Edited cause I don't know how to Quote ?

7 minutes ago, GeneralZod217 said:

This seems pretty clear to me.

Y-wing has a primary weapon in its forward arc. After making an attack from this weapon it can make an attack using its turret. As the turret has not yet been fired the arc it is pointed at is irrelevant as the turret has not fired already.

However the falcon has a turret for a primary weapon. After making an attack from one arc it's bonus one has to be from the other arc.

Thiughts?

This is correct. Everything else is just wishful thinking or trolling.

7 minutes ago, GeneralZod217 said:

This seems pretty clear to me.

Y-wing has a primary weapon in its forward arc. After making an attack from this weapon it can make an attack using its turret. As the turret has not yet been fired the arc it is pointed at is irrelevant as the turret has not fired already.

However the falcon has a turret for a primary weapon. After making an attack from one arc it's bonus one has to be from the other arc.

Thiughts?

This is how I see it. I personally feel that the card is worded in such a way to prevent primary weapon turrets from being used to double attack in the same arc.

16 hours ago, Mep said:

@meffo I'll join you in insanity. Veteran Turret Gunner only says if you can make a bonus dancer attack but you can't fire out of the same dancer you already fired out of. It actually doesn't care if you fired out of your accountant or not. It is not checking accountant, just the dancer. If it is checking for both accountant and dancer, then it would simply say Sam. In the case of the shadow caster, it says you need both accountant and dancer but the accountant could be Bill who sets next to Sam. They are different checks because they are different things.

yes, but since the rules reference says the accountant is the accountant in addition to being the dancer, when veteran turret gunner checks if you've fired out of the dancer, the check is a positive, since the accountant you've already fired out of is the dancer in addition to being the accountant, even when not being used as a dancer during the previous attack.

in the case of the shadow caster, it checks dancer and then it checks accountant. it doesn't matter if they are the the same or different, if both checks are confirmed the effect still happens.

1 hour ago, GeneralZod217 said:

This seems pretty clear to me.

Y-wing has a primary weapon in its forward arc. After making an attack from this weapon it can make an attack using its turret. As the turret has not yet been fired the arc it is pointed at is irrelevant as the turret has not fired already.

However the falcon has a turret for a primary weapon. After making an attack from one arc it's bonus one has to be from the other arc.

Thiughts?

this is not correct according to the rules reference. the turret arc symbol has nothing to do with the weapon. it means turret arc. the front arc is a standard arc in addition to being a turret arc while the turret indicator is pointing at it. it will remain a standard arc in addition to being a turret arc no matter which weapon you fire out of it. it will stop being a turret arc only when you move the turret indicator out of it.

since veteran turret gunner states that you can perform a bonus attack from a turret arc you haven't fired from previously, you cannot attack again from the same arc.

1 hour ago, meffo said:

this is not correct according to the rules reference. the turret arc symbol has nothing to do with the weapon. it means turret arc. the front arc is a standard arc in addition to being a turret arc while the turret indicator is pointing at it. it will remain a standard arc in addition to being a turret arc no matter which weapon you fire out of it. it will stop being a turret arc only when you move the turret indicator out of it.

since veteran turret gunner states that you can perform a bonus attack from a turret arc you haven't fired from previously, you cannot attack again from the same arc.

Look, there are reports that two different developer says it works. I know you need an FAQ before you understand "in addition to" means it gets to be two different things rather than one combined single thing. If they wanted VTG to work the way you want it to work, they would have used different language on the card.

To help you with your English.

https://www.macmillandictionary.com/us/dictionary/american/in-addition-to-something

7 minutes ago, Mep said:

Look, there are reports that two different developer says it works. I know you need an FAQ before you understand "in addition to" means it gets to be two different things rather than one combined single thing. If they wanted VTG to work the way you want it to work, they would have used different language on the card.

To help you with your English.

https://www.macmillandictionary.com/us/dictionary/american/in-addition-to-something

A link to those reports would be nice if available. Vet Turret Gunner not being able to double tap a target in a single arc calls allot of what they've done slot allocation and points wise into question big time.

How about an official FFG email. See reddit post in link. This issue is settled. It is very clear what "in addition to" means in the English language.

https://www.reddit.com/r/XWingTMG/comments/9gzaqp/some_rules_clarifications_from_ffg_emailed_to/

2 minutes ago, Mep said:

How about an official FFG email. See reddit post in link. This issue is settled. It is very clear what "in addition to" means in the English language.

https://www.reddit.com/r/XWingTMG/comments/9gzaqp/some_rules_clarifications_from_ffg_emailed_to/

The second question and answer settles it directly. Nice. I'm looking forwards to the Rules Reference update mentioned.

Yes, and the first question makes it clear a primary attack is not the same thing as an different kind of attack out of the front arc. It is a front primary attack in addition to the other form of attack.

well, this certainly cleared it up.

So now the question is, can a double-turret-arc ship attack with Han Solo (gunner), then have Lt. Blount give that ship a Rotate Arc action, they spin it 180 degrees, then at their normal initiative, they shoot again out of the opposite arc (in the same direction)?

