FFG told us that the conversion kits would have all the cards we need to fly our current ships. does this end at pilot cards? Afterburners looks like a card you will think about putting on any small ship. however after watching the unboxing videos on bell of lost souls it looks like we get one in the core set only. so if you want to 4 ships with it I guess your buying 3 more Fang fighters. NOT GOOD. maybe there were cards not spoiled in the unboxing's, tho I doubt it.

Has this card shown us that conversion kits alone are not enough? how much are we now going to have to pay to play the lists we want? are they lying to us? is the sky falling?

Conversion kits alone were never going to have all the upgrades, it's always been clear that the core set would have some content unique to it.

The only surprise is seeing Afterburners in an expac.

Is it in the scum kit with the protectorate pilots?

No issue for me either way. I'm definitely buying at least one Spinny Fang.

(Insert baby Vader spinning gif here)

25 minutes ago, X Wing Nut said:

FFG told us that the conversion kits would have all the cards we need to fly our current ships. does this end at pilot cards? Afterburners looks like a card you will think about putting on any small ship. however after watching the unboxing videos on bell of lost souls it looks like we get one in the core set only. so if you want to 4 ships with it I guess your buying 3 more Fang fighters. NOT GOOD. maybe there were cards not spoiled in the unboxing's, tho I doubt it.

I don't think FFG ever said the kits would have everything needed for current ships. That just couldn't be done.

What I believe they have said is that (a) the conversion kits would contain the new pilots from 2.0 wave 1, (b) that new pilots (not found in the kits) for future waves would be available without having to but the plastic ships (presumably via card-only packs), and (c) that you wouldn't have to buy a ship outside of your faction to get an upgrade card.

In light of the Fang Fighter preview, (c) above looks like a broken promise. The Rebel wave 1 ships have all had previews and none of them have Afterburners, so where is the Rebel player to get them from. Out of faction Fang Fighters is, sadly, the answer. It's like Autothrusters all over again.

2 minutes ago, papy72 said:

The Rebel wave 1 ships have all had previews and none of them have Afterburners, so where is the Rebel player to get them from.

They're in the Core Set. E: thinking about it, presumably they're in the Fang so that Scum players who don't want a core set can get them.

8 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

They're in the Core Set.

Right, you do get one in the Core Set. But what if I want more? As an Imperial player I have to buy Scum ships just for the upgrade card?

9 minutes ago, papy72 said:

I don't think FFG ever said the kits would have everything needed for current ships. That just couldn't be done.

in the interviews they said there would be no need to buy new ships well Afterburners looks like a need to me.

12 minutes ago, papy72 said:

It's like Autothrusters all over again.

that is the fear

Just now, papy72 said:

Right, you do get one in the Core Set. But what if I want more? As an Imperial player I have to buy Scum ships just for the upgrade card?

That or more core sets, yes. Or ebay I guess.

Where's the lie, exactly? You can get Afterburners in something for each faction. Imps and Rebels are in the Core Set, Scum is in the Fang.

3 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

Where's the lie, exactly? You can get Afterburners in something for each faction. Imps and Rebels are in the Core Set, Scum is in the Fang.

4 minutes ago, X Wing Nut said:

in the interviews they said there would be no need to buy new ships well Afterburners looks like a need to me.

4 minutes ago, X Wing Nut said:

Doesn't remotely look like a need to me.

If you really can't manage without what's in the Core Set, you could always buy another Core Set. More X Wings is more better, right?

You have options other than Fangs. Two of them. Three if you count third party sellers.

12 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

That or more core sets, yes. Or ebay I guess.

Where's the lie, exactly? You can get Afterburners in something for each faction. Imps and Rebels are in the Core Set, Scum is in the Fang.

The lie is that FFG is on record as saying that you wouldn't have to buy outside-of-faction stuff just for an upgrade card. They even said something like "no more autothrusters expansions".

So right now, to get a second Afterburners I have to buy a Fang Fighter. Because, you know, it would be stupid to buy a whole Core Set just for one card.

I have wondered from day one when these blanket statements were made just how they were going to implement them. What I thought was going to happen was that a non-faction upgrade card would need to be included in one mini for each faction in each wave. That, apparently, isn't happening.

Just now, papy72 said:

The lie is that FFG is on record as saying that you wouldn't have to buy outside-of-faction stuff just for an upgrade card. They even said something like "no more autothrusters expansions".

So right now, to get a second Afterburners I have to buy a Fang Fighter. Because, you know, it would be stupid to buy a whole Core Set just for one card.

I have wondered from day one when these blanket statements were made just how they were going to implement them. What I thought was going to have to happen would be that a non-faction specific upgrade card would need to be included in one mini for each faction in each wave. That, apparently, isn't happening.

You literally acknowledge in this very post that there is an in-faction source for Afterburners for each faction.

Where is the lie, again?

--

Don't get me wrong, I'm a little disappointed that ABs are in the Fang, because I'd understood that there wouldn't be upgrades in W1 expacs that weren't in the Conversion kit.

But just because you think something is stupid, doesn't mean it's not an option.

20 minutes ago, papy72 said:

Right, you do get one in the Core Set. But what if I want more? As an Imperial player I have to buy Scum ships just for the upgrade card?

I suspect it might well be in the interceptor and a-wing expansion, those being the most thematically appropriate boxes.

But yes, you've got a copy of it, in the core set. No-one promised you'd get 5 copies without buying other stuff (sadly).

