1 hour ago, Commander Kaine said:

The words I use, the tone of my posts... these are stylistic choices, and are part of my "forum persona", if you will. They have nothing to do with my message, or my points, or anything. And if you would like to ignore my points, because you find my style unbearable, fine.... That's your choice.

Your "forum persona" is a thinly veiled form of self protection, something to hide your opinions behind for the (numerous) cases where you are either objectively wrong, or where your opinion is based on misrepresented facts. Case in point is your fear that FFG didn't change when it absolutely did. Those in charge now are not the same that created the core set of 1.0*. A second example is the criticism of Advanced Sensors, where you write "The advanced sensor thing was to highlight that we very much got something that it is untested." when this is demonstrably false. The only reason you even know about two versions is because it was tested and changed.

But even worse, your "forum persona" is ultimately detrimental to what you at least claim to be doing - it distracts from those rare cases where you actually do have a point, where you raise a good question that is worthy of discussion. Without your persona you could have led to many interesting threads. With it you start one dumpster fire after the other.

I do not care about too much about either of them. The first is annyoing at worst, the second is your own embarassment.

What I do care about though is how you rile up opinions. You are a model agitator, befitting our time with increasing populism, where "innocent questions" are asked. Maybe you do mean well, and are honest when you write "I LOVE X-Wing, and I want it to be better. [...] It's because I care." But the effect you are having is that you are doing your part of turning the official forums into the vile pit that other online communities think it is.

Maybe it is time for your forum persona to change?

Edit, as I won't reply otherwise:

*as you did not understand why the core set and its initial designers are relevant here: The following designers had to build on shoddy foundations that were never intended to be a competitive game. But they corrected many systematic flaws for 2.0 and that is why you would first have to demonstrate why all the changes by FFG are not enough and indeed lacking so much that it justifies your use of language "there was not a single thing that convinced me that we should all be happy forever, because FFG has CHANGED. However, those problems did not emerge from nothing... They are the result of the people working on it, and the circumstances around them. If those parts are problematic, the flaws will seep through again and again, no matter how many times you start over. "

Additionally, engaging with a troll is a fool's errand. Maybe you do not realize, but those people you are shamelessly accusing of "trying to do something else than discuss." are having interesting, respectful and fruitful discussions in threads without you. They don't need the hyperbolic language of your 'persona'. They don't need to hide behind it, and their words stand on their own merit.

38 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

Your "forum persona" is a thinly veiled form of self protection, something to hide your opinions behind for the (numerous) cases where you are either objectively wrong, or where your opinion is based on misrepresented facts. Case in point is your fear that FFG didn't change when it absolutely did. Those in charge now are not the same that created the core set of 1.0. A second example is the criticism of Advanced Sensors, where you write "The advanced sensor thing was to highlight that we very much got something that it is untested." when this is demonstrably false. The only reason you even know about two versions is because it was tested and changed.

No, the people in charge now are the people who have given us the Jumpmaster, Miranda, the Punisher and all the nasty things like that. There were 14 waves of 1.0, and the team change didn't happen last wave.

The design team themselves talks about this during an interview about 2.0, telling us when did they join.

You see, if you were trying to make an actual argument, you wouldn't "forget" to mention this tidbit. The very same design team that MADE 2.0, made some of the most cancerous things in 1.0. That was my point, and I think it is clear.

But you are trying to misrepresent my argument, and build a strawman.

My point wasn't that FFG has never changed. That's not what I said. I didn't mention the 1.0 core set, you did.

Furthermore... The only thing we know about Adv. Sensors, is that it was changed. Neither of us knows anything about testing.

38 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

But even worse, your "forum persona" is ultimately detrimental to what you at least claim to be doing - it distracts from those rare cases where you actually do have a point, where you raise a good question that is worthy of discussion. Without your persona you could have led to many interesting threads. With it you start one dumpster fire after the other.

It doesn't distract everyone. It distracts a few people, like yourself, who are trying to do something else than discuss. Your behavior above is a perfect example of a dishonest discussion.

