There is one benefit to Maul's appearence.

Lucasfilm may no longer be afraid of implementing elements of the Expanded Universe into  the films.

It means Thrawn is suddenly on the table for a live     action appearence.

22 minutes ago, Pooleman said:

This guys rant on strong women is a little ridiculous. Look at Leia from the original trilogy. She was tough and didn’t take any crap. Was she denigrating men when she saved Han, Luke, and Chewy on the death star prison level? Was she pushing a feminist agenda when she giving Han the business or fighting on Endor? Ugh.

You could argue she denigrated the heck out of Luke and Han and guys in a New Hope.

"Aren't you a little short to be a Stormtrooper" is one.

49 minutes ago, Pooleman said:

This guys rant on strong women is a little ridiculous. Look at Leia from the original trilogy. She was tough and didn’t take any crap. Was she denigrating men when she saved Han, Luke, and Chewy on the death star prison level? Was she pushing a feminist agenda when she giving Han the business or fighting on Endor? Ugh.

Sadly both sides have very short memories.

I don't think the alt right backlash would be so strong if people in charge of new Star Wars didn't pretend that they are the pioneers of diversity in media, disrespecting George Lucas, Carrie Fisher, Natalie Portman, Billy D. Williams, Temuera Morrison, Caroline Blakiston, Samuel L. Jackson and many many others.

The difference is that when prequels were coming out it was just natural, today the media and politicians are working hard to radicalize us and put as at each others throats, creating outrage culture and exploiting it for clickbait money and votes.

What is particuraily annoying is that in many places when you criticise new movies for valid reasons you are called sexist and racist because the creators and the most combatant fans are using the actions of a vocal minority to label you and shield themselves from any inconvenient points.

On 5/25/2018 at 11:37 PM, Varyag said:

Just saw it. 8/10. The only cons: slightly too much of Lando's droid, too much dice, and Han was slightly too annoying.

I've seen this criticism elsewhere and I don't get it. The dice are in all of four scenes in the film: Han plucks them off the speeder after it crashes, he hands them to Qi'ra when she's captured, she gives them back to him on Kessel, and they're in the cockpit of the Falcon at the end. That's it. Probably no more than five minutes of screen time, if that.

7 minutes ago, eMeM said:

Sadly both sides have very short memories.

I don't think the alt right backlash wouldn't be so strong if people in charge of new Star Wars didn't pretend that they are the pioneers of diversity in media, disrespecting George Lucas, Carrie Fisher, Natalie Portman, Billy D. Williams, Temuera Morrison, Caroline Blakiston, Samuel L. Jackson and many many others.

The difference is that when prequels were coming out it was just natural, today the media and politicians are working hard to radicalize us and put as at each others throats, creating outrage culture and exploiting it for clickbait money and votes.

What is particuraily annoying is that in many places when you criticise new movies for valid reasons you are called sexist and racist because the creators and the most combatant fans are using the actions of a vocal minority to label you and shield themselves from any inconvenient points.

As a lifelong Trekkie the lack of diversity was something Trek fans made fun of Star Wars my entire life.

Few and between any Black people or people of color beyond Lando in the OT. The one Asian guy immediately kamikazes a Star Destroyer.

In the prequels Mace Windu and Jango (including clones) is about it, we see aliens played by non white actors but they're aliens.

I went to middle, junior high, and high school and was one of five white kids in my entire school. I hanged out with the nerdy Black and Latinx kids. The above criticisms were frequently brought up from my fellow Star Wars fans and not because they had issue rooting for white characters.

Its because the story involved a battle for the galaxy involving so many people but it's primarily a battle waged by white people. They felt like they had no place in it unless they were the one Black friend.

43 minutes ago, FTS Gecko said:

I must have missed the Emon reference - when did that happen?

There wasn't one.

Dryden's chief thug was an alien called Aemon or something like that.

It has nothing to do with the human Emon Azzameen from X-Wing Alliance. Their names aren't even pronounced the same.