It's the same as Valen Rudor - he doesn't appear to be in the conversion kit, just the core set (albeit that he's probably the least useful pilot!).

3 minutes ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I suspect it might well be in the interceptor and a-wing expansion, those being the most thematically appropriate boxes.

I'm hoping this is true. I've never wanted to buy Scum ships, and would rather not have to start now (and fourth, fifth and sixth Core Sets would be nice to avoid too).

I think some people really need to understand that FFG is not promising the ability to fly literally any legal combination of ships and upgrades you want using the conversion kits. That's never been a thing they've said. If people could stop misinterpreting things that have been said we'd have a lot fewer complaints around here. I'm a little disappointed that it looks like we'll only get 1 copy of Afterburners since it seems quite useful. What I don't feel is lied to.

6 minutes ago, Jike said:

I'm a little disappointed that it looks like we'll only get 1 copy of Afterburners since it seems quite useful.

I remember the faff I went through trying to get hold of copies of Wired after the force awakens core set came out. It's annoying, but without a buy-on-demand card service, it's always going to be an issue.

FFG has the choice between alienating their veteran player base, or not.

Second Edition is their way to make us pay for their design mistakes (and I am a firm defender of Second Edition, but that it what it is).
If they want to keep good will from the veterans towards them so that most can handwave this "Sorry, let's start all over, and you are going to pay for it", they will include several copies of the most popular upgrades in the cardboard-only sets for veterans to enjoy.

If they aren't interested on that good will at all, they will repeat the Autothrusters scenario without any remorse.

They are a company that aims for profit. If short-term profit or long-term profit, that their decision.
It's our obligation to spend our money to maximize our convenience as customers, remember.

1 hour ago, X Wing Nut said:

Has this card shown us that conversion kits alone are not enough? how much are we now going to have to pay to play the lists we want? are they lying to us? is the sky falling?

I have the feeling that Afterburners will come with the Interceptor pack for the Empire and the A-Wing pack for the Rebels. So, calm down and game on.

1 minute ago, T70 Driver said:

I have the feeling that Afterburners will come with the Interceptor pack for the Empire and the A-Wing pack for the Rebels. So, calm down and game on.

You little ninja. Yeah, it's a wonderful upgrade that will find its way into future waves. FFG's buisniness model HAS changed to eliminate good upgrade cards being EXCLUSIVE to some kits (autothrusters), but they still want you to buy the re-released ships when they come out. They have to give us reasons to do this.

1 hour ago, papy72 said:

So right now

We still don’t know how they’re planning to give us all the generic cards from future waves. We still don’t know lots of stuff. It’s more than a little early to be claiming that the sky is falling.

27 minutes ago, BDrafty said:

You little ninja. Yeah, it's a wonderful upgrade that will find its way into future waves. FFG's buisniness model HAS changed to eliminate good upgrade cards being EXCLUSIVE to some kits (autothrusters), but they still want you to buy the re-released ships when they come out. They have to give us reasons to do this.

If you compare to Legion (which is the closest match, being a recent product), then you find the expansion packs for both factions have identical non-unique/non-faction-specific upgrades in the 'equivalent' wave & role squad box; so both basic trooper boxes (stormtroopers and rebel troopers), for example, have the not-in-the-core-set 'impact grenades' and 'grappling hooks'.

I can anticipate - and more or less accept - being asked to buy all the imperial expansions if I want to play imperials and want copies of all the upgrades going. Given that the most afterburner-ey ship is the interceptor, that seems the likely place to put it.

That's not the same situation as the 'autothrusters upgrade pack with a free starviper', because (a) someone who is only interested in playing one faction still only has to buy expansions from that faction, and (b) if you really absolutely cannot wait to play a 5 x afterburners striker squad, the option is there, on release day - it just either requires you to buy 5 core sets* or proxy them or secure trades with other players

* bugger that for a game of plastic spaceships

Is afterburner in the fang expansion, or did they just use core content in their build suggestion?

Just now, Dwing said:

Is afterburner in the fang expansion, or did they just use core conyent in their build suggestion?

It's in the Fang preview image, so presumably it's in the expac - but I don't think we've actually seen one unboxed yet.

On 7/10/2018 at 9:17 AM, Azrapse said:

If they want to keep good will from the veterans towards them so that most can handwave this "Sorry, let's start all over, and you are going to pay for it", they will include several copies of the most popular upgrades in the cardboard-only sets for veterans to enjoy.

Based on the fact that Afterburners are not in the baggie of extras included in the scum conversion kit, I don't expect the cardboard-only expansions to come with more than the bare minimum. They will have any pilots and upgrades that were not in core or that faction's conversion kit. But if an upgrade appears in either the core set or the kit, it won't be in the cardboard-only pack.

I'll be happy if I'm proven wrong on this, but I don't expect to be.

Personally I'm disappointed that it looks like FFG is going to make it hard to obtain multiple copies of one of the best Mods. But I don't think the sky is falling because of it.

5 minutes ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I can anticipate - and more or less accept - being asked to buy all the imperial expansions if I want to play imperials and want copies of all the upgrades going. Given that the most afterburner-ey ship is the interceptor, that seems the likely place to put it.

I'm in a bit of a good position. My Imperial collection is pretty darn close to the contents of the Imp Kit and I was just about to start buying Rebel stuff when the 2.0 announcement came out. Well, I quashed that idea post-announcement. I can wait for the 2.0 Rebel stuff to be released to buy in. Hopefully the A-wing will have afterburners in it, and I can pick it up there.