1 hour ago, LordFajubi said:

Guy up top was talking about double blanking in his test rolls.

It's kind of been cleared up, but yeah.

Just like any reroll can reroll into a blank and feel worthless (can't be rerolled again, as per the usual), Heroism can reroll into a useless result. In the small-sample-experiment, one out of my five defensive triggers was a double-blank after Heroism. Checks out, roughly. At a 14% chance to trigger, we'd expect 1 out of 7 or so to blank out twice, so having 1 out of 5 do it isn't that unlikely.

Something to consider with Heroisim on 3 greens- it wont trigger often, but if it does, you are more likely to roll a natural evade or multiple focusable evades.

8 minutes ago, Rakaydos said:

Something to consider with Heroisim on 3 greens- it wont trigger often, but if it does, you are more likely to roll a natural evade or multiple focusable evades.  

And that's why this feels so good on an Awing. 2 dice primary....you blank. Feels bad. Reroll and maybe get something useful and get some damage from them.

3 dice defense? You blank out? That might be a dead A wing. Instead of PANIC! pick 'em up and chuck 'em again. There are very few talents or abilities that let you re-roll more than one defense dice. This lets you re-roll all three.

With the limited effectiveness of most talents released, this and composure may end up being the "VI" of 1.0 for EPT's.

5 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

OK. I just rolled out a bunch of 3-red, 2-green dice sets. Convert all focus results. Will Heroic trigger and add results before the defender suffers a grand total of 7 damage?

Out of 12 chains of rolls, 4 times I was able to add evades with Heroic, once whiffed on the Heroic reroll into a second double blank, and once blanked on attack into 2 hits. So Heroic triggers in half the "games" and is effective in 5/12.

Very small sample size. But so are X-Wing tournaments. If I flew a heroic ship in three 4-game tournaments, and had it trigger 6 times, with 4 times getting a defensive benefit, once gaining an offensive benefit, do I think that's worth it? It only helped in about half the games. That's probably not too great.

But here's what sticks in my craw. Finn just breaks it. Rey broke Finn in 1e, where he'd have been a cool and interesting upgrade in a lot of situations, but wasn't going to be worth nearly as many points on most ships. Ibtisam Finn? That'd have been neat. Is it worth the minimum 34 points? Oh **** no. Would it even be worth 30 points (shaving off the 3-points overpriced based on 1e/2e B-Wing prices, and the point from E/2)? I'm not sure. Might have been fun to try with like Advanced Sensors. But because of the massive strength of the Rey/Finn combination, Finn had to be priced up near Gunner levels. Maybe I'm underestimating how good a Finn Ghost was, but still. I think my general point of Finn being so incredibly good in some rare number of situations really necessitated a higher point cost on ships where he'd have been resonable.

Heroism at a normal point cost might be balanced with ships other than Finn Falcons. But Finn Falcon is going to gain such a huge defensive benefit from this it probably can't be sensibly priced for A-Wings and X-Wings.

Bah. I just want to know how much it costs.

This reminds me of a particular style of original trilogy tournament my FLGS had about a year ago. Only upgrades from the expansions containing original trilogy ships were legal. Lone Wolf? Outrider and Hound's Tooth. Predator? Only in TIE Defender and Ghost, so no go. Push the Limit was allowed, but without Autothrusters, the ships most able to take advantage of it were a lot weaker. It really kinda felt like there just weren't Elite upgrades worth using.

12 rolls is far too small of a sample size to determine odds from. Just because tournaments are also a small sample size doesn't mean that your small sample size has any more bearing on the likelihood of the end-result. That's some sort of weird version of the gambler's fallacy, where instead of believing your luck will inevitably change, you're assuming your luck will stay exactly the same.

On the bright side, since we're talking about dice, the odds are actually easy to determine.

Chance of rolling a blank on a single green die: 3/8 (there are 3 blank faces on the 8-sided green die). This isn't applicable to Heroic, but is the basic odds that you need to determine chances the rest of the way.

