5 hours ago, RedHotDice said:

That would be great, but I doubt it. They will probably keep it online to ensure point costs are universal and does not depend on a user upgrading it

FFG have confirmed that the database is stored locally. You don't need an active connection to run the app, just to update it.

This is the current year. It is my feeling that part of the responsibilities of being a modern mature adult is never letting your phone run out of battery. Do others feel this way too? Possibly...

I guess I’m out of the loop. I have 0 issues with the app working like they describe. I am not someone who has to be glued to their phone but I am an IT guy so I literally don’t go anywhere without my phone, because I need it as the communication device that it is. In this world there are many grown adults who MUST carry a phone without being a slave to it. Ever seen a cop or fire fighter without a phone? How bout a doctor? It is not arrogance or self entitlement to assume many adults have and carry a phone.

That being said, who carries around their stuff without making lists at home first? Not being snarky I am genuinely curious. There is no way I’d lug around the components for this game in a random pool, there is way too much. Several ready lists sure but it takes a battlefoam suitcase plus a tackle box besides to cover all my bases. No way I’m carrying all that to a store.

Will the Quick Build cards be in the conversion kit? I heard that they weren't and they didn't show any in the unboxing. However, in the unboxing Alex said pretty clearly that there's no need to buy any of the 2.0 version of the ship packs unless you want the improved models.

My goodness, considering right now we believe there will be a pc version, offline access, and a way to print out what you need beforehand anyway, I really don’t understand why this keeps coming up. Does it require at some point to have access to a computer, yes. Go the library, make some lists, print them out. You don’t need a smartphone, you don’t need a tablet, and you don’t need a printer in your back pocket to play the game.

4 hours ago, Ken on Cape said:

Amish people are'nt getting them. Just saying.

I wish FFG would have just put the point values on the cards. I picture all of a sudden, some people's builds won't be legal anymore because of a whim from FFG to change point values and you have 10 minutes before a tourney starts and you have to re work your whole list.

Also, has FFG said if you need the cards for tourney's anymore? If you have the app can you run your whole squad on the app as you play? Keep track of dammage, missles, ect?

I'm willing to bet if they made an update that soon before a tournament (as long as it's not a major one) the TO would allow the list.

Hoping that they a) make any adjustments in advance of major tournaments and b) not over-use this flexibility. I'd say similar to the FAQ releases, just a few times a year if need be. Though soon after the release, I expect they will have to make a lot of quick adjustments once all of their thousands of playtester's (aka us) data gets compiled.

7 hours ago, RedHotDice said:

You dont have a smart phone? Who does not have a smartphone these day?

That would be me!

Honestly, I think both sides of this argument could use a little more thinking time. No, not everyone has a smartphone in this day and age and not everyone who doesn't have one is a crotchety technophobe. I thought about getting one a few years ago, but decided that the amount I would use it wouldn't justify the extra cost. That said, I'm almost always within a couple of steps from a laptop or other computer...

Having said that, I do understand the frustration with this ongoing topic. If you don't have a smartphone, then you just need to plan ahead a little more. It could be as simple as throwing in a pre-prepared list (or the quick build cards) with all the other stuff you need to play the game!

As others have said the App is for force construction ONLY, and not used during the actual game. Now FFG has said there could be tournaments where points/slots could change between the rounds, but I have a feeling that will be known ahead of time exactly how much the points shift. Really only ONE person will absolutely NEED to have the app open and with them during a tournament and thats the TO. Using it to double check lists that are suspected to be overpoints or so they can easily record half points for ships in games.

4 minutes ago, jwilliamson12 said:

I'm willing to bet if they made an update that soon before a tournament (as long as it's not a major one) the TO would allow the list.

Hoping that they a) make any adjustments in advance of major tournaments and b) not over-use this flexibility. I'd say similar to the FAQ releases, just a few times a year if need be. Though soon after the release, I expect they will have to make a lot of quick adjustments once all of their thousands of playtester's (aka us) data gets compiled.

If they are smart they will ear mark specific dates to adjust things as sweeping as costs. 3 times a year should be plenty. Just because they CAN emergency change stuff doesn’t mean they should. If that becomes necessary they have already failed at game design *cough* luke *cough*

7 hours ago, RayGuns said:

Most people do not carry around printers in there back pocket. Especially for pick-up games.

A pick-up game is a game that has been spontaneously started by 2 or more players.

If you keep the point cost printout with your ships then you'll have it.

1 minute ago, LordFajubi said:

If they are smart they will ear mark specific dates to adjust things as sweeping as costs. 3 times a year should be plenty. Just because they CAN emergency change stuff doesn’t mean they should. If that becomes necessary they have already failed at game design *cough* luke *cough.

This has been my #1 concern from the start. Just because they have the power to do it on a whim, hopefully, they won't. Sure, there will be a few lists that pop up that need to be shut down right away. But I think you have to give some of these "top lists" time. Let people react to what's winning and find a way to beat it organically before nerfing it.

