The point of this build is to force my opponent into a series of bad choices. With 6 activations, positioning shouldn't be too difficult on my end. I know that OP isn't the best and is very swingy, but I think I can force these bad choices to allow a good shot in time for my Cymoon. HIEs is probably the better route, but I like the risk. Mithel and Valen are there exclusively to clog up squadron movement one or two turns while the positioning happens. It might be a problem to have not planned for anti squad, but since I plan on a long range salvo, if the squads come early, the Raider and Cymoon have decent anti squad dice. Thoughts?

Brawlin
Author: FoxOmega44

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 389/400

Commander: Darth Vader

Assault Objective: Blockade Run
Defense Objective: Fighter Ambush
Navigation Objective: Superior Positions

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)
- Demolisher ( 10 points)
- Engine Techs ( 8 points)
- External Racks ( 3 points)
= 77 total ship cost

Raider II-Class Corvette (48 points)
- Fire-Control Team ( 2 points)
- Disposable Capacitors ( 3 points)
- Overload Pulse ( 8 points)
= 61 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Comms Net ( 2 points)
= 25 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Comms Net ( 2 points)
= 25 total ship cost

[ flagship ] Imperial Star Destroyer Cymoon 1 Refit (112 points)
- Darth Vader ( 36 points)
- Avenger ( 5 points)
- Strategic Adviser ( 4 points)
- Gunnery Team ( 7 points)
- Spinal Armament ( 9 points)
= 173 total ship cost

1 "Mauler" Mithel ( 15 points)
1 Valen Rudor ( 13 points)
= 28 total squadron cost

I’d drop fire control team and consider swapping mauler for Cienna, with no intel you will only get off maulers ability once, Cienna will last longer and may net more damage via counter. She’s a great wing mate to Valen.

I might have to try this one it looks fun.

Also, @Darth Sanguis get in here

OLP (391/400)
Empire

Commander: Darth Vader

[flagship] Imperial Star Destroyer Cymoon 1 Refit (112)
- Darth Vader (36)
- Avenger (5)
- Strategic Adviser (4)
- Quad Battery Turrets (5)
- Gunnery Team (7)
= 169 total points

Gladiator II-class Star Destroyer (62)
- Demolisher (10)
- External Racks (3)
- Engine Techs (8)
= 83 total points

Raider II-class Corvette (48)
- Overload Pulse (8)
- Disposable Capacitors (3)
= 59 total points

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23)
- Comms Net (2)
= 25 total points

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23)
- Comms Net (2)
= 25 total points

Squadrons (30/134):
1x Ciena Ree TIE Interceptor Squadron (17)
1x Valen Rudor TIE Fighter Squadron (13)

This is how I’m gonna run it next time I get the chance to play. Get a little more flak in there by upping demo to a Glad 2

I like the switch to QBTs, free up more space for the Glad II upgrade. I'm curious as to why you would want to throw fire control team out so fast. For only 2 points, you have the chance to hit 1 ship from front and 1 from side on your dcap round, and, ideally, have those positioned somewhere where your Cymoon can unload through the front to hit both due to gunnery teams. I know it's super unlikely, but for the chance for greatness? To have the feeling of just wiping 2 corvettes or maybe something bigger completely off the map in one turn? Maybe I'm just a dreamer...

Fire control teams is exhaust. If you are shooting a large ship they will use all their tokens prior to overload pulse triggering, including containing the standard crit effect. If you are shooting a small ship they will evade the crit thus negating both overload pulse and the standard crit effect.

Fire control teams seems pretty pointless.

Fire control teams doesnt let you use a crit effect without a crit die if thats what you are thinking.

You know, I thought it was too cheap for what I thought it was. It is definitely coming off.

Laughed when I found this thread. I've been brainstorming a really similar build under Jerjerrod, but with ACMs and a Kuat.

Is sensor teams a good alternative? That way I can reroll all my dice to fish for the crit from Vader, and then auto accuracy against an evade. That would give me a huge success rate against any ship except the double evades, but I would probably avoid firing on those ships with this combo and probably sic the Glad on them.

17 hours ago, MandalorianMoose said:

I’d drop fire control team and consider swapping mauler for Cienna, with no intel you will only get off maulers ability once, Cienna will last longer and may net more damage via counter. She’s a great wing mate to Valen.

I might have to try this one it looks fun.

Also, @Darth Sanguis get in here

Well, I like the spirit. Pulsetapping in this meta is BRAVE.