Chance of rolling all blanks on:

2 dice: 3/8 * 3/8 = 9/64 = ~14.06% chance.

3 dice: (3/8)^3 = 27/512 = ~5.27% chance.

4 dice (Range 3 defense!): (3/8)^4 = 81/4096 = ~1.98% chance.

Chances of triggering Heroic for an attack are even worse. There are only 2 blank faces on the red dice, so rather than a 3/8 chance per die of rolling a blank, it's 2/8 (or 1/4, if you prefer).

2 dice: 1/4 * 1/4 = 1/16 = 6.25%

3 dice: (1/4)^3 = 1/64 = ~1.56%

4 dice: (1/4)^4 = 1/256 = ~0.39%

5 dice (range 1 attack with 4 dice attack): (1/4)^5 = 1/1024 = ~0.098%

In other words, your run of 5 times in 24 rolls (I'm assuming that each "roll" was a set of 3 attack and 2 defense dice) was not a set of results you should use for future expectation of results. In such a small sample size, it's entirely conceivable that you could never trigger Heroic at all over entire games. Or even an entire tournament.

Finn on a 1 defense ship is the one situation where it would be reasonable, as the odds there are 1/4 (25%). Of course, that's depending on the cost of Finn and Heroic. If Finn's over 10 points in 2.0 and Heroic is similarly priced, I'd rather use those points on several other upgrades. Or another ship. And, of course, it requires that you are being shot at in your front-arc, as Finn only triggers in that situation in 2.0... if the attacker flanked you, the entire combo is useless. So probably even then, it won't be worth it.

In all honesty the ability to un-screw yourself 14% of the time sounds pretty good considering how catastrophic blanking out on defence is.

Points dependent of course.

1 hour ago, Freeptop said:

12 rolls is far too small of a sample size to determine odds from. Just because tournaments are also a small sample size doesn't mean that your small sample size has any more bearing on the likelihood of the end-result. That's some sort of weird version of the gambler's fallacy, where instead of believing your luck will inevitably change, you're assuming your luck will stay exactly the same.

On the bright side, since we're talking about dice, the odds are actually easy to determine.

Chance of rolling a blank on a single green die: 3/8 (there are 3 blank faces on the 8-sided green die). This isn't applicable to Heroic, but is the basic odds that you need to determine chances the rest of the way.

Chance of rolling all blanks on:

2 dice: 3/8 * 3/8 = 9/64 = ~14.06% chance.

3 dice: (3/8)^3 = 27/512 = ~5.27% chance.

4 dice (Range 3 defense!): (3/8)^4 = 81/4096 = ~1.98% chance.

Chances of triggering Heroic for an attack are even worse. There are only 2 blank faces on the red dice, so rather than a 3/8 chance per die of rolling a blank, it's 2/8 (or 1/4, if you prefer).

2 dice: 1/4 * 1/4 = 1/16 = 6.25%

3 dice: (1/4)^3 = 1/64 = ~1.56%

4 dice: (1/4)^4 = 1/256 = ~0.39%

5 dice (range 1 attack with 4 dice attack): (1/4)^5 = 1/1024 = ~0.098%

In other words, your run of 5 times in 24 rolls (I'm assuming that each "roll" was a set of 3 attack and 2 defense dice) was not a set of results you should use for future expectation of results. In such a small sample size, it's entirely conceivable that you could never trigger Heroic at all over entire games. Or even an entire tournament.

Finn on a 1 defense ship is the one situation where it would be reasonable, as the odds there are 1/4 (25%). Of course, that's depending on the cost of Finn and Heroic. If Finn's over 10 points in 2.0 and Heroic is similarly priced, I'd rather use those points on several other upgrades. Or another ship. And, of course, it requires that you are being shot at in your front-arc, as Finn only triggers in that situation in 2.0... if the attacker flanked you, the entire combo is useless. So probably even then, it won't be worth it.

