I am generally unsatisfied with the TIE advanced as we have seen it in 2.0, so I'm redesigning it to be more accurate to canon. The ship should be more expensive, but it is... an ADVANCED version of the series. However, It is still slower and beefier than the TAP and the Interceptor, but without making it a gimped ship that feels NOTHING like the ship it should feel like, but also without making it too much like the Defender.

3 Attack

3 Agility

3 Hull

2 Shields

Focus --> Barrel roll

Lock

Barrel Roll --> Evade

Boost

Ship ability:
Advanced Targeting Computer

While you perform a primary attack against a defender you have locked, change 1 (damage) result to a (critical) result.

System Slot

2 Mod slots

Speed 1: Blue banks , white straight

Speed 2: White turns, blue banks, blue straight,

Speed 3: White turns, white banks, blue straight , Red trolls

Speed 4: White straight, Red K-turn

Speed 5: White straight

Design insights:

I added back the Evade, but tied to the barrel roll. I did this for several reasons.

A, The ship should roll better than an X-Wing. That's the thing it does

B, The ship is still bulkier and heavier than a TIE, so the evade shouldn't come naturally.

C, The TIE Aggressor has Barrel-roll into an Evade, so it helps building some identity with the sister ship.

I also added a red boost. It's red because the ship is not as fast as an Interceptor or a Defender, but it shouldn't be outspeeded by an X-Wing either. Vader can add Engine Upgrade to make it white, and if balance is an issue EU can always cost more on Vader. So Vader can do what Vader does, but it can be expensive.

I didn't change the dial, because with the added mobility from actions, it feels right.

I moved around the Attack dice granted by the Targeting computer to the ship. The special ability of the ship is no longer a drawback, but a benefit. You can attack without locks, but locks make it so much better.

I don't think this would be broken, and it still has a solid identity amongst the other imperial ships, while being more similar to the related designs.

Not different enough to warrant a redesign. My objections were mostly quelled in the other thread.

3 attack dice, thank you!

I think advanced targeting computer should let you change 1 dice result to a crit against a target you have locked (like a guidance chip in 1.0) and then you may spend the lock and reroll the rest (if you want to ofc.)

4 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

Not different enough to warrant a redesign. My objections were mostly quelled in the other thread.

The original 2.0 design is not accurate enough. This is closer to what the ship should be.

The TIE/x1 has basically the same laser cannons as a TIE/ln. There's no reason to bring it up to a 3 primary except for the onboard systems, which is what ATC represents (and why it requires a lock). Red boost and linked red evade aren't enough to be worth changing the whole ship for. While I tentatively agree that it would be nice to have those things, for the time being I'll defer to the devs. If it still plays pathetically after it comes out, maybe I'll reconsider.

4 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

The TIE/x1 has basically the same laser cannons as a TIE/ln. There's no reason to bring it up to a 3 primary except for the onboard systems, which is what ATC represents (and why it requires a lock). Red boost and linked red evade aren't enough to be worth changing the whole ship for. While I tentatively agree that it would be nice to have those things, for the time being I'll defer to the devs. If it still plays pathetically after it comes out, maybe I'll reconsider.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/L-s1_laser_cannon

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/L-s9.3_laser_cannon

No.

Vader with an evade token? Are you trying to hand out NPE?

4 minutes ago, TasteTheRainbow said:

Vader with an evade token? Are you trying to hand out NPE?

God forbid that the most powerful pilot in the Universe could turn a blank result into an evade result.

If you really want an evade on Vader so much, you could always just give him the 2.0 version of Debris Gambit (I forget the new name)?

I don't think the power of the dark side has fully sunken in for everyone yet. 3 force tokens is huge.

The TIE Advance is an advanced TIE fighter. So, really not gonna be that impressive.

In game terms, it isn't gimped at all if the cost is right. It's a horrible ship if it isn't getting Advanced Targeting Computer, but it can be an amazingly efficient ship with Advanced Targeting Computer if it's cheaper than an X-wing (which it has to be).

So, if priced right, it'll be a ship that scales hard with your level of skill (ie ability to get Target-locks while balancing a single arc and not getting other actions without support or being Vader)

6 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

The TIE Advance is an advanced TIE fighter. So, really not gonna be that impressive.

In game terms, it isn't gimped at all if the cost is right. It's a horrible ship if it isn't getting Advanced Targeting Computer, but it can be an amazingly efficient ship with Advanced Targeting Computer if it's cheaper than an X-wing (which it has to be).

So, if priced right, it'll be a ship that scales hard with your level of skill (ie ability to get Target-locks while balancing a single arc and not getting other actions without support or being Vader)

This representation of the ship is simply not accurate, and it doesn't translate well to the game when looking at related fighters.

The Aggressor is basically the same chassis, it has barrel roll -> Evade.

It has the same cannons as the Interceptor.

It supposed to be more mobile than a TIE, and definitely more mobile than an X-Wing.