I definitely wouldn't use a raider though. They don't last long enough against big ships. ( I just played a matched where a buddy of mine was running 2 of them with d-caps, screed and HIEs, he never got them off, with 1st player and an akbar Mc75, I popped them both at long range with a single turn. ) Maybe use a VSD instead?

Honestly, I'd drop the pulsetap altogether.

Especially if you plan to run this madness with Vader. He has always failed me when I needed my blue crits. I also took demo out. I like demo, but I feel like a long range fleet would just be surrendering points if you send him in alone. Instead I've added 2 arquittens, both with intel officers and trcs. With Vader you should be able to average 5-7 damage per shot, if give a confire, put that intel officer on their brace. Then let the Cymoon finish them off with xi7s and long range dice. Keep everything at long range.

Vader's cavalcade rework
Author: Darth Sanguis

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 395/400

Commander: Darth Vader

Assault Objective: Most Wanted
Defense Objective: Contested Outpost
Navigation Objective: Dangerous Territory

[ flagship ] Imperial Star Destroyer Cymoon 1 Refit (112 points)
- Darth Vader ( 36 points)
- Avenger ( 5 points)
- Strategic Adviser ( 4 points)
- Gunnery Team ( 7 points)
- X17 Turbolasers ( 6 points)
- Spinal Armament ( 9 points)
= 179 total ship cost

Arquitens-class Light Cruiser (54 points)
- Intel Officer ( 7 points)
- Turbolaser Reroute Circuits ( 7 points)
= 68 total ship cost

Arquitens-class Light Cruiser (54 points)
- Intel Officer ( 7 points)
- Turbolaser Reroute Circuits ( 7 points)
= 68 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Comms Net ( 2 points)
= 25 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Comms Net ( 2 points)
= 25 total ship cost

1 Valen Rudor ( 13 points)
1 Ciena Ree ( 17 points)
= 30 total squadron cost

2 hours ago, Darth Sanguis said:

Well, I like the spirit. Pulsetapping in this meta is BRAVE.

I definitely wouldn't use a raider though. They don't last long enough against big ships. ( I just played a matched where a buddy of mine was running 2 of them with d-caps, screed and HIEs, he never got them off, with 1st player and an akbar Mc75, I popped them both at long range with a single turn. ) Maybe use a VSD instead?

Honestly, I'd drop the pulsetap altogether.

Especially if you plan to run this madness with Vader. He has always failed me when I needed my blue crits. I also took demo out. I like demo, but I feel like a long range fleet would just be surrendering points if you send him in alone. Instead I've added 2 arquittens, both with intel officers and trcs. With Vader you should be able to average 5-7 damage per shot, if give a confire, put that intel officer on their brace. Then let the Cymoon finish them off with xi7s and long range dice. Keep everything at long range.

Vader's cavalcade rework
Author: Darth Sanguis

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 395/400

Commander: Darth Vader

Assault Objective: Most Wanted
Defense Objective: Contested Outpost
Navigation Objective: Dangerous Territory

[ flagship ] Imperial Star Destroyer Cymoon 1 Refit (112 points)
- Darth Vader ( 36 points)
- Avenger ( 5 points)
- Strategic Adviser ( 4 points)
- Gunnery Team ( 7 points)
- X17 Turbolasers ( 6 points)
- Spinal Armament ( 9 points)
= 179 total ship cost

Arquitens-class Light Cruiser (54 points)
- Intel Officer ( 7 points)
- Turbolaser Reroute Circuits ( 7 points)
= 68 total ship cost

Arquitens-class Light Cruiser (54 points)
- Intel Officer ( 7 points)
- Turbolaser Reroute Circuits ( 7 points)
= 68 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Comms Net ( 2 points)
= 25 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Comms Net ( 2 points)
= 25 total ship cost

1 Valen Rudor ( 13 points)
1 Ciena Ree ( 17 points)
= 30 total squadron cost

Eh I get what you are going after, and cymoon+2 arqs are great, I just don’t agree with some of the upgrades here.

You already have IO and XI7, what good is Avenger gonna do? You have Vader for rerolls, swap TRC to slaved turrets for more dice.

Those changes give you 12 points to play around with for slicer tools, IF/EF, or just a bigger bid

54 minutes ago, MandalorianMoose said:

You already have IO and XI7, what good is Avenger gonna do?