1 hour ago, Forresto said:

There is one benefit to Maul's appearence.

Lucasfilm may no longer be afraid of implementing elements of the Expanded Universe into  the films.

It means Thrawn is suddenly on the table for a live     action appearence.

Why would Maul and Thrawn not be viable for films? Rebels isn't the Expanded Universe, and they've both been there.

I loved it.

• It was, above all, a decent'heist movie' that happened to be set in a Galaxy far, far away, not a 'star wars movie'.
• Despite that, the number of nods to odd bits of star wars trivia if you recognised them were immense, but only a few were lampshaded to a "hey stupid! look, we've put this thing in!" level. Some of my favourites:
  • Teras Kasi. Seriously? That's awesome. I mean, why not? "What the heck was that?" is a perfectly reasonable question from han, who thinks he knows what she's capable of.
    • Also, it wasn't even just Teras Kasi; it was even that bloody move (back/forwards/X/X/Up) - the flip/throw/heel kick thing that essentially made the game impossible because you couldn't block it unless you were Yoda (who's so short you can't hit him with it...)
  • "Didn't you kill Aurra Sing?" "I'm pretty sure the fall killed her."
  • The Pyke syndicate
  • Benthic (one of them, anyway) in the back of Nest's crew
• The Droid rebellion was quite funny. I kind of want to check if R2 and 3PO (or at least droids that could be them) are anywhere in the back of shot (did they end up on Kessel in any of the Droids episodes?) - if not, did we get the first star wars film without them in?
• Given the time difference (5-10 years pre new hope vs "the week before", an L3/K2 meeting seem unlikely, but I did like L3. I'm waiting for "I CAUSED A DISTRACTION!" in our weekly RPG group.....

2 hours ago, Forresto said:

There is one benefit to Maul's appearence.

Lucasfilm may no longer be afraid of implementing elements of the Expanded Universe into  the films.

It means Thrawn is suddenly on the table for a live     action appearence.

You could argue she denigrated the heck out of Luke and Han and guys in a New Hope.

"Aren't you a little short to be a Stormtrooper" is one.

A jab at a person personally is not attacking the entire sex as a whole, as the person I was quoting eluded to.

53 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

Why would Maul and Thrawn not be viable for films? Rebels isn't the Expanded Universe, and they've both been there.

Rebels is totally EU. 99 percent of people going to see the movies have probably not seen Rebels.

Until now, unlike marvel, Star Wars has kept it's cameos and major references mainstream.

Tarkin, Vader for instance.

If you're watching only the films this is the first time you know Maul is alive. Last time you saw him he was cut in half and very much dead given he never shows back up or is ever referenced.

So this is the first time Star Wars films have ventured into obviously introducing something that only makes sense in the new canon EU.

2 hours ago, eMeM said:

Sadly both sides have very short memories.

I don't think the alt right backlash would be so strong if people in charge of new Star Wars didn't pretend that they are the pioneers of diversity in media, disrespecting George Lucas, Carrie Fisher, Natalie Portman, Billy D. Williams, Temuera Morrison, Caroline Blakiston, Samuel L. Jackson and many many others.

The difference is that when prequels were coming out it was just natural, today the media and politicians are working hard to radicalize us and put as at each others throats, creating outrage culture and exploiting it for clickbait money and votes.

What is particuraily annoying is that in many places when you criticise new movies for valid reasons you are called sexist and racist because the creators and the most combatant fans are using the actions of a vocal minority to label you and shield themselves from any inconvenient points.

I do agree with is hate for TLJ. The whole Finn and Rose “rich people are bad” arc was nakedly pointed.

2 hours ago, GuacCousteau said:

There wasn't one.

Dryden's chief thug was an alien called Aemon or something like that.

It has nothing to do with the human Emon Azzameen from X-Wing Alliance. Their names aren't even pronounced the same.

I would disagree.

