19 hours ago, DXCrazytrain said:

So why do we have to wait for wave 2 for FO and Resistance? Most Wanted started scum with only 4 ships.

Was there an answer to this that I missed?

The cynical answer I keep coming back to is that they want FO and Resistance players to also buy one of the 3 conversion kits so they have something to play until wave 2.

Full confession, I'm just being whiny and grumpy because I have to wait and I'm about as patient as the Emperor is forgiving.

Oh great and powerful Supreme Leader.... Please withhold your great and fearsome hand of justice!

I submit to thee, my Malevolence, that our troops can purchase aftermarket craft and additional interceptors for reasonable prices from the hutts, and our position will be secure until the full might of your glorious industrial infastructure can be restored.

I'm gonna go along with the crowd saying they're holding off to pump out a new ship for Resistance and First Order. In all honesty, I feel like FFG could've opened up more design space by making what we know as the Resistance as a hybrid faction of New Republic/Resistance since the NR had more advanced fighters (T-85 X-Wings that we know of, so maybe they have more fighters we don't know about?) and we know the Resistance was thrown together using hand-me-downs and older, obsolete tech.

13 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

I'm irked not knowing how long it'll be until the Resistance/FO stuff is out. Now, I'm only mildly irked for the time being, since I don't know timelines. It didn't take long for new Legion content to come out after the initial release, I understand. I might be wrong, and mistaking things I've seen on the FFG main page. If it's like 2E in September, but a month and a half later we've got FO/Res, I'll be ok. If I have to wait until 2019 for Poe and TIE Silencers, I'll be pissed to all get out.

And I see @GILLIES291 is on their BS again about how TLJ has driven everyone away from X-Wing... They've even previously started at least two threads about it. I mean, some folks just don't want to understand reality.

Wow easy there bitterfig no reason to get all bitter. Scale back the hate a bit. I have actually never said anything about the new factions or movie only that I would like to see Clone Wars factions so you can stop making up things too if you'd like. I actually liked TLJ, and the prequels and the Star Wars shows. Even looking forward to Solo. Same team bro! I'm just pointing out what I've seen from personal experience.

I come from an area where we have a group of at least a few dozen gamers and tons of Star Wars fans. We always go get tickets and watch the pre-release midnight showing of every Star Wars movie.

After the Last Jedi I was surprised to find out that more than half of the group absolutely hated the movie. I'm not going to go into all their reasons but some I understand namely Luke dying randomly, First Order being a joke outside of Kylo Ren, space horses on casino planet, space Mary popping, and to them generally uninteresting characters. I thought it may have just been my friends but just go look at the "vocal minority" on Facebook, Star Wars forums like this or the 41% user rating on rotten tomatoes which is worse than the prequels everyone claims to hate.

My only point here is that apparently FFG/Disney are avoiding the Prequels era because it was "unpopular" (despite there being a massive new generation fan base for it, myself included) and that's why they haven't made it for any of their games (aside from the randomness of destiny). And I suggested they are partially doing the same for the sequels. I'll break it down for you a bit more:

All Star Wars Fans like the OT

Some Star Wars fans hate the Prequels and/or the Sequels. So if you want to make the most money you play it safe and just make OT content.

22 minutes ago, GILLIES291 said:

Wow easy there bitterfig no reason to get all bitter. Scale back the hate a bit.

Entirely my bad. Mistook you for someone else.

I have nothing but apologies.

39 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Entirely my bad. Mistook you for someone else.

I have nothing but apologies.

....and figs.

15 hours ago, Sekac said:

Unpopularity?

Tell that to the $3 BILLION dollars that TFA and TLJ have grossed in the box office and the 83% average score on metacritic.

It's totally fine if people don't like the movies, but at least understand how the movies are actually viewed, not just how a very vocal minority feel about them.

So, why, pray tell, do you believe that you are an arbiter to "how the movies are actually viewed?" The initial claim was that the movie was unpopular. There are several ways we could measure that.