38 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

I do not care about too much about either of them. The first is annyoing at worst, the second is your own embarassment.

What I do care about though is how you rile up opinions. You are a model agitator, befitting our time with increasing populism, where "innocent questions" are asked. Maybe you do mean well, and are honest when you write "I LOVE X-Wing, and I want it to be better. [...] It's because I care." But the effect you are having is that you are doing your part of turning the official forums into the vile pit that other online communities think it is.

Again. I'm not trying to be popular. I don't think my actions are very conclusive to that goal.

Funny that you mention these times we live in, I too notice their effects on the forums. Interestingly enough, I came to a different conclusion.

The way I see it, I made a thread, where I voiced some of my frustrations and beliefs about some issues, while admitting that changes were made, and everything is a lot better now.

You might disagree. That's perfectly fine. But that's not what happened. Virtually, none of my critics said anything of substance. (Props to the exceptions). If anything, they picked at a word they didn't like.

This really does ring a bell. It reminds me of political discussions an awful lot.

I assume that's what you refer to.

I would just like to ask you a question.

Is the trolling populist who tries to make reasonable discussion, the one ruining the forums, even after they are insulted over and over again, or the ones who just call them names and refuse to engage (probably tossing in some nice fallacies to go with)?

38 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

Maybe it is time for your forum persona to change?

You know. Many people here just said they see my points, and they don't think I am a troll. I think they get my style. Some people don't. I'm fine with that.

I don't think I am making the forums a worse place either. Just look at this thread. There is a legit discussion happening about design, for several pages now, but you guys keep bringing back the drama. I participate in that discussion as well. You don't. You and SOTL and others only come here to comment about ME.

And this thread isn't about me. It's about X-Wing.

Now, you are welcome to voice your opinion about starships, or if you'd like, we may continue to turn the forums into that vile pit... together ❤️

6 hours ago, Firebird TMK said:

Er, could it be because they PAID for those upgrades, ENJOY playing with them, and resent being told, "Too bad about all that money you spent, WE don't like them so you can't play with them"?

I think you DO understand why people are so adverse to the idea of bans, but you don't like their reasons and consider yourself morally superior to them because you get in line with "change".

As someone who played heavily with Y-Wing and K-Wing lists that made liberal use of TLT's (and Autoblaster Turrets, for that matter), I fully sympathize and agree with such people.

Ah. So 2.0 is a free upgrade to make the game better then??

No??

I guess nobody cares about the money I spent to play 1.0. FOR EVERY SINGLE COMPONENT. Except for the ships which are useless without an upgrade. That'll be $50 per faction, please. Too bad about the money you spent on 1.0. Just spend more and it'll be better.

Kinda like if a single card got banned. But more comprehensive and expensive.

Basically, the entire game is now banned, from an offical point of view. And maybe if there had been a few minor bans (instead of designing to keep lousy cards in the game), we wouldn't be here right now.

You are all acting like a bunch of children right now. No wonder the rest of the X-Wing community thinks these forums are vile piles of trash.

2 hours ago, Darth Meanie said:

Nien Nunb doesn't do anything different with Lando than he does in any other crew slot.

So, no I'm not saying make him "Lando Only". But maybe "when with Lando also blah blah blah."

Sorry I assumed you knew what the cards you were ******* about did.

On 8/9/2018 at 6:28 PM, Old Sarge said:

There’s a lot of discussion above about the backlash Kaine received for starting this thread. Kaine has some good points-there may be flaws in the design process. When you read through the thread, understand that the backlash may be due to the source. In other words, people are responding to Kaine based in part on his history on this forum.

He is the guy who has talked about which country’s people he doesn’t like. He has referred to people who disagree with him as “garbage people,” and he routinely makes absolute claims on issues that are subjective.

I don’t discount what Kaine says, because he knows the game well enough that even when he’s wrong there’s a kernel of truth there. Still, I sympathize with posters who react strongly to him.

