Hi guys! Might sound like a silly question, but... Do I have to roll the extra green die for being at R3? Or can I choose not to roll it?

I’ve been reading the rules and sometimes it says “may roll”, and sometimes just says “rolls”

thanx!

Per the Rules Reference...

RANGE COMBAT BONUS

When resolving a primary weapon attack, the attacker or defender may roll additional dice depending on the range of the attack. At Range 1, the attacker rolls one additional attack die during the “Roll Attack Dice” step. At Range 3, the defender rolls one additional defense die during the “Roll Defense Dice” step.

So it says you "may" add the bonus so you do not have to add it.

Thanx for the quick response! That paragraph is exactly what I was talking about. First it says “MAY ROLL additional dice”, but then it says “at R3, the defender ROLLS”, as if it was mandatory...

That’s why I’m confused...

Yeah, in the Attack entry, under step 4, Roll Defense Dice, it doesn't present the extra die as optional. Since that's the more detailed section, where it actually lays out the steps, I'd tend to err on the side of having to roll the extra die.

That's RAW. For RAI, I can't imagine that you're intended to be able to forgo the extra defense die, which exists to represent the extra difficulty for the attacker of making a shot at extreme range.

According to the FAQ (page 24), you have to roll attack or defense dice:

Quote

Q: During an attack, can the defender choose not to roll defense dice? Can the attacker choose not to roll attack dice?

A: No and no.

And as digitalbusker wrote, figuring out the correct number of dice you should be rolling doesn't seem optional.

13 minutes ago, Nspace said:

According to the FAQ (page 24), you have to roll attack or defense dice...

Although, it's not mandated that you perform an attack, even if you have an opportunity. You do have the option of NOT attacking, if you so choose... though "not attacking" is not the same as "not rolling attack dice". There's no such thing as pulling a punch in this game, when it comes to a straight attack roll... you either do it all, or none of it.

Ok. Thanks for the answers. I think rolling the correct number is mandatory. The question came in one game when my QD was on 1 hull, and was attacked by Fenn Rau at R3, who dealt exactly one damage. With Palp on my side, I wanted to roll my 2 agility dice, and see if I could get an evade on those two dice. If not, I would Palp the LWF die to evade the shot. The problem with LWF is that if you’re at R3 and your opponent rolls 3 attack dice, you don’t get the LWF die. So I wanted to know if it was correct to not roll the R3 extra die, and then use LWF...

Rolling the R3 extra die is mandatory. The 'may' in the quoted rule is only there to indicate that you don't get the bonus die all the time; it's not there to allow any choices. FFG could have used 'sometimes' instead.

The English language is not the simplest language.

5 hours ago, Gilarius said:

The English language is not the simplest language.

The biggest understatement in the history of understatements. This is why terms and conditions are so long.

So asked around and this is a typical omission of certain words that FFG is famous for. The way it is written... "may roll one extra..." means its optional. It should say... "may be able to roll one extra..."

We think the clear intention was you are supposed to roll the one extra die. I am sure there are combos in which you want to roll less, but to keep it simple.. roll the extra green.

51 minutes ago, GLEXOR said:

The biggest understatement in the history of understatements. This is why terms and conditions are so long.

As an aside, I helped a barrister with some of his paperwork. I asked him why legal documents were all printed in capital letters and without any punctuation of any kind.

Turns out that it's to deliberately be confusing so the actual laws depend on how lawyers interpret and argue the meanings of the written laws. Not good, in my opinion, but that explains so much about how courts and lawyers work. FFG is superb compared with anything official!

The "may roll" part is to indicate that it is an expansion of the standard rules. This is different from the "may" when it is representing an option where you could do this or that.

RANGE COMBAT BONUS

Sentence 1 - When resolving a primary weapon attack, the attacker or defender may roll additional dice depending on the range of the attack.

Sentence 2 - At Range 1, the attacker rolls one additional attack die during the “Roll Attack Dice” step.

Sentence 3 - At Range 3, the defender rolls one additional defense die during the “Roll Defense Dice” step.

----------------------------------

If you take the sentences on the rules individually you would missunderstanding.

A redaction whithout the general explanation may be more clear:

When resolving a primary weapon attack at Range 1, the attacker rolls one additional attack die during the “Roll Attack Dice” step.

When resolving a primary weapon attack at Range 3, the defender rolls one additional defense die during the “Roll Defense Dice” step.

But this is repetitive and boring ? . So FFG add the general sentence to make an interesting reading.

Sentence 1 is a general explanation of the rule. You cannot override the depending on the range statement because you leave the explanation incomplete, although is incomplete really.

Sentence 2 and 3 states clearly the range involved, who is affected and how many additional dices are rolled. These sentences are complementary to Sentence 1 and add specification. In these two sentences there are no may "clause", so no choice here.

You must roll the additional die.

25 minutes ago, Arachneo said:

RANGE COMBAT BONUS

Sentence 1 - When resolving a primary weapon attack, the attacker or defender may roll additional dice depending on the range of the attack.

Sentence 2 - At Range 1, the attacker rolls one additional attack die during the “Roll Attack Dice” step.

Sentence 3 - At Range 3, the defender rolls one additional defense die during the “Roll Defense Dice” step.

----------------------------------

If you take the sentences on the rules individually you would missunderstanding.

A redaction whithout the general explanation may be more clear:

When resolving a primary weapon attack at Range 1, the attacker rolls one additional attack die during the “Roll Attack Dice” step.

When resolving a primary weapon attack at Range 3, the defender rolls one additional defense die during the “Roll Defense Dice” step.

But this is repetitive and boring ? . So FFG add the general sentence to make an interesting reading.

Sentence 1 is a general explanation of the rule. You cannot override the depending on the range statement because you leave the explanation incomplete, although is incomplete really.

Sentence 2 and 3 states clearly the range involved, who is affected and how many additional dices are rolled. These sentences are complementary to Sentence 1 and add specification. In these two sentences there are no may "clause", so no choice here.

You must roll the additional die.

All this would be cleared up with Sentence 1 said "might" instead of "may." May is used by FFG is so many different instances that it causes too much confusion.