We might try and assess a movie's quality by looking at how much money it's made. But the number of tickets a movie sells is not really a great measure of how people felt about a movie. Namely because people buy tickets before they actually see the film, and these "Too Big to Fail" franchises (Marvel, Star Wars, Transformers, DC, etc.) keep making profitable movies, even though they are routinely panned by critics and fans (e.g. see Transformers or DC). A big name film with a lot of hype is going to make money, even if it is terrible. For what it's worth, when you have a saga of films (e.g. the New Trilogy) you'll probably have a better sense of how Episode VIII was received by looking at Box Office numbers of Episode IX, just like people's receptions of Episode VII probably drove their interest in seeing Episode VIII when/if they did. Finally, it's probably worth noting that The Last Jedi underperformed in the Box Office nonetheless. It had an opening weekend $27 million behind the TFA, and it's total theater gross was almost $340 Million behind TFA.

We might also try to assess how popular a film was with its fans by looking at what professional film critics say about. That being said, the average fans and film critics are usually using a very different set of metrics to evaluate a film. A critic might find enjoyment in a film qua film without at all appreciating the source content or built-world of that film (e.g. a film critic might love the Dragon Ball Z live action movie as a film, even though it has almost nothing at all to do with the source material: DBZ, which sorely disappointed fans). Secondly, film critics are professionals, and it's not unreasonable to think that giant film conglomerates like Disney (Marvel, Disney, Pixar, Star Wars, and now FOX) have a undue influence on the reviews of critics. Disney has a huge interest in making sure their multi-billion-dollar multi-platform multi-media properties are well received, since so much is at stake beyond ticket sales (clothing, toys, books, etc.). Do film critics really want to get blacklisted from the most powerful film-maker in the industry who is routinely releasing 3-8 of the Top 10 movies annually? For an instance of Disney 'black-listing' critics, for instance, see here: http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2017/11/07/disney_is_blacklisting_los_angeles_times_critics.html
So critics can also be biased (or have conflicts of interest).

So, that pretty much leaves what the people themselves think about a film as the best metric to check when asking "what did people think about this film?" There's no idea or easy way to measure this, but one such way is to see what the largest movie review site has in their data about "audience scores." Looking at the industry standard, Rotten Tomatoes, it is pretty clear that THE LAST JEDI was the least well received Star Wars film, and is in fact the only Star Wars film where more of the audience reviews were negative instead of positive (only 46% of audience scores were positive, vs the next worst film Attack of the Clones which was still 57% positive (11% more than TLJ). People have complained about "vocal minorities" skewing the measures, but there have only been 190,000 ratings of TLJ, roughly the same as TFA's 225,000 ratings, and yet TLJ has a score only half as good as TFA's own 88%. If there's been a concerted effort to overly inflate the negative reception of TLJ with sock-puppet accounts or other forms of spamming, it is simply not here. ****, RotS has an odd and perplexing 33,000,000 ratings and it's still sitting at a generally positive 65%.

Phantom Menace: 59% audience score (over 1,200,000 ratings)
Attack of the Clones: 57% audience score (over 850,000 ratings)
Revenge of the Sith: 65% audience score (over 33,000,000 ratings)
A New Hope: 94% audience score (over 1,000,000 ratings)
Empire Strikes Back: 97% audience score (over 1,000,000 ratings)
Return of the Jedi: 94% (over 1,000,000 ratings)
The Force Awakens: 88% audience score (over 225,000 ratings)
Rogue One: 87% audience score (over 99,000 ratings)
The Last Jedi: 46% audience score (over 190,000 ratings)



If actual numbers aren't your think, there is also anecdotal evidence. If you look at the tone of YouTube videos, comments, fan reviews, and discussions with one's own Star Wars seeing peers, it sure seems to be me like TLJ has been received substantially more poorly than any other Star Wars film in my life time. And that's saying something... because I've been around for all of them.


I'm not saying any individual fan should or shouldn't like TLJ, as that is absolutely a subjective preference and to each their own. But I cannot understand how some TLJ proponents act as if the controversial reception of TLJ is just the result of some insignificant and very vocal minority that is radically skewing the debate. No, I think all the data suggests that it's pretty safe to say that a substantial proportion of Star Wars fans felt underwhelmed or unhappy with TLJ.

Wha, oh.

The salt is getting real, people.