So the main math I did already and posted before. Check page 4. I also added also a line for how many expected hits or evades Heroic adds, multiplying the average from the reroll with the chance of gettng the reroll in the first place, so that it could be compared to the expected evades or hits added by something like Elusive or Predator or Lone Wolf, since it's not enough to know what Heroic does, if you don't know what it's competitors do as well.

The second experiment--which I specifically said was wicked low sample size--wasn't 12 rolls, but 12 chains where I'd roll sets of 3 red and 2 green until red paint exceeded green paint by a total of 7. That is, the T-70 hit points, as though they were motionless with focus just shooting at each other until they died. I'd probably get about 7-10(? guessing... I didn't count) simulated attacks per chain of rolls, sometimes more, sometimes less. So maybe as many as 150-200 rolls, counting red and green separately. Again, I wouldn't say that's statistically valid, but that's not the only point.

So knowing this is a super low sample size, and not useful for statistics, why? Because this is such a low probability, low expected value, high variance upgrade, I wanted a bit of an experiential "how does it feel" thing. Does the 14% chance make a difference? Does the 1/64 chance of triggering it on an attack with three red dice feel like anything?

Why? Because I know I'm going to put this on a table, fly with it in casual games for a few weeks, and I just want a head start on "meh, it seemed ok on paper, but it never really felt like it made a difference" or the "you know, while it's rare, but not that rare, and it seems worth it." Stats clearly have a place. It's worthwhile to know, say, that Harpoon Missiles simply do more damage on the initial attack than Concussion in every situation except two: 1} Deadeye with two sources of focus modification but no rerolls 2} with a TL and a second source of rerolls but no focus modification. I know how many hits and evades Wired adds in a statistical sense (one half the value of a focus token per attack, 3/8ths of a focus token per defense), but I also know that, well, it never feels worth it. I'm certain if I fly Lieutenant Karsabi again before 2e, it'll be with Crack Shot instead of Wired.

Another example: Outmaneuver adds more damage to Wedge Antilles than Predator (and in many situations more than even Expertise) when attacking ships with at least 2 agility. But no one runs Outmaneuver on Wedge. How do folks know Predator is actually better? Because they've played the game of X-Wing.

Statistics and experience have to inform each other, and particularly with something so strange and high variance as this, getting a jump start on feeling out out seemed wise.

My chances of rolling four blanks if I'm going to lose the ship are 100%. Thus, 'Heroic' cannot come too soon.

However, something tells me it will be 'resistance only'.

2 minutes ago, Jehan Menasis said:

However, something tells me it will be 'resistance only'.

I thought that was confirmed already. I think it’s their “special” ability.

I created a small simulator for testing the valor of heroic using a very simular approach to what @theBitterFig did.

I created the following simulator: A 3 dice attack with focus against a 2 dice defense also with focus. A experiment would be the number of attacks that a t70 (7hp) could last before being destroyed. Every experiment was repeated 10.000 times.

The experiment showed that on average using heroic you will survive one additional attack. Same result if the defender doesn't have focus.

EX1 3atk (f), 2 def (f)

No heroic
Average number of turns: 6.901 std.desv : 2.15824
With heroic
Average number of turns:: 8.0165 std.desv: 2.396044

EX2 3atk (f), 2 def (naked)

No heroic
Average number of turns: 4.9318 std.desv : 1.3768619248130873
With heroic
Average number of turns: 5.9465 std.desv : 1.6663846344706856

Now the next experiment is to compare it with hull upgrade

16 hours ago, Jehan Menasis said:

My chances of rolling four blanks if I'm going to lose the ship are 100%. Thus, 'Heroic' cannot come too soon.

However, something tells me it will be 'resistance only'.

Already confirmed to be Resistance-only.

28 minutes ago, DerRitter said:

I created a small simulator for testing the valor of heroic using a very simular approach to what @theBitterFig did.

