Oathsworn Cavalry [34] 2x2
Raven Tabards [2]
Moment of Inspiration [5]
Total Unit Cost: 41

Heavy Crossbowmen [27] 3x1
Rank Discipline [4]
Total Unit Cost: 31

Lord Hawthorne [34] 1x1
Shield of Margath [6]
Might of Daqan [4]
Total Unit Cost: 44

Outland Scouts [32] 2x2
Kari Wraithstalker [18]
Total Unit Cost: 50

Rune Golems [28] 2x1
Wind Rune [6]
Total Unit Cost: 34

I have built this list to face Uthuk. The idea is to rush the rushers. ?

I would transform the cavalry in a 4x1 and try to use the 4 turned charge (that it will be a 3 turned charge) and see if I can catch Ravos with it.

The scouts would be a 1x4 and I will look for surges, as someone suggested in the Scout thread. (Sorry I can't remember the name).

Do you have any ideas or suggestions?

Pray you don't get stuck with larger terrain. Pray you can get attacks in before losing trays in your single deep units to lose threat.

On ‎7‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 5:49 AM, Athelin said:

Do you have any ideas or suggestions?

Surrender to my demon minions.

Daqan are best suited to fight alll of Uthuk except Ravos. In short, Uthuk have only Kethra (sort of) and Ravos for mortal strikes.

Might of Margath Hawthorne is awful to face as Uthuk. We have to usually dedicate the largest unit we have to killing him or he will punch far above his weight.

Im not sure on the scouts being reformed to a 1x4.

4x1 Oathsworn don’t worry my Uthuk. Basically, I’ll play in and around terrain unless objectives force me out.

3tray Xbows are just good.

9 hours ago, Church14 said:

Im not sure on the scouts being reformed to a 1x4.

I'm not positive about them either but I want to try it out ?

9 hours ago, Church14 said:

4 x1 Oathsworn don’t worry my Uthuk. Basically, I’ll play in and around terrain unless objectives force me out.

I can do the same while I shoot with xbows.

11 minutes ago, Athelin said:

I'm not positive about them either but I want to try it out ?

I can do the same while I shoot with xbows.

Crossbows are super effective around something like a Rock/Spikes. If they are near terrain that isn’t capacity 0, Uthuk should be able to catch them quickly. Especially Rippers.

But, you are right that you can try to pick my army apart if I am trying to be clever and mucking with terrain.

Interesting but what happens in a tournament where you are expected to win four to five matches and you get drawn against the other two factions and/or a mirror match?

Or when you have to play on Unprepared with Volatile Runes?

What are your plans for those occurrences?

12 hours ago, Church14 said:

Daqan are best suited to fight alll of Uthuk except Ravos. In short, Uthuk have only Kethra (sort of) and Ravos for mortal strikes.

Just curious... why the "sort of". I'm interested in where the sentiment that only the only armor buster in the uthuk arsenal is Ravos comes from. This perspective seems... pervasive.

Kethra has Mortal on the dial. Every other unit that gets free mortals is generally considered good against armor (DKs, Maro, Aliana). She also gets direct wounds in an AOE with her skill. I realize a lot of people haven't seen her in action, but it seems intuitive to me. She is very good at busting armor. She's actually probably the second best unit in the game for it (behind Ravos of course). Is it just the comparison with Ravos? Certainly he can chew through something with armor faster than Kethra can, but he has to be on top of it. Kethra doesn't even need to be in attack range...

3 hours ago, Viktus106 said:

Interesting but what happens in a tournament where you are expected to win four to five matches and you get drawn against the other two factions and/or a mirror match?

Or when you have to play on Unprepared with Volatile Runes?

What are your plans for those occurrences?

I posted this list as an Anti-Uthuk list. I didnt mean it to be a tournament list.

22 minutes ago, QuickWhit said:

Just curious... why the "sort of". I'm interested in where the sentiment that only the only armor buster in the uthuk arsenal is Ravos comes from. This perspective seems... pervasive.

Kethra has Mortal on the dial. Every other unit that gets free mortals is generally considered good against armor (DKs, Maro, Aliana). She also gets direct wounds in an AOE with her skill. I realize a lot of people haven't seen her in action, but it seems intuitive to me. She is very good at busting armor. She's actually probably the second best unit in the game for it (behind Ravos of course). Is it just the comparison with Ravos? Certainly he can chew through something with armor faster than Kethra can, but he has to be on top of it. Kethra doesn't even need to be in attack range...

