A few questions

By The Grand Falloon, in L5R LCG: Rules Discussion

So I just finished up my first full game (slow going with the crane/lion starter decks, but still fun!). I won by getting my friend to bid too high in a duel, causing a Dishonor loss, so I'm quite pleased with myself. A few questions came up, and I was hoping y'all could help.

Skill Bonuses. There are a lot of cards that target characters based on their skill. Such as "target a character with skill 2 or lower," or "with lower skill." Does this refer solely to printed skill, or do bonuses from other sources count? If I have a Wandering Ronin with 2 Military skill, and use his ability to add 2 more, does he have 4 Skill, or 2 Skill, and 2 bonus... points? I'm wording this badly.

Does the Honor Dial stay in play after cards are drawn? If I set my Honor Dial lower than my opponent, and draw Good Omen, can I use it that round to add Fate to a character, or do I have to wait until the dial gets used again?

If I have an ability to remove fate from a character, and choose a character with no fate, is he discarded, or does that have to wait until the Fate Phase?

What's the deal with the red and blue sides of the Ring tokens? Just aesthetic?

Edited by The Grand Falloon

44 minutes ago, The Grand Falloon said:

Skill Bonuses. There are a lot of cards that target characters based on their skill. Such as "target a character with skill 2 or lower," or "with lower skill." Does this refer solely to printed skill, or do bonuses from other sources count? If I have a Wandering Ronin with 2 Military skill, and use his ability to add 2 more, does he have 4 Skill, or 2 Skill, and 2 bonus... points? I'm wording this badly.

Unless it mentions Base (such as Way of the Lion or Bayushi Yunako) use the current total factoring in all bonuses and penalties.

44 minutes ago, The Grand Falloon said:

Does the Honor Dial stay in play after cards are drawn? If I set my Honor Dial lower than my opponent, and draw Good Omen, can I use it that round to add Fate to a character, or do I have to wait until the dial gets used again?

Yes, the Honor Dial remains set at the chosen value until a new bid occurs, and can be referenced by other effects at any time

44 minutes ago, The Grand Falloon said:

If I have an ability to remove fate from a character, and choose a character with no fate, is he discarded, or does that have to wait until the Fate Phase?

You cannot remove Fate from a character with none. If something would try, that part of the action has no effect.

44 minutes ago, The Grand Falloon said:

What's the deal with the red and blue sides of the Ring tokens? Just aesthetic?

The red side is used to show it is a Military Conflict, blue for Politics.

5 hours ago, The Grand Falloon said:

If I have an ability to remove fate from a character, and choose a character with no fate, is he discarded, or does that have to wait until the Fate Phase?

Depends on the circumstance. As Evilgm pointed out, you cannot remove fate from a character without fate. If the sole action is to remove a fate, then the action is not legal (Example Meditations on the Tao). If part of the action is to remove the fate, but other things happen, then it is still legal (Example A fate worse than death). Finally, if part of the Cost (before the dash) is to remove a fate from a character, but they have no fate, you cannot pay the cost, and therefore cannot use the ability (See I am Ready).

11 minutes ago, Mirith said:

Depends on the circumstance. As Evilgm pointed out, you cannot remove fate from a character without fate. If the sole action is to remove a fate, then the action is not legal (Example Meditations on the Tao). If part of the action is to remove the fate, but other things happen, then it is still legal (Example A fate worse than death). Finally, if part of the Cost (before the dash) is to remove a fate from a character, but they have no fate, you cannot pay the cost, and therefore cannot use the ability (See I am Ready).

Even it its not part of the cost if the removal of fate precedes another effect with the word "then" and the fate cannot be removed the portion of the effect after then will also fail to resolve.

From the RRG
The word “Then”
If the effect text of a card ability includes the word “then,” the text preceding the word then must be successfully resolved in full (i.e. the game state must change to reflect the intent of the pre-then aspect of the effect in its entirety) before the remainder of the effect described after the word “then” can be resolved.
◊◊ If the pre-then aspect of an effect does successfully resolve in full, the resolution of the post-then aspect of the effect must also attempt to resolve.
◊◊ If the pre-then aspect of an effect does not successfully resolve in full, the post-then aspect does not attempt to resolve.

30 minutes ago, Schmoozies said:

Even it its not part of the cost if the removal of fate precedes another effect with the word "then" and the fate cannot be removed the portion of the effect after then will also fail to resolve.

From the RRG
The word “Then”
If the effect text of a card ability includes the word “then,” the text preceding the word then must be successfully resolved in full (i.e. the game state must change to reflect the intent of the pre-then aspect of the effect in its entirety) before the remainder of the effect described after the word “then” can be resolved.
◊◊ If the pre-then aspect of an effect does successfully resolve in full, the resolution of the post-then aspect of the effect must also attempt to resolve.
◊◊ If the pre-then aspect of an effect does not successfully resolve in full, the post-then aspect does not attempt to resolve.

Which card has this on it?

6 minutes ago, Mirith said:

Which card has this on it?

Its not a card its the rules reference guide.

Thanks, guys! One more question that occurred to me when I started looking at the Phoenix: if I change the element of an attack, how does that affect the Fate that's on the rings? Let's say Fire and Void each have one Fate on them, and my enemy attacks me with Fire. I have something clever I can do with Void, so I use an ability to change the conflict to Void. Does he collect the Fate on both Rings?

1 minute ago, The Grand Falloon said:

Thanks, guys! One more question that occurred to me when I started looking at the Phoenix: if I change the element of an attack, how does that affect the Fate that's on the rings? Let's say Fire and Void each have one Fate on them, and my enemy attacks me with Fire. I have something clever I can do with Void, so I use an ability to change the conflict to Void. Does he collect the Fate on both Rings?

If you change the contested ring type the attacker claims any fate that was on the newly contested ring. If you change it between conflicts you would be able to claim the fate from the ring. (barring any Dragon fate manipulation shenanigans preventing you from claiming fate form rings).

If the ring gains elements (like from Kaede or Seeker of Knowledge) then the ring itself doesn't change. If you actually change rings though (like with Elemental Fury), then the attacker gains the fate on the new ring.

Edit: beaten to the punch. Outside of conflicts, though, if you use Know the World to switch rings from your claimed pool with one in the unclaimed pool, you get the fate on the new ring, too.

Edited by AradonTemplar