I created the following simulator: A 3 dice attack with focus against a 2 dice defense also with focus. A experiment would be the number of attacks that a t70 (7hp) could last before being destroyed. Every experiment was repeated 10.000 times.

The experiment showed that on average using heroic you will survive one additional attack. Same result if the defender doesn't have focus.

EX1 3atk (f), 2 def (f)

No heroic
Average number of turns: 6.901 std.desv : 2.15824
With heroic
Average number of turns:: 8.0165 std.desv: 2.396044

EX2 3atk (f), 2 def (naked)

No heroic
Average number of turns: 4.9318 std.desv : 1.3768619248130873
With heroic
Average number of turns: 5.9465 std.desv : 1.6663846344706856

Now the next experiment is to compare it with hull upgrade

Really nice work. I'm so rusty with my R/S+ that I probably couldn't put together a good sim for this these days.

Makes sense, with about 1 in 7 chance of it triggering, the 7 HP, and the expected evade value of two green dice being close to 1 evade.

//

Another thing that'd be interesting to test: 3 agility ships like an A-Wing. We don't know if they'll be 4 HP like Rebel A-Wings, or gain an extra HP up to 5 like how the T-70 and TIE/fo gained over T-65 and TIE/ln. If I had to guess, the fact that Heroic only has a 5.27% chance to trigger doesn't add up to a full HP. While the evades added is higher (expected # evades added is about the same, actually) when it does trigger, the chances of a proc are a lot smaller. A-Wing might not have as much time. Expected damage of a 3 red + focus against 3 green + focus without any other mods is 0.638, so expected attacks would be something like 7.8 to kill a 5-HP A-Wing. The probability of getting a 5.27% Heroic proc in 8 Bernoulli trials is around 35% (38.5% in 9 trials), while in 7 trials with a 14% chance, there's a 65% probability of at least one Heroic success. The lower HP total seems like it won't allow enough time Heroic successes to accrue before the ship dies.

I cannot believe how much time and effort you've all devoted to "Heroic". There is SO much cool stuff that jut dropped and that one card is eating away at all of you. We all fail rolls sometimes. That happens in dice games (I played Blood Bowl for a while - ONE failure and your turn is over).

Better stuff to discuss: T70 hardpoint - will we see a new cannon as this comes out? "Blaster cannon" is in the Wiki, after HLC, so maybe we get a new one. If so, it can't come out for one faction without coming out for the rest, so what other ships can we surmise might be coming next? New Scyk with a new Mangler? Discuss!

7 minutes ago, Bad Idea Comics said:

Better stuff to discuss: T70 hardpoint - will we see a new cannon as this comes out? "Blaster cannon" is in the Wiki, after HLC, so maybe we get a new one. If so, it can't come out for one faction without coming out for the rest, so what other ships can we surmise might be coming next? New Scyk with a new Mangler? Discuss!

I hope we see more cannons. My other ships are itching to try things not ion cannon. hlc is EH bullseye only makes me hesitant except on niche builds.

Dont care about them on the t70 though - I want them for Scyks, Bwings, and IG2000. Especially the scyks since there are no more light scyks.

I have to say that I love the change to HLC. Much more limited, sure. But at that cost, it is an easy toss in. Especially on the ships with more than one cannon slot. I will say, T-70s with Ion Cannons are... fascinating.

3 hours ago, Sithborg said:

I have to say that I love the change to HLC. Much more limited, sure. But at that cost, it is an easy toss in. Especially on the ships with more than one cannon slot. I will say, T-70s with Ion Cannons are... fascinating.

The whole notion of cannons on T-70s put my head in a bit of a spin, I don't even know where to start. Fascinating for sure.

I do like the HLC for sad reasons. Reminds me of the synced quad laser X Wing ability on Battlefront 2. It's kind of cool.... Line it up, let rip at max power and bang out. Can easily imagine just throwing it on for those odd occasions at that price.