I wasn't talking about point costs. I said the ship doesn't FEEL right, when looking at what capabilities has in the canon, and how those things are handled in the game.

For example, it has BOTH a super fancy advanced targeting computer AND the same laser cannons as an Interceptor. Which means it should have both the ship ability, and a native 3 attack dice.

It wouldn't be broken, because, as you say, it all depends on the costs, and they can cost it appropriately.

40 minutes ago, Commander Kaine said:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/L-s1_laser_cannon 

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/L-s9.3_laser_cannon

Point taken. Still, Interceptors had 6 of them, over the TIE/x1's 2...

Just now, ClassicalMoser said:

Point taken. Still, Interceptors had 6 of them, over the TIE/x1's 2...

Interceptors had the potential to have six.

9 minutes ago, Commander Kaine said:

It has the same cannons as the Interceptor.

Well, the interceptor has 4 of those, and the X1 only a pair...

Edit : ninja'd

1 minute ago, Giledhil said:

Well, the interceptor has 4 of those, and the X1 only a pair...

Yet, Vader's TIE is represented easily having the same firepower as an X-Wing.

The interceptor doesn't have double the attack of an Advanced, (or triple, with chin cannons), because that is silly. I've always found the Number of guns = Attack dice argument dumb (and it doesn't even work with X-Wings, the game's namesake)

However, the argument that the ship has the same armament as a standard TIE + special internal systems is simply not true. It had more powerful cannons than TIE-s. It was a specialized combat craft for the Empire's biggest baddest dude. It should be able to shoot with a 3 dice attack.

Look. Dash got a native 4 dice attack, even though he was a known NPE and problematic design element. And he sits in a crappy freighter.

Surely, the Dark Lord of the Sith can enjoy the same leniency.

52 minutes ago, Nyxen said:

I don't think the power of the dark side has fully sunken in for everyone yet. 3 force tokens is huge.

That's only good for Vader, not the Tie Advanced in general.

9 minutes ago, Dwing said:

That's only good for Vader, not the Tie Advanced in general.

And it's not useful if you roll blanks

21 minutes ago, Commander Kaine said:

 Yet, Vader's TIE is represented easily having the same firepower as an X-Wing.

The interceptor doesn't have double the attack of an Advanced, (or triple, with chin cannons), because that is silly. I've always found the Number of guns = Attack dice argument dumb (and it doesn't even work with X-Wings, the game's namesake)

However, the argument that the ship has the same armament as a standard TIE + special internal systems is simply not true. It had more powerful cannons than TIE-s. It was a specialized combat craft for the Empire's biggest baddest dude. It should be able to shoot with a 3 dice attack.



Look. Dash got a native 4 dice attack, even though he was a known NPE and problematic design element. And he sits in a crappy freighter.

Surely, the Dark Lord of the Sith can enjoy the same leniency.

    

 

"Crappy freighter" = heavily modified YT-2400 with upgrades to the weapons systems, when we look at the scum faction use of it.

If we say that Vader's TIE has more powerful cannons than the TIE/LN, but less cannons than the TIE/IN (of the exact same type), with no actual ability to compare than "much more powerful" (L-s9.3 wiki), the same argument can be made for 4 > 2 cannons based on the TIE/IN wiki entry - " In addition, four laser cannons on its wingtips allowed for far more firepower to overload the shields on an enemy craft". The TAP is two dice as well and boasts, per the wiki, more powerful cannons (but still two) than the TIE/LN.

It doesn't mean that number of guns = number of attack dice, but number of guns can influence attack dice.

At the end of the day, I just want to see a balanced ship on the table. I'll be happy with that.

If I could have one change I would have liked to see a barrel roll linked to a red evade. That makes a lot of sense @Commander Kaine and I like the thematics of it. Otherwise I’m happy with it and it’s too late now anyway!

To be clear, I'm not against the changes; I'm just not up in arms against the current state of the X1.

Edit: ATC adds the die and changes a result. That sounds like boosted power output, no?

So, you want a TIE Defender, right?

(or a TIE Avenger)

2 hours ago, Commander Kaine said:

This representation of the ship is simply not accurate, and it doesn't translate well to the game when looking at related fighters.

When did the tie advanced kick *** in the movies?

Did it, while piloted by Darth Freaking Vader fail to stop luke (an untrained farmboy in his rebel x-wing, you could argue lukes force but I mean Vader should have been better in the force then luke so that is actually more against the advanced.)?

Did it got tossed into space spinning out of control from a single hit?

I never saw any part where it was much better if at all then a tie fighter. Oh my Vader snuck up behind some y-wings woo hoo.

Sorry for all the spoilers to those who have not seen the OT...... I think that statue of limitations is up.

I mean, I saw it single handedly kill a Pelta in official canon..

3 hours ago, Commander Kaine said:

God forbid that the most powerful pilot in the Universe could turn a blank result into an evade result.

He’s stacking it with a focus while getting double reposition actions in many turns with that charge upgrade.

That’s worse for generics than Fel ever was.