2 minutes ago, emeraldbeacon said:

So now the question is, can a double-turret-arc ship attack with Han Solo (gunner), then have Lt. Blount give that ship a Rotate Arc action, they spin it 180 degrees, then at their normal initiative, they shoot again out of the opposite arc (in the same direction)?

Rotate ()

Pilots can rotate to alert a gunner or aim one of the ship's turret-mounted armaments. When a ship performs the action, it rotates the turret arc indicator to select any other standard arc .

• If a ship rotates a double turret arc indicator, it must select the other two standard arcs it was not already selecting.
• If an ability instructs a ship to rotate its indicator, this is different than performing a action. A ship that rotates its indicator without performing the action can still perform a action this round.

1 minute ago, emeraldbeacon said:

So now the question is, can a double-turret-arc ship attack with Han Solo (gunner), then have Lt. Blount give that ship a Rotate Arc action, they spin it 180 degrees, then at their normal initiative, they shoot again out of the opposite arc (in the same direction)?

nope. you can't spin your double turret arc 180 degrees. it's on page 16 of the rules reference, under rotate. "• If a ship rotates a double turret arc indicator, it must select the other two standard arcs it was not already selecting."

Thanks, @meffo and @Hiemfire , for the ninja-reflex answer

I guess the only way to double-tap the same target with Han this way, is to get them RIGHT on one of your diagonals...

12 hours ago, meffo said:

well, this certainly cleared it up.

Where is this Q&A?

28 minutes ago, papy72 said:

Where is this Q&A?

https://www.reddit.com/r/XWingTMG/comments/9gzaqp/some_rules_clarifications_from_ffg_emailed_to/

9 hours ago, papy72 said:

Where is this Q&A?

This is now in the new Rules Reference (v1.0.2, effective 9/28/2018) on page 23.

Rules Reference v1.0.2

i read this as if you have a double turret you can use that once then have to use a separate weapon system as the symbol denotes a turret and for all intents and purposes a single/double turret is classed as a single weapon system

the perceived intent of han gunner would be to shoot first

not shoot a weapon then use that same weapon again in your turn

8 hours ago, ultratarantula said:

i read this as if you have a double turret you can use that once then have to use a separate weapon system as the symbol denotes a turret and for all intents and purposes a single/double turret is classed as a single weapon system

the perceived intent of han gunner would be to shoot first

not shoot a weapon then use that same weapon again in your turn

The Rules reference defines double turrets as follows: "A ship with a double turret arc indicator has two single turret arcs in opposite directions." That makes me think that each turret arc is considered a separate weapon / weapon system.

51 minutes ago, Nspace said:

The Rules reference defines double turrets as follows: "A ship with a double turret arc indicator has two single turret arcs in opposite directions." That makes me think that each turret arc is considered a separate weapon / weapon system.

Its the same weapon... it just has 2 arcs to choose from.

10 minutes ago, Icelom said:

Its the same weapon... it just has 2 arcs to choose from.

Sure, that works too.

The point is that I disagree with ultratarantula's statement that you shouldn't be able to / can't fire twice from a double turret. FFG allows and intends for turrets (or any weapon really) to use upgrades to fire multiple times a round, even at the same target or using the same arc or using the same weapon. Veteran Turret Gunner allows a primary weapon double turret ship like the Falcon to fire it's primary weapon out one arc then perform a bonus attack out of the other arc, while the Dengar JumpMaster pilot ability allows the primary weapon single turret to fire twice out of the same weapon and same arc. The Bossk gunner upgrade works equally well for single and double turret primary weapons (as well as any other front, back and full arc primary weapons). So Han Gunner being able to fire out of both turret arcs on the Falcon would be right in line with other upgrades that allow bonus attacks.

Just now, Nspace said:

Sure, that works too.

The point is that I disagree with ultratarantula's statement that you shouldn't be able to / can't fire twice from a double turret. FFG allows and intends for turrets (or any weapon really) to use upgrades to fire multiple times a round, even at the same target or using the same arc or using the same weapon. Veteran Turret Gunner allows a primary weapon double turret ship like the Falcon to fire it's primary weapon out one arc then perform a bonus attack out of the other arc, while the Dengar JumpMaster pilot ability allows the primary weapon single turret to fire twice out of the same weapon and same arc. The Bossk gunner upgrade works equally well for single and double turret primary weapons (as well as any other front, back and full arc primary weapons). So Han Gunner being able to fire out of both turret arcs on the Falcon would be right in line with other upgrades that allow bonus attacks.

I agree with you, Han says you can't fire out of the same turret arc...

So, there is an agreement that VTG allows a bow tie turret to fire out the each side of the turret...

Correct or no?

1 minute ago, Croste said:

So, there is an agreement that VTG allows a bow tie turret to fire out the each side of the turret...

Correct or no?

Yes. Vet Turret Gunner enables this because a "bow tie" primary is considered two seperate turrets by the rules.