https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2018/6/20/restless-dead/

Yeah, we are gonna need to define "enemy has been destroyed".

I'm gonna guess they mean full unit destruction.

Unhallowed wind and terrifying heraldry on reanimates immediately springs to mind.

On 6/20/2018 at 5:27 PM, Tvayumat said:

Yeah, we are gonna need to define "enemy has been destroyed".

I'm gonna guess they mean full unit destruction.

To me it seems pretty clear, if during the course of the game one of the enemy units has been completely wiped out and removed from play, you can add panic to all future melee attacks.

Well, now that we know they don't have a unique that gives them rerolls, I am strongly considering the 2x2 formation. While you lose out on threat and maneuverability, you gain valuable rerolls and access to heraldry upgrades (which you could get at 3x1 via Host of Crows, but I don't always want to run Ardud Ix'Erebus). After all, I'll have 2 boxes of these guys, so I might as well run all four trays and see how they do.

7 minutes ago, Parakitor said:

Well, now that we know they don't have a unique that gives them rerolls, I am strongly considering the 2x2 formation. While you lose out on threat and maneuverability, you gain valuable rerolls and access to heraldry upgrades (which you could get at 3x1 via Host of Crows, but I don't always want to run Ardud Ix'Erebus). After all, I'll have 2 boxes of these guys, so I might as well run all four trays and see how they do.

Average damage of the 3x1 is still higher, so I think we'll mostly see 3x1's. 2x2 is much harder to take advantage of their movement ability, so we'll have to see if there's any sweet heraldry tech.

It just hit me how amazing these guys are for the current set of tournament objectives You guys probably already fully grasped this, but coming from X-wing, I'm still used to the kill game, rather than the objective game. Anyway, they give Waiqar a huge shot in the arm for claiming tokens. Their white skill allows them to use the objective tokens for Confluence of Magic, and the free reform means they don't even end up out of position long if they have to chase down a far away token. This is equally true for Supply Raid. And for Demoralize Their Forces, once again that free reform let's them set up flank charges like nobody's business. Hmm...I'll try the 2x2, but on second thought, two 2x1's may be the way to go, just for the sake of objectives. And of course, I'll try the 3x1 plenty as well, because that's just so solid (it will just make one of my trays sad to sit out and watch from the sidelines).

Tabletop Admiral updated

33 minutes ago, werdnaegni said:

Tabletop Admiral updated

The real hero.

1 hour ago, werdnaegni said:

Tabletop Admiral updated

You do Timmoran's work, good sir.

2 hours ago, Tvayumat said:

Yeah, we are gonna need to define "enemy has been destroyed".

I'm gonna guess they mean full unit destruction.

while I don't disagree that the wording is unclear (especially since I don't want to look through the rule books), we do have similar text on a the viscera goblet.

I assume we could use that card as a precedent for what "a destroyed enemy" means

I like that the unit doesn't have to be destroyed by the wraiths.

Curious, does the free reform trigger before the attack from a charge? Example, wraiths with metered march charge through a unit, stop on the back, reform, melee, or melee reform?

5 minutes ago, Jukey said:

I like that the unit doesn't have to be destroyed by the wraiths.

Curious, does the free reform trigger before the attack from a charge? Example, wraiths with metered march charge through a unit, stop on the back, reform, melee, or melee reform?

The timing is the same, so the controlling player decides which to resolve first.

So yes, you can reform and then attack after a charge.

Well, the Uthuk have a challenger for the kings of panic. They aren’t unseated, but they aren’t nearly so far ahead.

Some of this was mentioned already:

-Unhallowed Wind, Terrifying Heraldry, and Morale modifier == Reanimate can get automatic severity three morale test. If you have an Inspiration somehow, then you can do it two turns in a row.

-Unhallowed Wind, Faces of the Fallen, Morale modifier == Weaiths get (conditional) automatic severity three morale test

It doesn’t beat the efficiency of having Threshers and moral modifiers on everything but Berserkers, but it’s something worth trying.

Well the forces of bad are supposed to cause panic and fear... seems fitting that both the Uthuk and Waiqar deal in banes.

Daqan has Hawthorne for boons.... lots of boons.

