6 minutes ago, Managarmr said:

It is the idea behind the Grand Inquisitor which I react to.

Of course is its immediate effect on the game not as strong as Luke Gunner.

I neither like Intelligence Agent either. Cassain Andor, though, still involves "guessing", or rather actual thinking and decisions, instead of just revealing, and is imho more aceptable.

Cassian is just as unplayably bad as in 1.0, since he didn’t change at all. Even if he was free, he would probably still not be worth wasting the Crew slot, not even in 2.0

Either you know what the opponent is going to do, and then you will not need to readjust your dial anyway since you knew it before dialing the first time too, or you have no clue, in which case you will very probably guess wrong anyway so now you know what’s going to happen but can’t do anything sbout it.

The cases where his effect would come handy are sadly so rare that the card might as well not exist...

2 hours ago, ficklegreendice said:

Neither being everywhere nor being costed so poorly that you never see play = balanced.

You can't balance bad ideas with point costs, you can only sweep them under the rug.

Something like the Inquisitor will be balanced because there is counter-play available regardless of his cost. Unlike a LOT of 1.0, even the odd action-independent modifiers of 2e all have counterplay or limited enough effect (forcus) to not screw people over. Except Luke.

It's good to talk about the Inquisitor crew in this light, though, because I feel he's exactly what a 2e upgrade should be about: a way to bend the inherent limits of the system but not without consequences that force both players to make pointed decisions. I feel just about every other force upgrade does this right, from Kanan now needing a fully-executed white maneuver, to Ezra basically being vet turret gunner OR a forcus, to Vader requiring range AND arc AND allowing an opponent to spend a green token to avoid his damage.

So at least there's a LOT of good in 2e, including Inqy imo. Just hope it's enough

I agree with your sentiments, but I am reserving full judgement on individual pieces until I see how they interact with the full 2.0 landscape.

In the end, I highly doubt it will be perfect-ish, but it will be healthier than 1.0 and it has a built in engine for rebalance.

I am just going to put my trust in the devs at this time and gleefully look over spoilers as they come.

How many crew carriers with reposition do we expect the Empire to get?

Can't put him on a Decimator and boost out of Arc anymore.

Where's he gonna ride? A Reaper?

What is the point of this actual topic? Wow, force users are strong. They are in all factions. Good. Thanks.

19 hours ago, ForceM said:

One thing i have seen for 2.0 is that a lot of upgrades and crew for all factions are extremely expensive compared to 1.0

I mean C-3PO for example was i believe spoiled at 12 points? Double the cost compared to 1.0, with arguably a weaker effect. He is not the only card where this seems to be true.

What is the intent behind this? Have more «naked» ships on the tabletop? Not have an ace meta?

Upgrades are more expensive because they are actually being costed closer to the value they give. Generics ships suck in 1e partially because they don't have access to undercosted upgrades. When they do have access, they can compete. A good example being Gunboats with LRS & linked battery.

C-3PO on a Falcon provides way more than 3 points of value. Latts Razzi on Asajji is even more broken. The drastically changing upgrade costs reveal how woefully broken 1e is. Based on preliminary costing for some of the aces, they will be fine. Dash, Corran, Wedge, Luke, Fenn Rau will all be competitive.

2 hours ago, Dengar5 said:

Upgrades are more expensive because they are actually being costed closer to the value they give. Generics ships suck in 1e partially because they don't have access to undercosted upgrades. When they do have access, they can compete. A good example being Gunboats with LRS & linked battery.

C-3PO on a Falcon provides way more than 3 points of value. Latts Razzi on Asajji is even more broken. The drastically changing upgrade costs reveal how woefully broken 1e is. Based on preliminary costing for some of the aces, they will be fine. Dash, Corran, Wedge, Luke, Fenn Rau will all be competitive.

The ships are probably costed fine, that’s not the point i was making.

There were of course some broken Upgrade combos on certain ships.

On the other hand overcosting every upgrade for that reason is something i don’t know how to feel about.

It makes for a board less overloaded with rules, and forces hard choices on what you want from your ships. Which is clearly intended also.

On the other hand a lot of fun plays and character gets lost, and finding the crazy combos while listbuilding is part of the fun i enjoy too.

So, mixed feelings about this.

On some cards, like C-3PO i find they have overshot the target by a pretty large margin however. 12 points are 6 old points. That’s more than 1.0 Krennic (okay they went crazy on him) or the price of a HLC. If now 3PO had his old rules, i would say the point cost doubling would be harsh, but maybe okay for 2.0. But combined with his new ruleset that makes him unreliable, the best thing about him might be that he gives the coordinate action thing. Combined with the cost, this makes for another card that will just not be seen unless they reduce cost after the first recosting round.

And that seems to happen to a lot of cards, not only 3PO. I just take him as an example for what’s happening. To say it more bluntly, they should not punish cards for the stale taste they leave in our mouth from first edition. Fix the rules of the broken stuff, but don’t make it unusably bad just because the name of the card invokes the hate of some players...

I think that it will be cutting quite some fun to see naked or semi-naked ships all the time. And i mean why make all these shiny new upgrades and put all the work in, if you actually don’t want to see them on the table.

On 6/16/2018 at 6:51 AM, Commander Kaine said:

Except it's an action and you can counter it with stress for example.

You can also use range control to deny it.

There is counter play. How do you counter Luke?

With Int 6 ie Han.

