In-character/game space Comedy is a powerful ingredient. To me it's like cayenne pepper and can either make the dish delicious, or render it nearly inedible. Anyone who has ever misread 1/8 teaspoon as 1/8 tablespoon knows this . My theory is that there is a threshold for comedy, and there is a tipping point where the game becomes less serious overall because of the comedic elements. I think the first Guardians of the Galaxy was an example of where the comedy was really a good element and figured prominently in the story. It also made me take the dramatic moments a bit less seriously than other movies, as the cadence of jokes lets you know that serious scenes will be offset soon enough by a joke. Deadpool is even more so, threading the line of being a story where the serious scenes are just there to contrast the comedy.

Fine and good. Episode IV has a lot of humor in it, especially on the Death Star, where it could have been a very serious and dramatic and less fun.

But I also think that it is easy to go over the line with comedy and silliness to the point where the gravity of the serious side of things is being damaged. The Voice Mail joke by Poe as the Resistance faces destruction was a one two punch. The seriousness of the situation was diminished, and also Hux was further lampooned into being battle-droid-incompetent.

Do you find that in-character humor or slapstick situations tend to have the ability to act as a counter-force to serious drama? Do you care about the injection of a lot of humor? What about in serious scenes? If so, how do you manage the ratio of humor in the game as the GM?

I’m a believer in comics writer/novelist Peter David’s philosophy on the matter: once you’ve laughed with the characters, their drama and peril means more to you and carries a greater impact.

In my experience there are two sides to humor in the game session. One would be NPCs that are humorous, through voice, personality or action and/or PCs that are the same. The second is OOC comments or extended back and forth riffing on what is happening in the scene.

If you are aiming to have a more dramatic story you can and should control the first type of comedic elements. Allow them rarely, as true relief from more intense dramatic moments. A looser, less serious plot should allow more siliness from the PCs and involve more built-in humor in the NPCs.

In either case, however, I try to tamp down the second type of comedic break in the game session. It can be distracting and take players (and me) out of the story and interupt the narrative for too long with OCC conversation. If the back and forth starts to divert from the game I'll essentially call a break and suggest people grab a drink or snack and then have a definite restart of the session.

On 6/24/2018 at 2:33 PM, Archlyte said:

Do you find that in-character humor or slapstick situations tend to have the ability to act as a counter-force to serious drama? Do you care about the injection of a lot of humor? What about in serious scenes? If so, how do you manage the ratio of humor in the game as the GM?

For my players and I, getting together to game amongst our busy schedules is a treat. For many of us, it will be the only time we see each other for another week or more. When the jokes, puns, and giggles start flying, I go with it. Because it's fun. All of that comes naturally, and I don't do anything to curb it or mitigate it.

The only time it's distracting for me is when they don't take "srs face" NPC's seriously. They tend to get on the nerves of NPC's who are humorless, so I just lean into it and go full camp with those NPC's usually. They do take things deadly serious when something is a threat to a beloved NPC, or the world at large. To my table's credit, they know when the stakes have been raised and that it is time to take off the jester's cap and put on the superhero mask.

Also, relevant to the topic:

I was with ya til the video. ?

31 minutes ago, Nytwyng said:

I was with ya til the video. ?

I think it's worth the watch. It addresses things that broke immersion for me. I think modern movies like Star Wars and Marvel films are sabotaging real moments of emotional vulnerability with jokes to break that tension. Guardians of the Galaxy 2 was such a difficult watch for me for just this reason: if they had given any of the emotional/dramatic scenes room and time to breathe (instead of interrupting them/cutting them short with bad jokes and insults), I would have been twice as invested in the story and characters.

I also think his can apply at the table. Humor is often used to release tension or interrupt moments of vulnerability. I don't fault my players if they don't feel comfortable being vulnerable at the table, but I try to empower them with tools other than humor to cope with that discomfort and tension. The best tool I've found that I can provide them with is strong relationships with NPC's. I have found that my particular players will take a situation far more seriously when it involves a beloved NPC. Even though the NPC's are not real people, they tend to get attached to them and their causes. There is still plenty of humor at the table, but that is all dropped when one of their favorite NPC's is threatened.

On 6/24/2018 at 9:33 PM, Archlyte said:

But I also think that it is easy to go over the line with comedy and silliness to the point where the gravity of the serious side of things is being damaged. The Voice Mail joke by Poe as the Resistance faces destruction was a one two punch. The seriousness of the situation was diminished, and also Hux was further lampooned into being battle-droid-incompetent.