26 minutes ago, Pooleman said:

I do agree with is hate for TLJ. The whole Finn and Rose “rich people are bad” arc was nakedly pointed.

That wasn't the arc though. The arc was presenting that there are people that profiteer from war by playing both sides. That's not really a new concept in film or even actual recent events. I mean that is basically the plot of Iron Man 1, Stark Industries is the main contractor for the US but is also supplying terrorist groups.

17 minutes ago, The Penguin UK said:

I would disagree.

Disagree about what? And why?

33 minutes ago, ScottieATF said:

That wasn't the arc though. The arc was presenting that there are people that profiteer from war by playing both sides.

Which was compeltely pointless, inconsequential, and will never be brought up again.

Unless it is why Rose decided to kill the Resistance, she realised that by fighting this war they are making bad people rich, so they should stop resisting and let Kylo win.

12 hours ago, xanderf said:

That said, we don't exactly get many pilots for it - Beckett and Qi'Ra clearly (and specifically indicated in dialog) don't know how to fly at all. So...Han, Chewie, Lando, and L3-37 seem to be the only pilots for it.

Which...isn’t really a problem. Most of the people asking for a scum falcon are wanting scum versions of those characters, not random other pilots. And they could give us Qira as a crew card and Beckett as a gunner. Not to mention plenty of other crew card options scattered throughout the rest of the movie. I’m more upset that in an entire scum themed movie we didn’t get ANY other scum ships...

1 hour ago, Pooleman said:

I do agree with is hate for TLJ. The whole Finn and Rose “rich people are bad” arc was nakedly pointed.

It wasn’t “rich people” are bad. It was “war profiteers”. I would have been much happier without the entire arc (just because it was almost all completely unnecessary to the rest of the movie), but it wasn’t just making out all rich people to be evil.

25 minutes ago, VanderLegion said:

Which...isn’t really a problem. Most of the people asking for a scum falcon are wanting scum versions of those characters, not random other pilots. And they could give us Qira as a crew card and Beckett as a gunner. Not to mention plenty of other crew card options scattered throughout the rest of the movie. I’m more upset that in an entire scum themed movie we didn’t get ANY other scum ships...

It wasn’t “rich people” are bad. It was “war profiteers”. I would have been much happier without the entire arc (just because it was almost all completely unnecessary to the rest of the movie), but it wasn’t just making out all rich people to be evil.

I don't think this is right. I think that the point of the Finn/Rose side mission, that so many people like to claim is "pointless" and "stupid" is pretty clear. Yoda even says it while talking to Luke. "Failure is our greatest teacher." The Last Jedi is very clearly about failure. Poe fails to listen to Leia and as a direct result the Resistance loses all of its bombers. Holdo fails to see past Poe's arrogance and keeps the plan from him. Finn and Rose fail to carry out their mission and it costs the lives of a whole lot of Resistance on the escape shuttles, and nearly their own lives. Snoke fails to correctly interpret Kylo's intention and it costs him his life. Luke failed to save Kylo. I could keep going, but I think that's probably more than enough examples. The Last Jedi isn't a bad movie because a bunch of people made bad choices and failed at stuff. It's literally a movie ABOUT failure, and how we learn and grow from it. It's pretty **** heavy handed about it, too.

1 hour ago, Forresto said:

Rebels is totally EU. 99 percent of people going to see the movies have probably not seen Rebels.

Until now, unlike marvel, Star Wars has kept it's cameos and major references mainstream.

Tarkin, Vader for instance.

If you're watching only the films this is the first time you know Maul is alive. Last time you saw him he was cut in half and very much dead given he never shows back up or is ever referenced.

So this is the first time Star Wars films have ventured into obviously introducing something that only makes sense in the new canon EU.

To the best of my understanding, EU refers to the pre-Disney EU.

Rebels, Clone Wars, and all the movies are just... canon.

1 hour ago, Forresto said:

Rebels is totally EU. 99 percent of people going to see the movies have probably not seen Rebels.