So as I said the meta is either going to go swarm or Int 6 or bust. You got Dash w/Luke in one corner, on the other corner Han Solo. Dash will try some obstacle jumping shenanigans and move. Han will have either seen it coming and had a dial out of arc (to at least drain a force token) then fixes turret on Dash, Luke will adjust the turret to face Han. Han Shoots first.

Turrets are not out, they just need Int 6 or Luke to be viable. Turrets that are at Int<6 are dead. To be honest I am starting to think they should have been 180 degree arcs instead of double quadrant arcs. Or at least go in 8 cardinal directions instead of 4.

how rebels and only rebels have 4 red dice primaries and nobody has 4+ greens and evades were nerfed. so much for agile ships RIP empire

On 6/16/2018 at 6:34 AM, Managarmr said:

So a lot of people here complain about

[stuff]

But...

...they haven't played the game yet? I know. That's all I see here any more.

On 6/16/2018 at 9:34 AM, Managarmr said:

So a lot of people here complain about

-Luke Gunner, enabling moving your turret with perfect knowledge of all positions. Probably balanced by cost, but still boring, and again a turret moving last.

-Fenn in the Sheathipede, still with Coordinate at Ini6 ....

-Dash, ignoring fundamentals of the game, like all obstacles, while having 4 dice. Altogether though, baring point costs as well, he might be weaker than 1.0.

Another culprit, which the forums have been really quiet about, is the Grand Inquisitor crew (Empire only, 1 crew clot):

"After an enemy ship at range 0-2 reveals its dial, you may spend 1 force to perform 1 white action on your action bar, treating that action as red. Force: 1+"

That is the same kind of BS. With perfect knowledge of the actual hidden information of your opponent, upon reveal, before opponent is able to move the ship, you can barrel-roll, boost yourself to avoid arc, or coordinate another ship either away. or into the way, blocking out the ship which is trying to move, bereaving it of its action (which is pretty strong in the supposedly action-depleted second edition).

At least it is range restricted, I really had these batlle-scape wide effects.

But still, this is exactly the stuff which made first edition stupid.

In addition to the points others have made, I'd point out that it's limited to white actions. Granted, it's likely that the action you want to take is white anyway, but it is another limiting factor.

On 6/16/2018 at 9:59 AM, any2cards said:

<And in case anyone thinks I am serious, please don't mistreat cards, even those as obnoxious as Luke>

Right. If you destroy the card, the opponent will just proxy it. Better to destroy the ship model instead.

9 hours ago, Marinealver said:

Turrets that are at Int<6 are dead

This is very inacurate. Where does that come from? turrets with int1 still have two arcs, can move, can take actions. How can they be dead? It is a matter of choise and strategy.

16 minutes ago, player2422845 said:

This is very inacurate. Where does that come from? turrets with int1 still have two arcs, can move, can take actions. How can they be dead? It is a matter of choise and strategy.

Didn't you know the sky is always fallling?

6 hours ago, JJ48 said:

In addition to the points others have made, I'd point out that it's limited to white actions. Granted, it's likely that the action you want to take is white anyway, but it is another limiting factor.

Indeed. To use the Inquisitor as a super-duper-blocker or super-duper arc dodger, you're needing a ship which has a crew slot, a white boost/barrel roll, and a decent green dial to clear off the stress afterwards (or the next turn, depending on initiative).

I suspect that TIE Phantoms are probably the best option going. But....yeah. Whilst a good option, it's good in the way threat tracker is. Because a free boost or barrel roll might get you a shot (or spare you a shot) but a free rotate will guarantee you a shot (assuming anyone's in range to shoot at you).

I'm less bothered about luke now we know how much he costs (I don't like him and rather he didn't exist, but I've passed out of the toys-out-of-pram zone). He still feels like lazy game design, but if you're essentially handing me a whole 'nother ship, then you've got to leverage a huge amount of advantage out of the card, and 360' turrets are annoying today but are still beatable.

If TIE Phantoms have crew instead of Gunner, I'll eat a 1e upgrade card.

19 minutes ago, gamblertuba said:

If TIE Phantoms have crew instead of Gunner, I'll eat a 1e upgrade card.

Well given that 0 of the generic Gunners do anything with fixed-arc primaries, they'd better not have a Gunner slot.

27 minutes ago, gamblertuba said:

If TIE Phantoms have crew instead of Gunner, I'll eat a 1e upgrade card.

Didn't Alex confirm they had a crew slot at the UK event?

I am looking forward to pairing the Inquisitor with Ree:

The combo allows you to react with one of your aces against an opponents move. However, the only ship with a white coordinate is the Lambda so far. Perhaps you can run a Tactical officer on the Decimator as well if it still has 3 crew slots. Looks like it could be a dirty little combo. Oh you went over there... Okay Soontir, lets barrel roll and rotate 90 degrees. Then hard turn to recover the stress.

8 hours ago, player2422845 said:

This is very inacurate. Where does that come from? turrets with int1 still have two arcs, can move, can take actions. How can they be dead? It is a matter of choise and strategy.

The same ways A-wings were able to tear up firesprays, move to where the turret arcs are not covering. Now if those Arcs were 180 instead of Quad 1 &3 you might have had a better argument.

As for Int 1, it can block but that is more of the power of Int 1 (the second highest powerful Int). In terms of power for Initiatives it is 6,1,5,2,3,and 4 is at the very bottom. It needs to have a Biggs 1.0 like ability to be used.