Do you find that in-character humor or slapstick situations tend to have the ability to act as a counter-force to serious drama? Do you care about the injection of a lot of humor? What about in serious scenes? If so, how do you manage the ratio of humor in the game as the GM?

I’d made myself go see TLJ with an open mind, no expectations about it being good nor bad. “General Hugs” made me think it was going to be much worse than any expectation I could have had.

As far as RPGing is concerned, there are scenes that are meant to affect the characters emotionally or to show off that aspect of their personality and there are others where that isn’t really the purpose. Humour is fine for the latter - in fact, for movies that are space operas (and RPGs based on them) and that were targeted at 14-year olds primarily plenty of levity is practically required. The goal is finding the right balance between the two types of scenes. That balance depends heavily on the group and what kind of game they want, but in my experience that usually works out well enough if the players really do want to roleplay. It might take a few sessions, but I’ve seen very few groups that couldn’t manage to create a feel that suited them. The few other times were all caused by one or two players having expectations that were too different from the others’ and not being willing or able to compromise - and I don’t think that’s something the GM can fix.

I would second Nameless Ronin's point: what kind of scene is it? Also, what kind of NPC is it? Some scenes and characters can benefit from, or be enhanced by, a little humor. However, in some cases, it is beneath the gravitas and dignity of the moment or role to crack-wise and make fun. There is also a question of "what kind of humor is it?" Are we talking madcap or farsical? Or just a quip, noted irony, or the well-formed pun? referenced between serious moments and not in the middle of them? A running gag that is only mentioned in low-tension moments.

I thought the game of telephone Poe played with Hux in the opening of TLJ, while amusing and executed well by the actors, was not appropriate to the moment and served to diminish a primary antagonist. I also felt Vader's pun in Rogue One fell flat and did not do Vader a service. Timing and touch, and respect for the sensibility of scene and subject are key.s Are your players capable of being subtle and sophisticated, or is it madcap and campy? The former is less "intrusive" than the latter.

Our game revolves around three jedi survivors eight years after Order 66 in an AU where Padme survived and shot-calling intelligence ops for Bail Organa's nascent rebel network. She's been known to make wry quips that lampshade tropes, etc, and we have a running gag in which she travels with a ton of luggage that leaves rebel flight-deck crews grumbling because she's a clothes horse. Its never brought up in serious moments, but as an example, when they were undercover at a casino the train of beleaguered porters was noticed, and even used as a sort of "shell game," distraction by the players.

On 6/24/2018 at 9:33 PM, Archlyte said:

Hux was further lampooned into being battle-droid-incompetent.

Why is that bad? He's a Nazi cosplayer kept around for his attitude, not his skill. That's all explicitly in the movies.

1 hour ago, Stan Fresh said:

Why is that bad? He's a Nazi cosplayer kept around for his attitude, not his skill. That's all explicitly in the movies.

That would be exactly why it’s bad.

8 minutes ago, nameless ronin said:

That would be exactly why it’s bad.

You've not given any reason.

1 hour ago, Stan Fresh said:

You've not given any reason.

A nazi cosplayer being kept around for his attitude, despite lack of skill, in the position of general answering only to the Supreme Leader is bad. It makes no sense. The whole portrayal of the First Order seems inconsistent to me, particularly compared to the Empire, but Hux is beyond the pale.

If your heroes go up against the all powerful enemy without that enemy being stupid, overconfident, arrogant or other failure of character, they lose.

1 hour ago, nameless ronin said:

A nazi cosplayer being kept around for his attitude, despite lack of skill, in the position of general answering only to the Supreme Leader is bad. It makes no sense. The whole portrayal of the First Order seems inconsistent to me, particularly compared to the Empire, but Hux is beyond the pale.

Look at real history. Military leaders are rarely appointed on merit in dictatorships. Hux, as a character, makes a lot of sense.

I think that Archlyte, Vondy and Ronin nailed it. The telephone scene, cements Hux' (and by extension the First Order's) primary characteristic as incompetence. While it may be "realistic" for a leader of dubious caliber to be promoted for reasons other than merit, it makes hard to believe the FO as a serious threat to the heroes, and the entire sequel trilogy has suffered for it. Heroes are only as good as their villains and all that.