On 6/20/2018 at 10:08 AM, werdnaegni said:

Tabletop Admiral updated

I just became a Patron. Better late than never, right? Thanks for an awesome army builder, with lightning fast updates.

Can't express how much I am equally disappointed and excited about these upgrades.

On the one hand, I was really hoping for something that would give wraiths damage consistency. I feel the 3x1 of wraiths is very good but too inconsistent damage-wise. Waiqar needs something that can be relied upon for big damage consistently. I thought something like a cheap unique upgrade for wraiths that gave damage for surges or rerolls would do the trick.

On the other hand, these upgrades are flavorful, useful, reasonably costed, and give Waiqar a reliable tech option that is not blight. I especially like the idea that the double attack has the potential to ramp up very quickly to a big morale test. The most common card in the morale deck is rising panic. If you catch that on the first swing the second swing can trigger a severity 3 test...

Excited to try these out...

So...

Is anyone going to mention that "Unhallowed Wind" makes a great euphemism for crop dusting the game table?

4 hours ago, Tvayumat said:

So...

Is anyone going to mention that "Unhallowed Wind" makes a great euphemism for crop dusting the game table?

My first thought when I read the name of that upgrade was, "Well that's an unfortunate name."

4 hours ago, QuickWhit said:

O n the one hand, I was really hoping for something that would give wraiths damage consistency. I feel the 3x1 of wraiths is very good but too inconsistent damage-wise.

I'm strongly suspecting that you're not going to see many 3x1 (or possibly 4x1) units that have extreme consistency, unless the unit is pricey, for basic balancing factors. Especially not through upgrades.

3 hours ago, Xelto said:

I'm strongly suspecting that you're not going to see many 3x1 (or possibly 4x1) units that have extreme consistency, unless the unit is pricey, for basic balancing factors. Especially not through upgrades.

Except xbowmen...

And technically the 2x1 of spined threshers.

41 minutes ago, QuickWhit said:

Except xbowmen...

And technically the 2x1 of spined threshers.

Shoot. He's right.

54 minutes ago, QuickWhit said:

4 hours ago, Xelto said:

I'm strongly suspecting that you're not going to see many 3x1 (or possibly 4x1) units that have extreme consistency, unless the unit is pricey, for basic balancing factors. Especially not through upgrades.

Except xbowmen...

I consider crossbowmen on the pricey side. They also don't come with the ability to flank easily that the wraiths have.

Quote

And technically the 2x1 of spined threshers.

You'll see reliable, hard-hitting 2x1s regularly, even ones with brutal.

To be fair, I could be shooting my mouth off about the 3x1s of the future. But I don't think you can have cheap, reliable heavy damage and keep game balance.

Just now, Xelto said:

Which cost more than wraiths, and don't come with a near-automatic flank.

You'll see reliable, hard-hitting 2x1s regularly, even ones with brutal.

You don't need an automatic flank when you can hit at ranged. Xbowmen are a very reliable heavy damage source for 34 points. I've both used them and had them used against me to great effect. In fact they are a great counter to wraiths because they are difficult to get to without them getting a shot off (if your opponent blocks well), and they will shred the fragile wraiths.

Certainly, there are reliable, hard-hitting 2x1s (a number of cav units with rank discipline come to mind), but only one with brutal, and thus threat 3. That one also has hit on the dial and a nearly free reroll, and a significant amount of health, making it very reliable.

Not sure what the 2x1s vs 3x1s argument is actually about... Sorry if my post gave the impression I actual care about the size of the unit as opposed the the cost to threat ratio. A high threat unit that hits reliably is what I wanted out of wraiths for waiqar, as they currently just don't have one. Instead I got a solid flanking and tech unit that sometimes whiffs and sometimes just smokes things. I'm not that sad about it... just a little disappointed. I don't have a reasonably priced high damage option like Daqan and Uthuk do (I don't think elves need one because they can get a lot of reliable damage from their archers and heroes). 2x1's of spined threshers and 3x1's of xbowmen are a cheap, hard hitting, reliable threat 3 units... and I'm a bit jealous...

Good points. I wonder if crossbows mean Daqan won't get a truly good blocker, like carrion lancers and Scions. Rune golems are decent, but not maneuverable enough to be truly good at it. Vitality tokens are gonna be a **** of a thing though!