4 hours ago, Bad Idea Comics said:

I cannot believe how much time and effort you've all devoted to "Heroic". There is SO much cool stuff that jut dropped and that one card is eating away at all of you. We all fail rolls sometimes. That happens in dice games (I played Blood Bowl for a while - ONE failure and your turn is over).

Better stuff to discuss: T70 hardpoint - will we see a new cannon as this comes out? "Blaster cannon" is in the Wiki, after HLC, so maybe we get a new one. If so, it can't come out for one faction without coming out for the rest, so what other ships can we surmise might be coming next? New Scyk with a new Mangler? Discuss!

Math can be fun for some folks, and Heroic is a fascinating problem. Don't like it? Just TL;DR the posts, but don't squick another's squee.

//

Meanwhile, I've tossed at least a few comments towards cannons. I think one of the big reasons folks haven't talked more about them is we don't know what the S-Foils say. On a T-65, some folks have already posited use of closed S-Foils with Torpedos. T-65 Closed only reduces primary-weapon attack values. However, torpedos are limited charge weapons, and Boost and Boost > Focus aren't necessarily the most conducive actions for firing them.

However, T-70 Closed S-Foils give at least the Barrel Roll action, and and maybe a linked BR > Focus (depending on how closely equivalent to the T-65 version they are). If this Closed doesn't reduce cannon attack dice, well, we're off to the races. Focus > BR plus Predator seems like the gold-standard for HLC use. At his high PS, Poe would probably be really potent at sniping large and medium base ships. Plus, Poe's ability doesn't require any particular Even HLC winds up being a lot worse in practice than on paper, Ion Cannon isn't much more expensive. Close the wings for extra positioning options, and perhaps still throw 3-red attacks. The excess goes to Ion rather than Damage, but that's not necessarily too much of a problem. Against some ships, getting more than a single hit is unlikely, and against many of those, getting an ion token too can be deadly.

Or not. Next to nothing is visible on the S-Foils, and I don't know if anyone has CSI'd it and put together some coherent guess. The interactions on the card might make this whole line of thinking wrong. I mean, if cannons will be wicked good on closed S-Foils T-70s, perhaps they'll specifically ding the cannon attacks on the S-Foils card to prevent it. Personally, I have a hard time going too deep on things when we don't know so much. Could there be a Blaster Cannon? Sure. I hope it's interesting, but I've got no clue what one of those might do. Heroic, on the other hand, is fully spoiled except for cost.

So far, I like it that none of the cannons are just normal attacks. So far only HLC allows for all the hits to actually count as hits and not ion or tractor or jam tokens, but it's also restricted to the bullseye arc. I feel like that's a good trade-off. Mangler often irked me in 1e, I hated paying 4 points for it on a ship which already had a 3-die primary. Crits were effective on Bossk and Ten Nunb, though, so it was probably warranted. I'm not necessarily opposed to a vanilla sort of cannon in 2e, but for the time being I love that they're all a little spicy.

As to ideas for the future, a cannon I always thought would be cool would be one which dealt a single critical damage if it hit, but cancelled all further results. I don't know how I'd word it in 2e off the top of my head. Another idea I'd love to see in cannons? Ones which require charges to use, but automatically recharge. Spend 3 charges to attack, so you'll only get it once every 3 turns. Maybe those are the same thing. 4-dice cannon, only ever does a single critical damage regardless of how many results you get, can only be fired every 3rd turn. Probably too strong.

//

One more thing about Poe. I like that he doesn't get anything in particular out of linked actions. He'd be stressed after the linked action, so he'd be unable to use his pilot ability. That's entirely fair: he still has two actions with nearly-unprecedented flexibility, and doesn't need to be able to link into a 3rd action.

On 8/3/2018 at 6:31 PM, theBitterFig said:

So the main math I did already and posted before. Check page 4. I also added also a line for how many expected hits or evades Heroic adds, multiplying the average from the reroll with the chance of gettng the reroll in the first place, so that it could be compared to the expected evades or hits added by something like Elusive or Predator or Lone Wolf, since it's not enough to know what Heroic does, if you don't know what it's competitors do as well.