Poor First Order and Resistance aint feeling the love.

I think we should deploy our fighters and prove 'em wrong on the tabletops.

29 minutes ago, AllWingsStandyingBy said:

So, why, pray tell, do you believe that you are an arbiter to "how the movies are actually viewed?" The initial claim was that the movie was unpopular. There are several ways we could measure that.

We might try and assess a movie's quality by looking at how much money it's made. But the number of tickets a movie sells is not really a great measure of how people felt about a movie. Namely because people buy tickets before they actually see the film, and these "Too Big to Fail" franchises (Marvel, Star Wars, Transformers, DC, etc.) keep making profitable movies, even though they are routinely panned by critics and fans (e.g. see Transformers or DC). A big name film with a lot of hype is going to make money, even if it is terrible. For what it's worth, when you have a saga of films (e.g. the New Trilogy) you'll probably have a better sense of how Episode VIII was received by looking at Box Office numbers of Episode IX, just like people's receptions of Episode VII probably drove their interest in seeing Episode VIII when/if they did. Finally, it's probably worth noting that The Last Jedi underperformed in the Box Office nonetheless. It had an opening weekend $27 million behind the TFA, and it's total theater gross was almost $340 Million behind TFA.

We might also try to assess how popular a film was with its fans by looking at what professional film critics say about. That being said, the average fans and film critics are usually using a very different set of metrics to evaluate a film. A critic might find enjoyment in a film qua film without at all appreciating the source content or built-world of that film (e.g. a film critic might love the Dragon Ball Z live action movie as a film, even though it has almost nothing at all to do with the source material: DBZ, which sorely disappointed fans). Secondly, film critics are professionals, and it's not unreasonable to think that giant film conglomerates like Disney (Marvel, Disney, Pixar, Star Wars, and now FOX) have a undue influence on the reviews of critics. Disney has a huge interest in making sure their multi-billion-dollar multi-platform multi-media properties are well received, since so much is at stake beyond ticket sales (clothing, toys, books, etc.). Do film critics really want to get blacklisted from the most powerful film-maker in the industry who is routinely releasing 3-8 of the Top 10 movies annually? For an instance of Disney 'black-listing' critics, for instance, see here: http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2017/11/07/disney_is_blacklisting_los_angeles_times_critics.html
So critics can also be biased (or have conflicts of interest).

So, that pretty much leaves what the people themselves think about a film as the best metric to check when asking "what did people think about this film?" There's no idea or easy way to measure this, but one such way is to see what the largest movie review site has in their data about "audience scores." Looking at the industry standard, Rotten Tomatoes, it is pretty clear that THE LAST JEDI was the least well received Star Wars film, and is in fact the only Star Wars film where more of the audience reviews were negative instead of positive (only 46% of audience scores were positive, vs the next worst film Attack of the Clones which was still 57% positive (11% more than TLJ). People have complained about "vocal minorities" skewing the measures, but there have only been 190,000 ratings of TLJ, roughly the same as TFA's 225,000 ratings, and yet TLJ has a score only half as good as TFA's own 88%. If there's been a concerted effort to overly inflate the negative reception of TLJ with sock-puppet accounts or other forms of spamming, it is simply not here. ****, RotS has an odd and perplexing 33,000,000 ratings and it's still sitting at a generally positive 65%.

Phantom Menace: 59% audience score (over 1,200,000 ratings)
Attack of the Clones: 57% audience score (over 850,000 ratings)
Revenge of the Sith: 65% audience score (over 33,000,000 ratings)
A New Hope: 94% audience score (over 1,000,000 ratings)
Empire Strikes Back: 97% audience score (over 1,000,000 ratings)
Return of the Jedi: 94% (over 1,000,000 ratings)
The Force Awakens: 88% audience score (over 225,000 ratings)
Rogue One: 87% audience score (over 99,000 ratings)
The Last Jedi: 46% audience score (over 190,000 ratings)



If actual numbers aren't your think, there is also anecdotal evidence. If you look at the tone of YouTube videos, comments, fan reviews, and discussions with one's own Star Wars seeing peers, it sure seems to be me like TLJ has been received substantially more poorly than any other Star Wars film in my life time. And that's saying something... because I've been around for all of them.