It's the equivalent if George opened Episode 4 with the firefight on Tantive IV, had Vader walk through the door, and immediately trip over his cloak. Followed quickly by Leia interrupting him in his interrogation to tell him "One of your indicator lights is out", then flicking his nose with her finger when he looked down. No matter what "canon" says about his brilliant tactical mind, ruthlessness, or fearsome demeanor, it would destroy the image of Vader and the Empire as a serious threat.

As a new GM, I haven't started stretching my comic legs yet in session. Though I have had some issues with my player not taking my NPC Gand hunter seriously because his mode of speech reminds them of "Zathras" from Babylon 5 (a mostly comic relief character, for those who don't know). Eventually I'd like to incorporate humor as appropriate, but rest assured, I will not introduce my BBEG by having him say something dark and serious/do something terrible, followed directly with a spacebird pooping on his armor.

I know everyone's table is different, but I'd love more examples of how people successfully incorporated humor into their campaigns.

3 hours ago, Stan Fresh said:

Look at real history. Military leaders are rarely appointed on merit in dictatorships. Hux, as a character, makes a lot of sense.

This is the guy supposedly competing for 2nd in command with Kylo Ren in TFA. He’s still ready to make a grab for the nr 1 seat during TLJ until Kylo sets him straight. He’s the First Order’s primary general.

And he’s also an absolute nincompoop.

55 minutes ago, nameless ronin said:

This is the guy supposedly competing for 2nd in command with Kylo Ren in TFA. He’s still ready to make a grab for the nr 1 seat during TLJ until Kylo sets him straight. He’s the First Order’s primary general.

And he’s also an absolute nincompoop.

North Korea, the US, and Nazi Germany show that nincompoops can do untold damage when they make it to positions of political or military authority. I don't know why you're fighting me on this. You see those guys all over the world throughout history and in the present day.

1 hour ago, Stan Fresh said:

North Korea, the US, and Nazi Germany show that nincompoops can do untold damage when they make it to positions of political or military authority. I don't know why you're fighting me on this. You see those guys all over the world throughout history and in the present day.

If its painful and not-funny to watch in the real world, why would it be otherwise on the big screen?

7 minutes ago, Vondy said:

If its painful and not-funny to watch in the real world, why would it be otherwise on the big screen?

The audiences I saw it with laughed a lot at the phone thing.

1 hour ago, Stan Fresh said:

North Korea, the US, and Nazi Germany show that nincompoops can do untold damage when they make it to positions of political or military authority. I don't know why you're fighting me on this. You see those guys all over the world throughout history and in the present day.

There’s not actually that many nincompoops to point out there that I can see, to be honest. They typically didn’t/don’t get to that position of authority by helping create a new empire either. Hux didn’t inherit his position, nor was he elected by popular vote. He got his position because Snoke wanted it. If that’s supposed to mean the Supreme Leader is incapable of seeing Hux’ flaws, that might make it even worse.

Just now, nameless ronin said:

If that’s supposed to mean the Supreme Leader is incapable of    seeing Hux’ flaws, that might make it even worse.

TLJ is very clear about Snoke being aware of Hux' limitations. A re-watch might be in order.

5 minutes ago, Stan Fresh said:

TLJ is very clear about Snoke being aware of Hux' limitations. A re-watch might be in order.

I doubt he was aware of the “general Hugs” level of ineptitude. And again, if he is that just makes it worse.

Hux is the son of the Moff that instituted the First Order's "raise 'em right - as stormtroopers!" plan, so it makes sense that he landed where he did. His behavior is what I'd expect from a human male raised to manchildhood. It's not in the movies but it is in canonical fiction, which in turn really enriches the stories portrayed on screen.

On 6/26/2018 at 7:47 AM, panpolyqueergeek said:

I think modern movies like Star Wars and Marvel films are sabotaging real moments of emotional vulnerability with jokes to break that tension.

I don't think this started recently, nor with the two franchises mentioned. I do agree it's an appeal to a lower common denominator to bring people to the precipice of an emotional epiphany only to yank it away, but it feels like it's a safety mechanism for some and those of us that were going to be affected still are. There's just no pleasing everyone and given the toxicity of this fanbase, I can see why some folks don't want to let the pendulum swing too far either way. But just imagine if they'd laughed off "I AM YOUR FATHER."

All that said, I didn't get lost in any humor. Star Wars has always been cheeky to me.

How the **** does a thread about comedy in game sessions devolve into yet another pissing match off the rails....gee lemmeee guess.......hmmmm. On the first page too, almost like it's a plan or something, or the only thing some people do here, huh, go figure.....