Until now, unlike marvel, Star Wars has kept it's cameos and major references mainstream.

Tarkin, Vader for instance.

If you're watching only the films this is the first time you know Maul is alive. Last time you saw him he was cut in half and very much dead given he never shows back up or is ever referenced.

So this is the first time Star Wars films have ventured into obviously introducing something that only makes sense in the new canon EU.

Really, because the Marvel movies seem hellbent on ignoring the TV shows...

Was anyone esle watching to see what new x-wings were gonna pop up? Lol. We goy that new tie and the old falcon. Any others i missed?

Also, i freaking loved this movie. Kudos to the creators.

XWing TMG was on my mind as I went into the theater, but I enjoyed myself so much, I stopped thinking of it.

1 hour ago, eMeM said:

Which was compeltely pointless, inconsequential, and will never be brought up again.

That could very well be since I think they splintered into too many storylines with that, but where they go really remains to be seen. But still even excepting that it goes nowhere saying it was a "rich people are evil" message is reductive.

Also they aren't necessarily supplying the Resistance, but could have just been defense contractors for the Republic military.

2 hours ago, Forresto said:

Rebels is totally EU. 99 percent of people going to see the movies have probably not seen Rebels.

Until now, unlike marvel, Star Wars has kept it's cameos and major references mainstream.

Tarkin, Vader for instance.

If you're watching only the films this is the first time you know Maul is alive. Last time you saw him he was cut in half and very much dead given he never shows back up or is ever referenced.

So this is the first time Star Wars films have ventured into obviously introducing something that only makes sense in the new canon EU.

Did you not watch Rogue One?

Saw Guerra is a character the originated in the Clone Wars cartoon. And there are multiple references and event an appearance of the Ghost and its captain.

1 hour ago, pkreynolds said:

I don't think this is right. I think that the point of the Finn/Rose side mission, that so many people like to claim is "pointless" and "stupid" is pretty clear. Yoda even says it while talking to Luke. "Failure is our greatest teacher." The Last Jedi is very clearly about failure. Poe fails to listen to Leia and as a direct result the Resistance loses all of its bombers. Holdo fails to see past Poe's arrogance and keeps the plan from him. Finn and Rose fail to carry out their mission and it costs the lives of a whole lot of Resistance on the escape shuttles, and nearly their own lives. Snoke fails to correctly interpret Kylo's intention and it costs him his life. Luke failed to save Kylo. I could keep going, but I think that's probably more than enough examples. The Last Jedi isn't a bad movie because a bunch of people made bad choices and failed at stuff. It's literally a movie ABOUT failure, and how we learn and grow from it. It's pretty **** heavy handed about it, too.

I applaud Rian Johnson for the excellent, and rarely seen meta element of taking this way beyond the movie and into the real life - this revolutionary and highly intellectual theme, which you have to watch Richard and Mortimer to understand, is continued when Rian fails to create a logical flow of events, fails to make characters believable, fails to retain traits that define characters instead of making them do stupid things they wouldn't have done if they didn't have to fail, fails to write a script between all the plotholes, fails at building tension and dosing humour, Lucasfilm employees fail to remain civil and take criticism with dignity, Disney fails to contain Mark Hamill and the greatest failure of them all, fans fail to understand that having a hamfisted theme doesn't make the movie any better.

1 hour ago, thespaceinvader said:

To the best of my understanding, EU refers to the pre-Disney EU.

Rebels, Clone Wars, and all the movies are just... canon.

Yup. Indeed, there is no longer any "EU". That was a concept that applied in the pre-Disney era to the different 'levels' of canon.

Post-Disney, there is 'Canon' and there is 'Legends', and that's it. The Clone Wars CGI series, all the movies, Rebels, and the novels starting with 'A New Dawn', are 'canon'. Everything else is 'Legends'.

55 minutes ago, xanderf said:

Everything else is 'Legends'.

...until it becomes canon.