Right now, on my end it may be lack of playtime with her. My general impression:

Skill: If she uses it every turn (not likely), you average 6 wounds to your units and 6*AverageUnitsNearby sounds to your opponents. Given that you probably trigger it 5-6 times a game, those go down to 4 and 4*AverageUnitsNearby. Not inconsiderable, but nothing close to Ravos. The downside to spamming her skill is that you are unable to rotate and skill. Given how freewheeling and ranging my Uthuk fights are, she will quickly not have a target in range for her ranged attack (but the skill goes off). So my big concern is that spamming the skill to get the most limits her. I have a suspicion that I’ll only be triggering it 3-4 times at most in any game. That gets it down to around 3*AverageUnitsNearby wounds inflicted.

Skill meets attacking: Using the skill strips the mortal strike off my attacks. I’m trading a low guaranteed output for a potential big output. So mentioning both her skill and mortal modifier as armor busting comes with a caveat of one or the other, but never both. This isn’t to say that flexibility isn’t powerful. It absolutely is.

Percieved threat: oh heck yeah. The percieved (and real) threat she poses to any melee hero or armored unit that want to get close to any of your units is fantastic. The amount of second guessing and forcing wounded units to break off it will cause should be very helpful.

She comes off to me as a force multiplier where Ravos is force itself. Ravos will take a small (Small is debatable here) chunk of the map and cause carnage nearly every time. Especially to armored targets. Kethra looks at the table and says “where am I needed” and applies some force around her and some force where it’s needed.

1 hour ago, QuickWhit said:

Kethra has Mortal on the dial. Every other unit that gets free mortals is generally considered good against armor (DKs, Maro, Aliana). She also gets direct wounds in an AOE with her skill.

I just want to add that Mortal Strike on the modifier of a ranged unit is superior than on a melee unit. Melee units will need to charge first, and then use their modifier the following round. Aliana doesn't mind so much, with a melee attack at initiative 3, but man, those Death Knights can get in trouble if they are facing an armored unit with a low-initiative melee, or if the opponent's initiative-4 unit is going first as player 1 the round after the charge. In this way, Kethra is definitely among the top armor busters.

3 hours ago, Church14 said:

Right now, on my end it may be lack of playtime with her. My general impression:

Skill: If she uses it every turn (not likely), you average 6 wounds to your units and 6*AverageUnitsNearby sounds to your opponents. Given that you probably trigger it 5-6 times a game, those go down to 4 and 4*AverageUnitsNearby. Not inconsiderable, but nothing close to Ravos. The downside to spamming her skill is that you are unable to rotate and skill. Given how freewheeling and ranging my Uthuk fights are, she will quickly not have a target in range for her ranged attack (but the skill goes off). So my big concern is that spamming the skill to get the most limits her. I have a suspicion that I’ll only be triggering it 3-4 times at most in any game. That gets it down to around 3*AverageUnitsNearby wounds inflicted.

 Skill meets attacking: Using the skill strips the mortal strike off my attacks. I’m trading a low guaranteed output for a potential big output. So mentioning both her skill and mortal modifier as armor busting comes with a caveat of one or the other, but never both. This isn’t to say that flexibility isn’t powerful. It absolutely is.

Yeah, there is that sometimes tough choice of skill or attack. Often it is obvious though. Some situations I've seen:

You are ranged attacking an armored target (usually a hero or blocker)- You pretty much always dial in the mortal here. It means she is going to do 3-4 effective damage with a mortal. Plus the dice it typically means 7-8 damage at ranged which is very good for her cost. If you get lucky and catch a double hit or mortal on one of the dice, you are now looking at 9 - 10 damage, which will one shot blockers most of the time.

You are ranged attacking an almost dead unit - Often when this happens you can finish them with your dice and dial in a skill to deal some direct wounds to something somewhere else. Not many units get to split their damage this way. It's very good. If there isn't a good target (there usually is) you dial in a reform to prepare for next round (relocate or shoot a new target).