I'm not saying any individual fan should or shouldn't like TLJ, as that is absolutely a subjective preference and to each their own. But I cannot understand how some TLJ proponents act as if the controversial reception of TLJ is just the result of some insignificant and very vocal minority that is radically skewing the debate. No, I think all the data suggests that it's pretty safe to say that a substantial proportion of Star Wars fans felt underwhelmed or unhappy with TLJ.

And what about Blu-Ray sales? Like I said earlier, people that buy a Blu-Ray has generally already seen the movie so they know what they are buying into. Generally speaking, they buy a Blu Ray because they liked the movie.

According to this site http://www.blu-ray.com/ , it is currently (2 months after its release) in the third position in the current Top 10 Sellers, right after Black Panther and Black Panther 4K. It sounds to me like it is a popular Blu-Ray.

The question is not about if a substantial proportion of Star Wars fans felt underwhelmed or unhappy, it's about the movie popularity. That's what Sekac was replying to. And like it or not, it is popular. I don't personnally like Justin Beiber, just like pretty much all my friends, but it doesn't mean that he's not popular.

5 minutes ago, Red Castle said:

And what about Blu-Ray sales?

18 minutes ago, Red Castle said:

And what about Blu-Ray sales? Like I said earlier, people that buy a Blu-Ray has generally already seen the movie so they know what they are buying into. Generally speaking, they buy a Blu Ray because they liked the movie.

According to this site http://www.blu-ray.com/ , it is currently (2 months after its release) in the third position in the current Top 10 Sellers, right after Black Panther and Black Panther 4K. It sounds to me like it is a popular Blu-Ray.

The question is not about if a substantial proportion of Star Wars fans felt underwhelmed or unhappy, it's about the movie popularity. That's what Sekac was replying to. And like it or not, it is popular. I don't personnally like Justin Beiber, just like pretty much all my friends, but it doesn't mean that he's not popular.

If the claim was ONLY "Star Wars is popular, and even bad Star Wars outsells lots of other stuff" then of course we would all agree. It's why you see forty-seven end caps with plastic Star Wars junk on it at every store, but not not a single end cap with stuff from Wes Anderon's "Isle of Dogs" or any coffee mugs with Paddington Bear 2 on them.


But that's not at all interesting, we know that Star Wars is more popular than just about any other film or film franchise out there, which is also why Disney was willing to spend Billions in acquiring it and why the production budget for Star Wars movies is a **** of a lot higher than it would be for some one-off non-franchised film. If Episode 9 was just Jar-Jar Binks screaming at Porgs for two hours, we'd still all know that'd sell more tickets and Blue Rays than Shape of Water. But that's not how the initial claim was made: the obvious intention of the initial claim was saying that, relative to other Star Wars, TLJ was unpopular. The question is, was TLJ as popular as we'd expect a Star Wars film to be?


And by those standards, yes, TLJ is far less popular than it could have been:

1st Week Blu Ray Sales of TFA = 1,250,000
1st Week Blu Ray Sales of TLJ = 375,000

Or, it put differently, it appears that TLJ Blu Ray sales are about 33% of those of TFA, at least with the limited snippet we have right now. Which may be about right and may hold steady, since the audience reception of TFA was about twice as high as that of TLJ.

1 hour ago, AllWingsStandyingBy said:

So, why, pray tell, do you believe that you are an arbiter to "how the movies are actually viewed?"

He's no Arbiter. He's still loyal to the Covenant of aliens who watch movies with their heads facing forwards. Although, personally, I like to view movies while having upside down with a bowl of ice cream in my hands and nose plug in case I sneeze.

17 hours ago, Icelom said:

Agreed.

I love star wars I loved the originals and I very much enjoyed the new movies (will change to loved them over time).

Some people just hate them because they are not the originals that they have idolized and put up on a pedestal with the power of time to forget the flaws of those movies. If you think the original movies are perfection in cinema you are flat out wrong.

Yes. The new movies are HARDLY unpopular. Seems like the guy who said it is just someone who didn't like them and wants to project on to everybody else.