The second experiment--which I specifically said was wicked low sample size--wasn't 12 rolls, but 12 chains where I'd roll sets of 3 red and 2 green until red paint exceeded green paint by a total of 7. That is, the T-70 hit points, as though they were motionless with focus just shooting at each other until they died. I'd probably get about 7-10(? guessing... I didn't count) simulated attacks per chain of rolls, sometimes more, sometimes less. So maybe as many as 150-200 rolls, counting red and green separately. Again, I wouldn't say that's statistically valid, but that's not the only point.

So knowing this is a super low sample size, and not useful for statistics, why? Because this is such a low probability, low expected value, high variance upgrade, I wanted a bit of an experiential "how does it feel" thing. Does the 14% chance make a difference? Does the 1/64 chance of triggering it on an attack with three red dice feel like anything?

Why? Because I know I'm going to put this on a table, fly with it in casual games for a few weeks, and I just want a head start on "meh, it seemed ok on paper, but it never really felt like it made a difference" or the "you know, while it's rare, but not that rare, and it seems worth it." Stats clearly have a place. It's worthwhile to know, say, that Harpoon Missiles simply do more damage on the initial attack than Concussion in every situation except two: 1} Deadeye with two sources of focus modification but no rerolls 2} with a TL and a second source of rerolls but no focus modification. I know how many hits and evades Wired adds in a statistical sense (one half the value of a focus token per attack, 3/8ths of a focus token per defense), but I also know that, well, it never feels worth it. I'm certain if I fly Lieutenant Karsabi again before 2e, it'll be with Crack Shot instead of Wired.

Another example: Outmaneuver adds more damage to Wedge Antilles than Predator (and in many situations more than even Expertise) when attacking ships with at least 2 agility. But no one runs Outmaneuver on Wedge. How do folks know Predator is actually better? Because they've played the game of X-Wing.

Statistics and experience have to inform each other, and particularly with something so strange and high variance as this, getting a jump start on feeling out out seemed wise.

My apologies for misunderstanding what the "chain" was, and for missing the earlier post - when these threads get to several pages long, and I've been reading them off and on over a couple days, it's easy to lose track of things like that.

I will say that one has to be very careful with "statistics and experience have to inform each other", because confirmation bias is a very real thing. With dice, the number of variables are so small, and there are no unknown factors, so the odds from the math are quite accurate (this is different from, say, sports, where the number of variables are high with several being currently impossible to model such that many things are effectively random from a statistical perspective). Knowing how low the chances are can prevent one from taking a small sample size and saying "this feels reasonable", then suddenly getting very different results the next time.

Your example of Predator vs Outmaneuver is a case of additional variables not being modeled in simple statistics: what needs to happen for Outmaneuver to trigger. Predator always triggers, while Outmaneuver is a conditional trigger. Proper statistical modeling would attempt take that into account, but a simple look at dice rolls won't show that. Determining whether one player catches another in arc is something that is going to depend on respective player skills, ship maneuverability, and how the game plays out, so that's a fair number of variables that need to accounted for to determine expected outcomes. If one wanted to properly model that, one might take a statistical survey of how often an attacker is able to get the defender in their front-arc while being outside the front-arc of the defender vs times they are within the defender's front-arc, then apply that percentage chance to the expected damage output from when Outmaneuver triggers. I'm willing to bet a proper statistical analysis of Outmaneuver vs Predator that took into account the chance of them triggering would, in fact, show that Predator is the superior choice.

Heroic is not a comparable case to Outmaneuver, because the only conditional for it is the result from rolling the dice. Indeed, the odds I was showing were only showing the chances of it triggering at all - not even how it would impact the final result of the attack.

23 hours ago, Bad Idea Comics said:

Better stuff to discuss: T70 hardpoint - will we see a new cannon as this comes out? "Blaster cannon" is in the Wiki, after HLC, so maybe we get a new one. If so, it can't come out for one faction without coming out for the rest, so what other ships can we surmise might be coming next? New Scyk with a new Mangler? Discuss!

