the games balance, but if we cant run the 3 man wings we used to they should have made it 90 points for a generic and pumped it more. You know, make it the best ship in game hands down, but tax it hard in squad points so you pay for the privilege
Edited by Vontoothskie6 hours ago, Vontoothskie said:The defender has the biggest guns of any starfighter in Star Wars.
In terms of "flavor" it should be 4/4/3/3 at least, as the whole point of it is that its better than any fighter in every single regard but it costs a preposterous amount to manufacture. I get that its difficult to fit into the games balance, but if we cant run the 3 man wings we used to they should have made it 90 points for a generic and pumped it more. You know, make it the best ship in game hands down, but tax it hard in squad points so you pay for the privilege
I would have preferred this. Not only because it is on theme but because it would then leave plenty of room for the Tie Avenger generic to start at 70 and end at 90. That would give a nice progression from the Tie Adv->Avenger->Defender. Oh well
12 hours ago, Shockley said:I've been think about using by this defender list. I will probably go with Rexler eventually but think that swarms will be heavy in the early meta, with all the excitement surrounding them. With this build can Col Vessery use his lock to launch a cluster missile, get a lock and spend it on that attack to reroll, attack a second time per the card rule and spend the lock on that attack?
(88) Colonel Vessery
(5) Cluster Missiles
(4) Juke
Points 97(45) Zertik Strom
(3) Fire-Control System
Points 48(50) Maarek Stele
(3) Fire-Control System
Points 53Total points: 198
I think that's kind of a waste of action efficiency bonuses. Vessery needs the lock to fire the missiles in the first place, and firing the missiles doesn't spend the lock, so getting a free lock from his ability gains nothing. You could get a free lock on the splash attack, if your support ships had different targets locked, but overall it's not that great.
The only missiles I'd think too hard about are Homing because they're cheap and Protons, because the don't need a lock. I think probably you don't take any, though.
I do want to hit on something I've noticed that I didn't elaborate enough in the OP.
I mentioned it's a pretty tough ship. 7 HP, 3 AGI with a token stack makes that obvious. I didnt talk about how that opens up your options.
In 1.0, x7s were the ships with the token stack, so a lock was purely to power your primaries. As x7s were often moving first anyway, Focus was pretty much the only action on approach, especially as that was when a Defender was most vulnerable.
With 2.0, Defenders are tougher, and have relatively higher Initiative (PS) compared to the average. They also now keep their compliment of missiles. All of these factors combine to make an opening turn Target Lock a lot more useful than it used to be, and easier to get, particularly for I5 Rexler. Homing Missiles, if you've got them, or even just a Juke primary shot are pretty likely to do damage or burn tokens at long range, while allowing you to keep the Lock for the follow up close range primary.
On 8/17/2018 at 11:28 PM, Bad Idea Comics said:Lol, it's not Jousting. It's Defender arc-dodging. You start out of guns range, then end up behind them. Most ships can't do that - the Adv Sensor Defender can. From there, you Boost at an angle and 4k again, where they don't expect you, simply because the natural response will be to k-turn the swarm to meet the threat. Really, the best option for the swarm is to split forces to cover more arcs, but that also plays to the advantage of the Defender, as now there are fewer guns pointing their way.
I'm not saying Defenders are better than swarms, but they're certainly even.
The main issue I see is a reliance on native dice. For some of us, that just spells bad. Would be great if you could pull it off, but dice need to be modded somehow and I dont think you can push enough damage through on a swarm to kill it quick enough without mods.
3 minutes ago, Archangelspiv said:The main issue I see is a reliance on native dice. For some of us, that just spells bad. Would be great if you could pull it off, but dice need to be modded somehow and I dont think you can push enough damage through on a swarm to kill it quick enough without mods.
The turns you use the boost+k you get the Outmaneuver bonus. The rest of the time youre modding shots. Often, you get both benefits. Don't take my word for it, fly it!
Have people found any decent partners for Vessery? Vader doesnt work unless you resign yourself to a 2 ship list. I was gonna say Redline but ideally you want Vessery to be able to shoot first.
3 minutes ago, defkhan1 said:Have people found any decent partners for Vessery? Vader doesnt work unless you resign yourself to a 2 ship list. I was gonna say Redline but ideally you want Vessery to be able to shoot first.
I put together an interesting list with Vess and a couple of OS-1 Rho Gunboats with FCS.
44 minutes ago, defkhan1 said:Have people found any decent partners for Vessery? Vader doesnt work unless you resign yourself to a 2 ship list. I was gonna say Redline but ideally you want Vessery to be able to shoot first.
Maybe Deathrain, then?
Can't go wrong with triple action (bomb --> focus, boost --> linked lock = barrage Rocket fun) trajectory simulating Deathrain ?
unless he gets shot, ofc
I was, and still am, a big fan of the 1.0 list, QD and 2 Silencers that @Biophysical helped popularize. Heavy jousters are perfect for my flying style so I've been trying to figure out a 2.0 Imperial list that gels with my style like QD and 2 Silencers did. Here's what I came up with.
New Squadron
(84) Rexler Brath
(4) Juke
Points 88
(78) Onyx Squadron Ace
(4) Juke
Points 82
(30) Gideon Hask
Points 30
Total points: 200
Again, only 3 ships so swarms will be a problem, but if I can get lucky and focus down one ship a round, as well as avoid some arcs, I think it has a fighting chance.
1 hour ago, DXCrazytrain said:I was, and still am, a big fan of the 1.0 list, QD and 2 Silencers that @Biophysical helped popularize. Heavy jousters are perfect for my flying style so I've been trying to figure out a 2.0 Imperial list that gels with my style like QD and 2 Silencers did. Here's what I came up with.
New Squadron
(84) Rexler Brath
(4) Juke
Points 88(78) Onyx Squadron Ace
(4) Juke
Points 82(30) Gideon Hask
Points 30Total points: 200
Again, only 3 ships so swarms will be a problem, but if I can get lucky and focus down one ship a round, as well as avoid some arcs, I think it has a fighting chance.
I think I know of one 3 ship list with two Defenders that I like, Fel + 2 Deltas. You could do a different ace instead of Fel, but I feel like on the big named ships, the upgrades are more worth it. I'm quite uncertain of this opinion, though.
5 minutes ago, Biophysical said:I think I know of one 3 ship list with two Defenders that I like, Fel + 2 Deltas. You could do a different ace instead of Fel, but I feel like on the big named ships, the upgrades are more worth it. I'm quite uncertain of this opinion, though.
This fits and everybody is moving at I4. You can swap out Del for Seyn or Gideon if you like. If you drop the Juke from the TIE/ln you can buy FCS for both defenders.
Onyx Squadron Ace (78)
Juke (4)
Onyx Squadron Ace (78)
Juke (4)
Del Meeko (30)
Juke (4)
Total: 198