Outmaneuver was always a poorer choice than Predator, and there are engagements where it's simply not useful (Hello, Decimators).

Predator having an additional restriction probably balances it out.

I guess we'll see.

Added Force Powers to the OP. Summary:

Heightened Perception: 2 pts

Instinctive Aim: 2 pts

Sense: 3 pts

Supernatural Reflexes: 8 pts (up from 5)

1 hour ago, J1mBob said:

Added Force Powers to the OP. Summary:

Heightened Perception: 2 pts

Instinctive Aim: 2 pts

Sense: 3 pts

Supernatural Reflexes: 5 pts

Supernatural reflexes should be double that! It's miles better than advanced sensors. Heck it's better than 1.0 PTL, and that's something they got rid of!

Edit: I think you might have missed that it doesn't stop you from doing your normal action after your move.

This card gives a force user a (weaker) version of Vader's ability and Advanced Sensors at the same time. And in theory for an arc-dodger, having the option of taking that 1 damage to do a pre-move boost and dodge an arc might be worth it too.

2 hours ago, player2072913 said:

Supernatural reflexes should be double that! It's miles better than advanced sensors. Heck it's better than 1.0 PTL, and that's something they got rid of!

Edit: I think you might have missed that it doesn't stop you from doing your normal action after your move.

This card gives a force user a (weaker) version of Vader's ability and Advanced Sensors at the same time. And in theory for an arc-dodger, having the option of taking that 1 damage to do a pre-move boost and dodge an arc might be worth it too.

10 points is maybe a bit steep but 5 does seem pretty cheap. I'd maybe go 7 or 8. The fact it restricts you to boost or barrel roll makes it less useful than Advanced Sensors. It would also seem a lot (all?) of the named Force user pilots use their Force points to activate their inherent abilities, so by taking a Force power you're then limiting what else you can do. For example, does Vader really care that much about taking a pre-move action when he's already I6 and his own ability basically gives him super-PTL? It's not like it's a bad option but I'm not sure it's 10 points good.

10 hours ago, Reiver said:

Don't forget that 5 points is still a point cheaper than the upgrade would have been in 1.0.

It really comes down to what level of premium they want to place on passive modifiers - they've already tightened the upgrade's usability, but is that enough? Or are they straight up pricing dice mods higher still as part of the no-stacks token gameplay?

We don't know, but I'm certainly going to be interested to find out.

You could be right. The reason I went slightly cheaper than current cost, despite the extra restrictions on passive mods, is that the Bullseye restriction, combined with the loss of the 2nd reroll against lower-PS ships makes it quite a bit worse, IMO. I think the pricing on Predator will tell us a lot about how FFG are going to view passive mods in the new edition.

10 hours ago, Reiver said:

Outmaneuver was always a poorer choice than Predator, and there are engagements where it's simply not useful (Hello, Decimators).

Predator having an additional restriction probably balances it out.

I guess we'll see.

On the other hand, it's probably much more useful with the way evade tokens now work - A token stacking soontir or defender now needs to roll a blank to get any mileage out of their evade token - dropping from 3 dice to 2 makes a big difference to that.

Marksmanship needs to be cheap because it looks pretty awful. What will really drive it - the only thing really driving marksmanship in 1.0 - is how often an ability is triggered by [when you score a critical].

7 hours ago, player2072913 said:

Edit: I think you might have missed that it doesn't stop you from doing your normal action after your move.

You are right, I did!

Ok, let’s look at B.B.-8 for 2 points. He grants a free barrel roll action after you reveal a green move while still allowing your normal action. That’s similar to Supernatural Reflexes, but not as good.

Or another comparison is Advanced Sensors and PTL in 1.0. That allowed two actions before you move and frequently allowed you to clear the stress with a green move. Those combined for 6 (1.0) points... are roughly equivalent: it didn’t limit you to only a pre-maneuver boost/barrel roll like SR but SR doesn’t limit you to blue maneuvers. Does that mean SR should be 12 points? I think the reason it should be less than 12 is because SR costs you a Force token and also if your maneuver bumps you don’t get your second regular action. I’m going to go with 8 points while being open to the idea that 8 points might be under-costed.

Added Astromechs. See first post for card text and cost reasoning.

R2 Astromech: 6 pts

R2-D2: 10 pts

R5-D8: 7 pts

R5 Astromech: 4 pts

R3 Astromech: 6 pts

R4 Astromech: 2 pts

R5-TK: 0

On 5/28/2018 at 2:37 PM, J1mBob said:

Expert Handling: [adds white barrel roll, red barrel roll required]. Analysis: adding the barrel roll action in 1.0 costs 2 points. Here, you already have to have the red version on your bar. Changing a single action from red to white seems less valuable than 1.0 Vectored Thrusters. Estimate: 2 pts

I see "Expert Handling" as the first auto-include upgrade in 2.0. They have passed out the red-barrel-roll to a significant number of ace pilots.

With VI gone, there is simply no better talent for Dash, Dengar, & Nym

Have you ever flown 1.0 Boba Fett with Expert Handling1.0ver.? You immediately realize that receiving a stress for doing a barrel roll is extremely limiting. At a MINIMUM, 'Expert Handling' for Dash should be 6 points & a safe initial costing would be 8 points. Engine Upgrade of the Falcon will be the other 'auto-include' upgrade.

I will be curious to see if the upgrade slots add cost to the pilots that have them. In 1.0, this was the case, but it doesn't have to be this way. It would be nice for Luke in his X-wing to be viable without any upgrades. Then the upgrades are costed according to the value they give that specific pilot. This would provide the greatest list building flexibility. Essentially in 1.0, you were punished for not using upgrades slots. Upgrades across the board are hopefully more expensive in 2.0. One factor that made 1.0 into Acewing was the across the board undercosting of upgrades. Expertise being a prime example. Generic pilots don't have access to OP upgrades, therefore they suffer greatly.

I don't think trying to guess the cost of each upgrade and pilot is the right thing to do, instead I think it might be a better exercise to guess how much points in upgrades people are going to put on a ship.

So I am going on a limb and going to say either 1 point if we have a swarm meta to 20+ points if we have a Int 6+ meta.

9 hours ago, Dengar5 said:

I see "Expert Handling" as the first auto-include upgrade in 2.0. They have passed out the red-barrel-roll to a significant number of ace pilots.

With VI gone, there is simply no better talent for Dash, Dengar, & Nym

That seems like a pretty bold claim considering we haven't seen even half of the Talents that will be available at launch. Not saying Expert Handling won't be good but we simply don't know enough about the other options to label in auto-include.