Ive been on the forumns 3 years, i know hes kind of a ****.

My issue here is that I also know other prople are dicks.

the people ive seen behave the worst are the same the people giving him ****, and in fact the same people who have been downright toxic on here for a year to me and others. People whos majority input on the boards seems to be telling others that they arent welcome or insulting/bullying. Im not into it when anybody does it, commander kaine or ficklegreen dice... we are all better than that

Lets just talk to about the game, which was what commander kaine was doing in this post innitially

4 hours ago, Mattman7306 said:

Sorry I assumed you knew what the cards you were ******* about did.

I was doing my best to create an example of what I meant without XWM stuff in front of me. Lucky for you, I chose the perfect bad example.

So, anyone have any good breakfast food recently?

And while i'm at it, how about that trolley wing eh? Electric engines seem OP, and need to be nerfed.

5 minutes ago, Do I need a Username said:

So, anyone have any good breakfast food recently?

And while i'm at it, how about that trolley wing eh? Electric engines seem OP, and need to be nerfed.

Ah yes, the trolley discussion.

Let's combine with breakfast this time.

A trolley is heading down the track full speed, right towards a delicious pile of blueberry pancakes. Meanwhile, on the side track, a fresh omelette is peacefully minding its own business.

You could divert the trolley away from all the pancakes, but you would destroy the beautiful omelette. Do you pull the switch?

Let me fix the title for you: "2-0 is an abomination that no one wanted."

FFG help mess up the game, but only for the tournament players they bow down to. In order to apparently fix it for these tournament players (casual players simply don't use elements they don't like) FFG decide to throw cool ships, upgrades, pilots, rules and veteran players under the bus, so that Tournament players can have a nice 'meta'... (until they smash it apart down the road and FFG decide to do this all again).

No one in their right mind ditches a load of gaming stuff they paid good money for, in order to spend $100+ on a load of cardboard and rules that drain every scrap of fun from the game. I'd rather buy into the upcoming BSG game LOL.. in fact even Attack wing is looking interesting to me.

Why should I be penalised and have to pay out, because tournament players like to bleat about how they broke 1.0 with their combos and now they need an adult to fix things for them with 2.0. Really?

3 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

Ah yes, the trolley discussion.

Let's combine with breakfast this time.

A trolley is heading down the track full speed, right towards a delicious pile of blueberry pancakes. Meanwhile, on the side track, a fresh omelette is peacefully minding its own business.

You could divert the trolley away from all the pancakes, but you would destroy the beautiful omelette. Do you pull the switch?

I specifically asked about the trolley game meta NOT THE TROLLEY PROBLEM!! DO YOU EVEN READ?!?!?!?

Also you've made this an economic problem instead.

Anyway, for those unacquainted, I'm referring to the trolley game published by FRG, in which players control dynamic trolleys as they pick up and deposit passengers.

2 minutes ago, madquest8 said:

Let me fix the title for you: "2-0 is an abomination that no one wanted."

FFG help mess up the game, but only for the tournament players they bow down to. In order to apparently fix it for these tournament players (casual players simply don't use elements they don't like) FFG decide to throw cool ships, upgrades, pilots, rules and veteran players under the bus, so that Tournament players can have a nice 'meta'... (until they smash it apart down the road and FFG decide to do this all again).

No one in their right mind ditches a load of gaming stuff they paid good money for, in order to spend $100+ on a load of cardboard and rules that drain every scrap of fun from the game. I'd rather buy into the upcoming BSG game LOL.. in fact even Attack wing is looking interesting to me.

Why should I be penalised and have to pay out, because tournament players like to bleat about how they broke 1.0 with their combos and now they need an adult to fix things for them with 2.0. Really?

you do know that attack wing did a soft reboot and is doing individual upgrade packs per ship for the new rule set and no "conversion kits". So if I were an Attack Wing Player I would have to buy both the Defiant model and the Defiant card pack to upgrade to the new rules... oh and those upgrade packs are like $10 each. JFC like really? you would rather do that than X-wings conversion kits? give your head a shake.