At first I rolled my eyes at this tangent, but you know what - I'm jumping in!

My wife didn't get to see The Last Jedi in theaters. I loved it, but after hearing all the whining, I began to think I was wrong. I started remembering all the things I didn't like, and the things others said they hate about it. Well, I got the blu-ray for my birthday, so my wife and I sat down and watched it together. I had totally forgotten how much I loved that movie! The Last Jedi is really good! And not just as a fun summer (er..winter) action flick (throne room scene! Holdo maneuver! Luke Force apparition!), but it had some great messages, like 1) Sometimes you don't need to have all the details to be obedient (looking at you Poe), and 2) that failures are part of each of us, and we can't let that ruin our lives (thank you, Yoda!).

Yeah, The Last Jedi is an awesome movie!

1 minute ago, Parakitor said:

At first I rolled my eyes at this tangent, but you know what - I'm jumping in!

My wife didn't get to see The Last Jedi in theaters. I loved it, but after hearing all the whining, I began to think I was wrong. I started remembering all the things I didn't like, and the things others said they hate about it. Well, I got the blu-ray for my birthday, so my wife and I sat down and watched it together. I had totally forgotten how much I loved that movie! The Last Jedi is really good! And not just as a fun summer (er..winter) action flick (throne room scene! Holdo maneuver! Luke Force apparition!), but it had some great messages, like 1) Sometimes you don't need to have all the details to be obedient (looking at you Poe), and 2) that failures are part of each of us, and we can't let that ruin our lives (thank you, Yoda!).

Yeah, The Last Jedi is an awesome movie!

2

Ya that throne room scene was really **** good. In fact the whole ray, kylo, luke stuff was amazing.

3 minutes ago, Parakitor said:

Holdo maneuver!

Was awesome.

Leia force floating back into the ship... not so much.

3 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

Entirely my bad. Mistook you for someone else.

I have nothing but apologies.

We're cool bro!

20 hours ago, Icelom said:

Um for legion do you mean a single release of 1 commander and one infantry unit since launch?

March 22nd release we are now may 22nd and have had a single infantry and commander released... I need to know what extra cool products you have gotten every one or two weeks?

March: Core Set + Wave 1

April: Veers, Snowtroopers were likely meant to be released at the same time but got pushed back to early May for some reason.

May: Leia + Rebel Fleet Troopers

Thats a good release or two a month, a fair bit more aggressive than anything seen in X-wing, let alone Armada. And we still have a prospective releases of:

June: Priority supplies (new objectives) + more barricades

July: Han + Rebel Commandos

August: Boba + Scout Troopers

17 hours ago, Icelom said:

Agreed.

I love star wars I loved the originals and I very much enjoyed the new movies (will change to loved them over time).

Some people just hate them because they are not the originals that they have idolized and put up on a pedestal with the power of time to forget the flaws of those movies. If you think the original movies are perfection in cinema you are flat out wrong.

I think divisive is probably the best word. I just really don't like they handled the classic characters, mostly because I have something to judge it against with the old EU, and that the setting is not as interesting as it could have been. I blame that on mostly them wanting to make 'safe' new films, nostalgia bating, and rushing to get product out there rather than working out a plot outline for the trilogy which has left TLJ not feeling anything at all like a middle chapter. They could have played it up with the New Republic and Empire working together to defeat a common/new foe, have a whole having to get over past grudges to work together and move forward sort of message to it all. Still, I'm looking forward to seeing how FFG reworks the models from the films and their pilots know that they have actual knowledge of the ships rather than concept art. I imagine that the bomber will get a new sculpt and I have to wonder if we might not see it getting a blue paintjob to help the Resistance faction stand out from the usual red scheme used on Rebel ships.

14 hours ago, Herowannabe said:

@Captain Lackwit beat me to it. I bet they plan on including some new stuff that ties into the Resistance TV show (which comes out this fall doesn't it?) but can't announce it yet because of non-disclosure agreements with the Mouse. Otherwise, they would just do like they have done in the past (with other games) and announce wave 1 and wave 2 at the same time, but with different release dates.

Either that or its some lame reason like the graphic designers have been too busy and haven't finalized the designs for the FO and Resistance conversion boxes yet, so they don't actually have any pictures of product to show off yet.

