So I'm currently running a KoTr campaign and want refined cortosis to be less common, but was thinking to have unrefined cortosis much more common. Considering the amount of Jedi and Sith there. Thinking unrefined cortosis grants the quality to allow the armors soak, but not the person's natural soak. Where refined allows their total soak and chance for shutting down sabers.
Unrefined Cortosis
Refined cortosis short circuits lightsabers, unrefined just stops breach.
Yes then considering a lesser unrefined that is more common in old republic that only allows the armor's soak but not personal soak
3 hours ago, Kilcannon said:Yes then considering a lesser unrefined that is more common in old republic that only allows the armor's soak but not personal soak
The problem there is that the system doesn't differentiate between Armor Soak, the body's natural soak. It's all added together as a single number.
6 minutes ago, Tramp Graphics said:The problem there is that the system doesn't differentiate between Armor Soak, the body's natural soak. It's all added together as a single number.
But it's not like it's hard to figure it out if the value is separated. If I have, for example, Soak 5 (2) then I can figure out that no amount Pierce or Breach can reduce my Soak below 2.
3 hours ago, Kilcannon said:Yes then considering a lesser unrefined that is more common in old republic that only allows the armor's soak but not personal soak
This would make it worse then regular armor
20 minutes ago, HappyDaze said:But it's not like it's hard to figure it out if the value is separated. If I have, for example, Soak 5 (2) then I can figure out that no amount Pierce or Breach can reduce my Soak below 2.
But would that really make much sense? Armor is much stronger, and more durable than flesh. If a weapon can easily blow through armor like it was tissue paper, then it would easily slice through flesh and bone without any problem whatsoever. By the same token, the weapon needs to get through the armor to damage the flesh. If the armor is immune to breach, then it's going to absorb, most, if not all of that energy, so even if the weapon penetrates further, most of the impact and cutting power has already been dissipated.
You're also talking about another level of unnecessary book keeping.
30 minutes ago, Tramp Graphics said:But would that really make much sense? Armor is much stronger, and more durable than flesh. If a weapon can easily blow through armor like it was tissue paper, then it would easily slice through flesh and bone without any problem whatsoever. By the same token, the weapon needs to get through the armor to damage the flesh. If the armor is immune to breach, then it's going to absorb, most, if not all of that energy, so even if the weapon penetrates further, most of the impact and cutting power has already been dissipated.
You're also talking about another level of unnecessary book keeping.
I agree on the bookkeeping and on it not making much sense, but I was showing that it is easy enough to mechanically model the desired effect.
I was saying that wearing this armor would give some soak that the armor can take since normally breach would go through the armor and the characters total soak. This would allow them to soak 1,2, or in some cases 3 or 4 with improved armor or the right talents
On 8/5/2018 at 8:23 PM, TheShard said:Refined cortosis short circuits lightsabers, unrefined just stops breach.
Not entirely accurate.
Cortosis, originally, shorted out lightsabers. That's all it did. The lightsaber would still cut a little bit, but the blade would flicker out of existence and need to be reignited (which can be done very quickly, but in combat could give an opponent with cortosis an edge against someone not expecting their lightsaber to shut off for no apparent reason).
It was only later where "cortosis" was used as an excuse to have lightsaber-resistant material, such as saying that every single melee weapon in the galaxy in the Knights of the Old Republic games was laced with cortosis so you could have actually interesting fights between guys with swords and guys with lightsabers. That was later explained as a specific way of refining and layering cortosis into an object.
Cortosis is very fragile, which makes it not suited for reinforcing armor or weapons unless you know a way to have the armor or weapon retain toughness while benefitting from cortosis. I refer you to I, Jedi, where the Jensaari had cortosis armor, and the Hand of Thrawn duology, where one of Thrawn's secret bases was in caves rich in cortosis ore. Both made lightsabers flicker out, which made Luke and Mara's job maneuvering through said caves much more difficult.
In game terms, there really isn't much difference between shutting down a lightsaber after a minor cut and resisting it altogether, both just increase the time (number of actions and attacks) needed to penetrate the material with a lightsaber. In the abstract, narrative system, calling Cortosis lightsaber-proof soak works perfectly well. The surprise factor of the suddenly-deactivated lightsaber blade isn't really modelled, but that's a minor thing and could be an easy house rule, or perhaps covered by an existing Talent or other ability.
Cortosis is really broken in a Jedi-heavy campaign so I just recommend not using it at all.
37 minutes ago, TyrisFlare said:Cortosis is really broken in a Jedi-heavy campaign so I just recommend not using it at all.
The same can be said about lightsabers.
13 hours ago, ErikModi said:In the abstract, narrative system, calling Cortosis lightsaber-proof soak works perfectly well. The surprise factor of the suddenly-deactivated lightsaber blade isn't really modelled, but that's a minor thing and could be an easy house rule, or perhaps covered by an existing Talent or other ability.
Almost.
Activating your saber is something you can only do on your turn. So if your saber get's shorted, until your next activation you're gonna have trouble using things like Parry and Reflect.
2 minutes ago, Ghostofman said:Almost.
Activating your saber is something you can only do on your turn. So if your saber get's shorted, until your next activation you're gonna have trouble using things like Parry and Reflect.
You could argue that the hilt can be used as an improvised melee weapon and therefore allows the use of Parry. You could, but shouldn't. ?
7 hours ago, HappyDaze said:The same can be said about lightsabers.
What I mean is that in a duel between one Jedi with cortosis armor and another Jedi without it, why even bother to roll (esp if one of them is Brawn-based).
It's like the consummate Arms Race item. Everyone needs it to be competitive, and that is kind of silly in my book.
Edited by TyrisFlare1 hour ago, TyrisFlare said:What I mean is that in a duel between one Jedi with cortosis armor and another Jedi without it, why even bother to roll (esp if one of them is Brawn-based).
It's like the consummate Arms Race item. Everyone needs it to be competitive, and that is kind of silly in my book.
It does really screw the guys trying to use a lightsaber, but there are many other ways to fight.
Or you just say screw it and find a way to get Deadly Accuracy: Lightsaber, Temple Training, and Falling Avalanche to add Lightsaber skill rank + Knowledge (Lore) skill rank + Brawn rank to Damage. It does require 3 different specs and costs 2 Strain and a Destiny point each time you use it, but Cortosis won't stop that kind of brokenness.
Edited by HappyDaze15 hours ago, HappyDaze said:You could argue that the hilt can be used as an improvised melee weapon and therefore allows the use of Parry. You could, but shouldn't. ?
Eh, I might allow that in the case of larger hilt types, though I'd probably exchange it for removing the sunder immunity if you attempt such a thing.