It's to force bad decisions. Because IO strips tokens players are unlikely to use that token if selected, especially if the damage is ambiguous. (Which is covered below.) With 2 ships with Ios you can force tokens, even if they have multiple braces. It makes the ISD a quality last hitter.

54 minutes ago, MandalorianMoose said:

You have Vader for rerolls, swap TRC to slaved turrets for more dice.

I've run this both ways and found that while 1 extra die can peak higher, it is significantly less reliable at delivering consistent damage. Which in my opinion is better. TRC kittens do an average of 5-7 damage, which is just ambiguous enough to make them question whether they want to spend a brace, the goal is force the bad decision:

1.) Lose brace
2.) Consistently suffer 5-7 damage

Most people, I've found, will suffer the 5-7 when an ISD is looming, without realizing they doom themselves as the ISD can peak high enough to last hit them even through the brace after suffering 10-14 damage.

TLDR: It's a mind game with no good choices.

54 minutes ago, MandalorianMoose said:

Those changes give you 12 points to play around with for slicer tools, IF/EF, or just a bigger bid

Slicer tools forces a gozzer to medium range, I wouldn't do that with this fleet. Honestly this fleet is good as 1st or second... long range and wide arcs assure most opponents aren't going far and with so many activations, not much will arc dodge for long.



Those are my opinions anyways. I run a fleet called bag of kittens which is this fleet minus a gozzer and the ISD plus 2x more kittens with TRCs and IOs, and my meta gets grump when I bring 'em out. lol

21 minutes ago, Darth Sanguis said:

It's to force bad decisions. Because IO strips tokens players are unlikely to use that token if selected, especially if the damage is ambiguous. (Which is covered below.) With 2 ships with Ios you can force tokens, even if they have multiple braces. It makes the ISD a quality last hitter.

I've run this both ways and found that while 1 extra die can peak higher, it is significantly less reliable at delivering consistent damage. Which in my opinion is better. TRC kittens do an average of 5-7 damage, which is just ambiguous enough to make them question whether they want to spend a brace, the goal is force the bad decision:

1.) Lose brace
2.) Consistently suffer 5-7 damage

Most people, I've found, will suffer the 5-7 when an ISD is looming, without realizing they doom themselves as the ISD can peak high enough to last hit them even through the brace after suffering 10-14 damage.

TLDR: It's a mind game with no good choices.

Slicer tools forces a gozzer to medium range, I wouldn't do that with this fleet. Honestly this fleet is good as 1st or second... long range and wide arcs assure most opponents aren't going far and with so many activations, not much will arc dodge for long.



Those are my opinions anyways. I run a fleet called bag of kittens which is this fleet minus a gozzer and the ISD plus 2x more kittens with TRCs and IOs, and my meta gets grump when I bring 'em out. lol

I get the IO across multiple platforms, it is absolutely brutal. I just see a sort of ani- synergy with avenger there, as if they don’t use it it stays green and avenger is useless, but if they do it’s gonna and avenger is also useless. Devastator to add even more downrange dice perhaps? Or keep Avenger and drop xi7, to really put the pressure on those redirects from those kitten shots.

Slaved vs TRC is just a guaranteed ceiling vs keeping defenses up preference.

I admit, having IO multiple times, or even once, on an Avenger build is strange. I feel like you want them to make choices to burn or not, and you could do that more cheaply with something else.

I would admittedly be very uncomfortable making choices against this build though.

24 minutes ago, MandalorianMoose said:

I get the IO across multiple platforms, it is absolutely brutal. I just see a sort of ani- synergy with avenger there, as if they don’t use it it stays green and avenger is useless, but if they do it’s gonna and avenger is also useless.

I can see the logic here, but I also know how much that 1 point can mean when both redirects are red and/ or the contain is flipped.

For the cost, I think it's good to have the redundancy.

But it's also got a lot to do about overloading their choices, with avenger in the build anything exhausted is considered gone too. If a kitten peaks high early, a player may make a mistake, not redirect to leave leave everything green and end up suffering a crit, or Burn the brace too soon while also flipping redirects.

I've run a list like this (it had 1 more kitten and no gozzers) and the overload of bad choices really trips people up. Exploiting mistakes works for me.

Devastator may not be a bad choice in it's turn though, added damage makes last hitting easier. Admittedly, I wouldn't use a Cymoon for something like this. I'd stick to 4 kittens with IOs and TRCs, a cymoon is such an expensive and easy target without tua ecms lol.