I'm looking forward to what they show off in Resistance, though I sort of hope they don't release anything for it right away in X-wing, we don't need more Blue Ace pilots or odd ships that don't really feel like their film/television counterparts. I think the main reason we haven't heard about it is that they don't want to drum up all the hype for that when they are trying to play up Wave 1. Same reason I sort of doubt we will see much in the way of Armada news until 2.0 drops. I would expect to see something about wave 2 at Gencon, though I'd be happy to be proven wrong and we get news sooner.

2 hours ago, AllWingsStandyingBy said:

So, why, pray tell, do you believe that you are an arbiter to "how the movies are actually viewed?" The initial claim was that the movie was unpopular. There are several ways we could measure that.

We might try and assess a movie's quality by looking at how much money it's made. But the number of tickets a movie sells is not really a great measure of how people felt about a movie. Namely because people buy tickets before they actually see the film, and these "Too Big to Fail" franchises (Marvel, Star Wars, Transformers, DC, etc.) keep making profitable movies, even though they are routinely panned by critics and fans (e.g. see Transformers or DC). A big name film with a lot of hype is going to make money, even if it is terrible. For what it's worth, when you have a saga of films (e.g. the New Trilogy) you'll probably have a better sense of how Episode VIII was received by looking at Box Office numbers of Episode IX, just like people's receptions of Episode VII probably drove their interest in seeing Episode VIII when/if they did. Finally, it's probably worth noting that The Last Jedi underperformed in the Box Office nonetheless. It had an opening weekend $27 million behind the TFA, and it's total theater gross was almost $340 Million behind TFA.

We might also try to assess how popular a film was with its fans by looking at what professional film critics say about. That being said, the average fans and film critics are usually using a very different set of metrics to evaluate a film. A critic might find enjoyment in a film qua film without at all appreciating the source content or built-world of that film (e.g. a film critic might love the Dragon Ball Z live action movie as a film, even though it has almost nothing at all to do with the source material: DBZ, which sorely disappointed fans). Secondly, film critics are professionals, and it's not unreasonable to think that giant film conglomerates like Disney (Marvel, Disney, Pixar, Star Wars, and now FOX) have a undue influence on the reviews of critics. Disney has a huge interest in making sure their multi-billion-dollar multi-platform multi-media properties are well received, since so much is at stake beyond ticket sales (clothing, toys, books, etc.). Do film critics really want to get blacklisted from the most powerful film-maker in the industry who is routinely releasing 3-8 of the Top 10 movies annually? For an instance of Disney 'black-listing' critics, for instance, see here: http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2017/11/07/disney_is_blacklisting_los_angeles_times_critics.html
So critics can also be biased (or have conflicts of interest).

So, that pretty much leaves what the people themselves think about a film as the best metric to check when asking "what did people think about this film?" There's no idea or easy way to measure this, but one such way is to see what the largest movie review site has in their data about "audience scores." Looking at the industry standard, Rotten Tomatoes, it is pretty clear that THE LAST JEDI was the least well received Star Wars film, and is in fact the only Star Wars film where more of the audience reviews were negative instead of positive (only 46% of audience scores were positive, vs the next worst film Attack of the Clones which was still 57% positive (11% more than TLJ). People have complained about "vocal minorities" skewing the measures, but there have only been 190,000 ratings of TLJ, roughly the same as TFA's 225,000 ratings, and yet TLJ has a score only half as good as TFA's own 88%. If there's been a concerted effort to overly inflate the negative reception of TLJ with sock-puppet accounts or other forms of spamming, it is simply not here. ****, RotS has an odd and perplexing 33,000,000 ratings and it's still sitting at a generally positive 65%.