Mechwarrior clix.... a whole new kit comes out, the old cards were essentially obsolete and gone and we had to buy a new core set and more blind packs which were just reissues of the old with the new rules set... yea that was cheap....no no it wasn't.

2.0 was needed. and not just by tournament players. even casual games aren't fun with BS like TLT and Miranda.

anyways....

3 minutes ago, Do I need a Username said:

I specifically asked about the trolley game meta NOT THE TROLLEY PROBLEM!! DO YOU EVEN READ?!?!?!?

Also you've made this an economic problem instead.

Anyway, for those unacquainted, I'm referring to the trolley game published by FRG, in which players control dynamic trolleys as they pick up and deposit passengers.

Oh, sorry, it seems nobody actually read my last post in this thread so I figured it's a no-reading zone.

I haven't been paying much attention to the trolley meta ever since trolley 2.0 was announced, but I seem to recall that a good strategy in the meta was to just invest in one huge trolley and then have a tiny PS11 trolley with coordinate to help it move around faster.

Just now, Kieransi said:

Oh, sorry, it seems nobody actually read my last post in this thread so I figured it's a no-reading zone.

I haven't been paying much attention to the trolley meta ever since trolley 2.0 was announced, but I seem to recall that a good strategy in the meta was to just invest in one huge trolley and then have a tiny PS11 trolley with coordinate to help it move around faster.

Hence why electric op.

Read casual.

1 minute ago, Kieransi said:

I figured it's a no-reading zone.

correction, we need the Mynocks to read out threads in the next podcast episode. someone tag farmer.

I will, as one does, use this opportunity to declare my strong support for bacon, as the ultimate breakfast food.

Anyway, lately I'm working as a receptionist in a hotel, exclusively night shifts. One of my jobs is to make the breakfast for the guests, so I have acquired quite the expertise in the matter, and I'd have to add that if you aim to make your breakfast seasonal (always a good idea!) do include some fruits.

So honeydew and watermelon with a fresh glass of orange juice is an EXCELLENT choice for this meta, where the high heat and humidity naturally counter fatty foods like bacon.

2 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

Oh, sorry, it seems nobody actually read my last post in this thread so I figured it's a no-reading zone.

I haven't been paying much attention to the trolley meta ever since trolley 2.0 was announced, but I seem to recall that a good strategy in the meta was to just invest in one huge trolley and then have a tiny PS11 trolley with coordinate to help it move around faster.

I always read your posts ?

honeydew and watermelon is the kanan-biggs of breakfest.

Just now, Wiredin said:

honeydew and watermelon is the kanan-biggs of breakfest.

I think this is insulting to my values, but after reading the thread rules I'm unsure of how to proceed. Wait till Monday I guess.

2 minutes ago, Wiredin said:

honeydew and watermelon is the kanan-biggs of breakfest.

How dare you insult such noble fruits? :/

because they are usually accompanied by stale muffins and danishes as part of my complimentary breakfast at the hotel. easy mode for the hosts. for when even the hotel staff decides the best method to hospitality is eating glue.

@madquest8 the sad emote is not a downvote. thanks for playing.

And that's why the game has been ruined by the cancer that is 2.0. Children on forums like this one.

I'll take cancer over Lothal/Fenn, Bob, Miranda/Nym Despotism anyday.

Just now, Wiredin said:

@madquest8 the sad emote is not a downvote. thanks for playing.

Furthermore, if attempting to use reactions as a downvote, collaborate! Others use confused. It's pretty strong.

2 minutes ago, madquest8 said:

And that's why the game has been ruined by the cancer that is 2.0. Children on forums like this one.

I'm over the legal age of majority, thank you very much.

1 minute ago, Wiredin said:

I'll take cancer over Lothal/Fenn, Bob, Miranda/Nym Despotism anyday.

Hey, despotism is fun for some people.