The Meta is that Rebs are better right now. Look at the TTS league, all the top squads are Rebs. The only reason that the Empire is represented in the top 5 in UK tourney is that most peeps are plying Empire right now. So a rebs winning the tourney even proves more so that there is an unbalance in the force till Vader gets help or Fett is the real deal.

Also, my son and I have been battling 2x per week over the last 3 weeks. He plays Empire I have rebs. He is is better than me in all of the other mini games that we have played over the years, and even being top in the US and Canada in the old WOTC Star Wars minis game which has a higher degree of skill and tactics than Legion (this is not a knock on Legion, it will get there in time). I have been beating him on a consistent basis, some games we dont even get to round 4 cause there is no chance of him winning. He has tried a few different archtypes- conclusion, Vader and ATST is well overcosted. Luke and Leia together are much better than Vader and cost only 30 pts more.

But this game is still loads of fun.

Eh, I kind of disagree.

The TTS league is a tough one to assess. First off, Snowtroopers with Flamethrower weren't allowed, and I think that's a very relevant unit when assessing the current meta. This was due to the tournament schedule versus release announcement, so it'll be interesting to see what happens when they are more wide-spread. Further, at the time that lists were submitted, Veers with 2x AT-ST was chosen - and it was the most popular Imperial list. Since then I think people have been migrating to Veers with 3x Speeder Bikes as a more effective Imperial List. This was, however, not popular at the time lists were submitted (very early in the game's life). So I think that the Imperial Lists were not optimized as much as they could be. I say this as someone who played in the tournament. (And for the record, this is not in any way a shot at the TTS league. Everything makes sense. I just think that the league, because of when lists were required to be submitted, is a snapshot of what the meta might have looked like about 1 month after release.)

If anything, I think the biggest takeaway from current tournament assessments isn't that Rebels are "stronger", its that activations absolutely matter. More people were playing Imperials in TTS, however, I suspect that number of activations wasn't valued as much as it should have been. This is largely because this was a tournament that kicked off almost immediately at launch.

Rebels MAY be stronger if you think strength = activations. However I think that the two sides are very well balanced at this time.

Just some thoughts.

1 hour ago, Copes said:

Eh, I kind of disagree.

The TTS league is a tough one to assess. First off, Snowtroopers with Flamethrower weren't allowed, and I think that's a very relevant unit when assessing the current meta. This was due to the tournament schedule versus release announcement, so it'll be interesting to see what happens when they are more wide-spread. Further, at the time that lists were submitted, Veers with 2x AT-ST was chosen - and it was the most popular Imperial list. Since then I think people have been migrating to Veers with 3x Speeder Bikes as a more effective Imperial List. This was, however, not popular at the time lists were submitted (very early in the game's life). So I think that the Imperial Lists were not optimized as much as they could be. I say this as someone who played in the tournament. (And for the record, this is not in any way a shot at the TTS league. Everything makes sense. I just think that the league, because of when lists were required to be submitted, is a snapshot of what the meta might have looked like about 1 month after release.)

If anything, I think the biggest takeaway from current tournament assessments isn't that Rebels are "stronger", its that activations absolutely matter. More people were playing Imperials in TTS, however, I suspect that number of activations wasn't valued as much as it should have been. This is largely because this was a tournament that kicked off almost immediately at launch.

Rebels MAY be stronger if you think strength = activations. However I think that the two sides are very well balanced at this time.

Just some thoughts.

I agree - think people headed for the mentality of bigger is better (AT ST) and lost sight of the value of troopers and bikers. The combination is lethal but can be countered by rebel line ups. I think the factions are currently balanced. Will be interesting to see what the new units do like the scouts and commandos.

I definitely learned some lessons from my initial Imperial lists that have affected my current lists and made them significantly more effective. Stormtroopers are far more effective than my theory predicted and my current lists include far more troopers than I originally expected.

TTS isn’t quite the same as you didn’t have to buy any of the units to use them.

I think Imperials have an edge in individual unit effectiveness and survivability overall. I think Rebels have activation advantages.

They play differently, but you can win or lose with either.

Yes, Veers and 3 speeder bikes can crush it. The imperial problem is vader and his over cost slow butt getting to where he needs to be to do anything meaningful. 3 speederbikes can run amok in a way that makes the rebels rethink their life choices.

4 hours ago, chriscook said:

The Meta is that Rebs are better right now.

I think you might be right, but only because meta is what people think is good. It doesn't mean it's true. From local players, I actually hear more complaints about empire being stronger, specifically DLTs and bikes.

Truthfully the only complaint i have about imps is they have so much easy impact access.

In theory, its a good thing because it counters all rebel armor without even trying (which is one reason the T47 is so bad unless used in a very specific way)
In practice, rebel just doesnt use armor and spams troops. All that pricy impact weaponry the imps have generally doesnt work much better than just stormtroopers against troopers (per cost).

I still beat my imp friends majority of the time, but thats because i run troop heavy lists and they insist on the ATST because "the moment i dont bring it is the moment you finally field your 3 ATRTs and the T47" lol

No game is balanced out the gate, and this game is missing several key units to truely make the army. I wouldnt even say there is a meta right now because how can you determine a meta out of two freakin choices? (troop spam or vehicle spam)

I've got a winning streak with my 8 activation Veers/AT-ST list against rebel squads. I beat a 10 activation Leia squad most recently but I agree, activations are the name of the game at this point.

5 hours ago, KraydKaflar said:

I've got a winning streak with my 8 activation Veers/AT-ST list against rebel squads. I beat a 10 activation Leia squad most recently but I agree, activations are the name of the game at this point.

Activations are super important, but not just at the start of round 1. The staying power of units is important if you want to keep your activation advantage by round 4-6.