You are attacking a low armor unit - The mortal is often not going to be the best choice here. Again, there is usually an armored target that you can throw some rippers into that you can blow up with your skill. This allows the threshers to potentially finish off a carrion lancer or rune golem that they might not be able to kill otherwise. Again, splitting damage across two targets at range is really good.

You have no ranged targets - Move + skill is usually an option. Often the I8 shift allows you to control your distance from potential threats to Kethra while also choosing a good target to get into range of. The late initiative has the additional benefit of allowing you to get something into position for a huge explosion on the skill. Flesh Rippers with dead sprint are perfect for this. The ability to decide to turn on the first move gives you the ability to control how many targets they get into range of. Taking a wound on a hero and two blockers from a combo like this is brutal.

In the end, comparing any unit's armor busting capabilities to Ravos' will only result in the view that only Ravos is good at busting armor. The truth is he is just the best at it. Kethra is not only second best, she does it with more versatility.

3 hours ago, Church14 said:

She comes off to me as a force multiplier where Ravos is force itself. Ravos will take a small (Small is debatable here) chunk of the map and cause carnage nearly every time. Especially to armored targets. Kethra looks at the table and says “where am I needed” and applies some force around her and some force where it’s needed.

You are right on here. She is able to apply force across the whole board, while Ravos just brute forces his way through a chunk of it.

A unit I've found to be pretty generally useful and also a specific Ravos threat is a 3x2 of Spearmen with Lance Corporal and Raven-Pennon Bearer. One of Ravos's great advantages is being able to swiftly move upfield at 8, later than most enemies can threaten. The Spearmen can keep him honest, threatening a charge after he moves, then an attack at 2 with a hit. Even if that doesn't pop him, he's at a disadvantage in the attrition battle.

The tough part is deploying across from him with a 6 tray unit, but the initiatives line up nicely.

15 hours ago, Athelin said:

I posted this list as an Anti-Uthuk list. I didnt mean it to be a tournament list.

Oh I know, but I was simply implying that whilst you may have the "tools" in a vacuum, the deployment and objectives could skewer your plans somewhat.

Your Oathsworn being caught on a volatile rune dealing six damage could ruin your day sharpish. Whilst I appreciate you are teching towards a certain faction / list, it could all come a cropper when the deployment cards are dealt.

18 hours ago, Bhelliom said:

A unit I've found to be pretty generally useful and also a specific Ravos threat is a 3x2 of Spearmen with Lance Corporal and Raven-Pennon Bearer. One of Ravos's great advantages is being able to swiftly move upfield at 8, later than most enemies can threaten. The Spearmen can keep him honest, threatening a charge after he moves, then an attack at 2 with a hit. Even if that doesn't pop him, he's at a disadvantage in the attrition battle.

The tough part is deploying across from him with a 6 tray unit, but the initiatives line up nicely.

This. Ravos is super easy to handle if you have a plan (not necessarily a dedicated unit, but a PLAN) for him.

You all must learn Ravos can't be stopped, he will murder. You are not immune.

37 minutes ago, Curlycross said:

You all must learn Ravos can't be stopped, he will murder. You are not immune.

Even his allies aren't immune!

On ‎7‎/‎20‎/‎2018 at 1:58 PM, Budgernaut said:

Even his allies aren't immune!

Which just further punctuates my statement. Bow to the Ynfernael.

On ‎7‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 10:12 AM, Parakitor said:

I just want to add that Mortal Strike on the modifier of a ranged unit is superior than on a melee unit. Melee units will need to charge first, and then use their modifier the following round. Aliana doesn't mind so much, with a melee attack at initiative 3, but man, those Death Knights can get in trouble if they are facing an armored unit with a low-initiative melee, or if the opponent's initiative-4 unit is going first as player 1 the round after the charge. In this way, Kethra is definitely among the top armor busters.

DeathKnights ignore mortal strike while defending. Better use your skill, the mortal on your dial does nothing to them.

With scouts, I'd go with seasoned pathfinder and Rank discipline. Deploying after the 1st turn, anywhere on the table touching terrain is amazing; especially with Lord Hawthorn.

You could drop a 4 wide pathfinder unit in the backfield, and charge on turn 2 at initiative 3. Hitting a flank/rear, you're rolling Red/Blue/Blue, with a re-roll and Brutal 3. Really good for 40 points.

It also solves those problems with the enemy trying to dance at range to avoid your cav.