Phantom Menace: 59% audience score (over 1,200,000 ratings)
Attack of the Clones: 57% audience score (over 850,000 ratings)
Revenge of the Sith: 65% audience score (over 33,000,000 ratings)
A New Hope: 94% audience score (over 1,000,000 ratings)
Empire Strikes Back: 97% audience score (over 1,000,000 ratings)
Return of the Jedi: 94% (over 1,000,000 ratings)
The Force Awakens: 88% audience score (over 225,000 ratings)
Rogue One: 87% audience score (over 99,000 ratings)
The Last Jedi: 46% audience score (over 190,000 ratings)



If actual numbers aren't your think, there is also anecdotal evidence. If you look at the tone of YouTube videos, comments, fan reviews, and discussions with one's own Star Wars seeing peers, it sure seems to be me like TLJ has been received substantially more poorly than any other Star Wars film in my life time. And that's saying something... because I've been around for all of them.


I'm not saying any individual fan should or shouldn't like TLJ, as that is absolutely a subjective preference and to each their own. But I cannot understand how some TLJ proponents act as if the controversial reception of TLJ is just the result of some insignificant and very vocal minority that is radically skewing the debate. No, I think all the data suggests that it's pretty safe to say that a substantial proportion of Star Wars fans felt underwhelmed or unhappy with TLJ.

So let me make sure i understand.

Your argument is there are 3 metrics we can look at 1) money made, 2) critic reviews, 3) user reviews.

And then you provide a reason why we should doubt metric 1, and a reason to doubt metric 2, so therefore 3, by process is elimination, is the most valuable.

That's not how it works.

User reviews should be discarded first due to bias. If you want to disregard critics because they might be biased, then you can't argue that the group that definitely is biased is somehow useful information.

Your "I was around for all of them" argument illustrates this perfectly. You're comparing public reception of a movie released before the internet to one after-- and even more importantly, in a time when it is fashionable to trash anything and everything online.

Your perceptions about how people received a movie 40 years ago and how they receive it show absolutely nothing except bias.

And again, of course the original movies were received better. They're classics for a reason. Expecting the new ones to be classic as well is ridiculous.

And none of that has anything to do with the new ones being popular, which they indisputably are.

As a follow up to my OP, when our interminable wait is finally over, what will we get? Will it just be conversion kits for the 2 new factions and maybe a new ship or 2 or do you think they will put out a Force Awakens style core set along side the conversion kits?

1 minute ago, DXCrazytrain said:

As a follow up to my OP, when our interminable wait is finally over, what will we get? Will it just be conversion kits for the 2 new factions and maybe a new ship or 2 or do you think they will put out a Force Awakens style core set along side the conversion kits?

I don't know, man.

Based on the determinations above, I think it's safe to say that there will be NO episode 9.

Ffg was just kidding with us and is actually planning on just removing Res. and FO from the game and hoping everyone forgets about the new non-trilogy as soon as possible.

3 minutes ago, Bucknife said:

I don't know, man.

Based on the determinations above, I think it's safe to say that there will be NO episode 9.

Ffg was just kidding with us and is actually planning on just removing Res. and FO from the game and hoping everyone forgets about the new non-trilogy as soon as possible.

I find your lack of faith disturbing.

3 minutes ago, DXCrazytrain said:

I find your lack of faith disturbing.

We all must band together under the banner of the classics, and march in a mob to ffg headquarters in a statement that only the first three Star Wars movies are relevant and legitimate for games or books or toys or anything.

We must stand up for our rights.

21 minutes ago, DXCrazytrain said:

As a follow up to my OP, when our interminable wait is finally over, what will we get? Will it just be conversion kits for the 2 new factions and maybe a new ship or 2 or do you think they will put out a Force Awakens style core set along side the conversion kits?

I will give you a serious answer.

From the sounds of it we’ll have a smaller-conversion kit for each of the new trilogy factions, priced less than the $50 kits for the other 3 factions.

And I think that’s all we know for sure right now.

33 minutes ago, DXCrazytrain said:

As a follow up to my OP, when our interminable wait is finally over, what will we get? Will it just be conversion kits for the 2 new factions and maybe a new ship or 2 or do you think they will put out a Force Awakens style core set along side the conversion kits?

I think it will be the two new kits, at least one new FO ship and at least one Resistance ship, the existing FO and Resistance ships in their new 2nd edition versions and maybe a couple of existing ships in their 2nd edition versions.

Names of new First Order ships:

TIE Murderer

TIE Masher

TIE Monster

TIE Motherlode