I too hope they release a new canon. Eventually they'll have to release a generic 3-attack canon like the old Mangler. Some sort of range 1 autoblaster canon would be good. Except NOT with unblockable damage. Hopefully it will have a new mechanic. I think flechette canon could be brought back. It's design was always okay because it cannot double stress a ship. And it would work like the new ion canon. 1st hit does damage, if more hits get through, the defender gets 1 stress if it isn't stressed already.

If Resistance kit has a new canon, how will the other factions get that upgrade card? It will be real test of the potential 'card packs' we have heard about. Someone is going to start printing high quality replicas if 'card packs' don't work out.

I'm sad to see the conversion kit does not convert A-wings to resistance A-wings. The models look the same to me, just with different paint schemes. (I'm sure it's a new sculpt. But I don't care, looks the same.) Resistance conversion is an even worse value for me at least. To convert my falcon and 2x T-70's it will cost $10 per ship. X-wing 2.0 is great, but the actual transition is bringing many painful moments.

37 minutes ago, Dengar5 said:

I too hope they release a new canon. Eventually they'll have to release a generic 3-attack canon like the old Mangler. Some sort of range 1 autoblaster canon would be good. Except NOT with unblockable damage. Hopefully it will have a new mechanic. I think flechette canon could be brought back. It's design was always okay because it cannot double stress a ship. And it would work like the new ion canon. 1st hit does damage, if more hits get through, the defender gets 1 stress if it isn't stressed already.

If Resistance kit has a new canon, how will the other factions get that upgrade card? It will be real test of the potential 'card packs' we have heard about. Someone is going to start printing high quality replicas if 'card packs' don't work out.

I'm sad to see the conversion kit does not convert A-wings to resistance A-wings. The models look the same to me, just with different paint schemes. (I'm sure it's a new sculpt. But I don't care, looks the same.) Resistance conversion is an even worse value for me at least. To convert my falcon and 2x T-70's it will cost $10 per ship. X-wing 2.0 is great, but the actual transition is bringing many painful moments.

I feel you, resistance and fo conversions would be a total waste of money for me. If I get those factions at all, not likely with the add of cis/rep, I’m quite content getting a piece here piece there but if anything will be dropped it’s those 2.

3 hours ago, Dengar5 said:

I too hope they release a new canon. Eventually they'll have to release a generic 3-attack canon like the old Mangler. Some sort of range 1 autoblaster canon would be good. Except NOT with unblockable damage. Hopefully it will have a new mechanic. I think flechette canon could be brought back. It's design was always okay because it cannot double stress a ship. And it would work like the new ion canon. 1st hit does damage, if more hits get through, the defender gets 1 stress if it isn't stressed already.

If Resistance kit has a new canon, how will the other factions get that upgrade card? It will be real test of the potential 'card packs' we have heard about. Someone is going to start printing high quality replicas if 'card packs' don't work out.

I'm sad to see the conversion kit does not convert A-wings to resistance A-wings. The models look the same to me, just with different paint schemes. (I'm sure it's a new sculpt. But I don't care, looks the same.) Resistance conversion is an even worse value for me at least. To convert my falcon and 2x T-70's it will cost $10 per ship. X-wing 2.0 is great, but the actual transition is bringing many painful moments.

Well the follow-up question to "are we getting a new cannon" is "what ships in Wave 2 will come out that also have cannon slots"? They're using the same model as Legion, where each new Wave will provide all the new upgrades, so you can collect just a single faction. This means a new cannon will HAVE to come with ships from every faction. That goes the same for any new upgrade, as long as the faction can use that type of upgrade - so Astromechs would only be required for Rebs, Scum, and Resistance, for example.

After some more thought, it makes sense or Wave 2 to include the B-Wing, Defender, and maybe Scyk, or possibly IG-88, but unlikely.