4 hours ago, Jo Jo said:

Sure... You might not be able to play X-wing if the grid goes down. Or at least you can't play with official point costs. However, I think you'll have bigger problems.

Exactly. Bigger problem such as: Is this the inevitable Robot Takeover Armaggeddon? And where is Kyle Reese when you need him? Who cares about Xwing when Terminators are bearing down on your location

I bet that updates to the building rules will come out at a pace similars to we have seen FAQs in the past. Changes have to be tested and do impact organized play, so a controlled approach to when they come out is important.

4 hours ago, Jo Jo said:

Sure... You might not be able to play X-wing if the grid goes down. Or at least you can't play with official point costs. However, I think you'll have bigger problems.

If you have the app locally, as long as you have battery you’re good to go. And you can buy a solar recahrgable battery for recharging smart devices for not too much these days. So, no excuses guys!

8 minutes ago, piznit said:

Exactly. Bigger problem such as: Is this the inevitable Robot Takeover Armaggeddon? And where is Kyle Reese when you need him? Who cares about Xwing when Terminators are bearing down on your location

I am more partial to the “red dawn” or “Jericho” scenario than the terminator one, though I’m sure Facebook or Google could inadvertently devise Skynet....

Honestly, quick builds will be the best way to help with new players and do basic pick up games.

I don’t know anyone who doesn’t show up to a friends house or a game store without a list or two already in mind - the app will be plenty sufficient.

8 hours ago, RayGuns said:

I just realized something. Pick-up games might be more difficult with X-Wing 2.0. Especially if you do not have a computer or smartphone handy.

Yesterday my friend and I decided to play X-Wing. We didn't plan this (pick-up game), but we just happened to have our X-Wing materials with us. While we were setting up and creating our 100 point force, it occurred to us that pick-up games might not be as easy with X-Wing 2.0 because batteries are required. When I say batteries, I mean a computer or smartphone that uses batteries, and of course, you will also need the X-Wing App.

I guess these days almost everyone has a smartphone or something, but did they charge the battery?

My FLGS has a computer available for common use, so that's nice.

Be great if they spoiled more quick build cards in the next few weeks so we can start proxying lists we know are legal

7 hours ago, RedHotDice said:

That would be great, but I doubt it. They will probably keep it online to ensure point costs are universal and does not depend on a user upgrading it

7 hours ago, RayGuns said:

I would think FFG would make this feature a must. We certainly hope.

That being said, it has not been officially announced that it will have this feature.

Edit: RedHotDice beat me to the app reply by 20 seconds.

So, correct me if I'm wrong @VanderLegion , but your squadbuilder app automatically updates the cards by itself right? So you don't need to have a WiFi access all the time to use it, but you don't need to go to the App Store every week to get the new cards in there? They just put themselves in there automatically whenever you open the app and have WiFi?

I would assume FFG's app would tell you if the app is online or not, and put a warning on screen if you might be playing with out-of-date points costs, but that it would still work offline for casual play. And then FFG's website would tell you when the latest update was so you would know whether or not to check back in with your lists around a WiFi hotspot before going to a tournament.

7 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

So, correct me if I'm wrong @VanderLegion , but your squadbuilder app automatically updates the cards by itself right? So you don't need to have a WiFi access all the time to use it, but you don't need to go to the App Store every week to get the new cards in there? They just put themselves in there automatically whenever you open the app and have WiFi?

I would assume FFG's app would tell you if the app is online or not, and put a warning on screen if you might be playing with out-of-date points costs, but that it would still work offline for casual play. And then FFG's website would tell you when the latest update was so you would know whether or not to check back in with your lists around a WiFi hotspot before going to a tournament.

I would speculate the update depends entirely on whether or not you are online and how you have configured your phone to roll out app updates.

2 hours ago, LordFajubi said:

I guess I’m out of the loop. I have 0 issues with the app working like they describe. I am not someone who has to be glued to their phone but I am an IT guy so I literally don’t go anywhere without my phone, because I need it as the communication device that it is. In this world there are many grown adults who MUST carry a phone without being a slave to it. Ever seen a cop or fire fighter without a phone? How bout a doctor? It is not arrogance or self entitlement to assume many adults have and carry a phone.

That being said, who carries around their stuff without making lists at home first? Not being snarky I am genuinely curious. There is no way I’d lug around the components for this game in a random pool, there is way too much. Several ready lists sure but it takes a battlefoam suitcase plus a tackle box besides to cover all my bases. No way I’m carrying all that to a store.

I help to build the local community, so that means when I go the the FLGS twice a week everything but epics go with me, all 12 Ties, 6 Interceptors, 6 Tie Bombers, 6 X wings, 6 Y wings, 6 A wings, all 6 M3A’s, all 6 Khiraxx, yes everything, I think you get the point. Some of us carry all items in case someone needs to borrow, in fact probably 75-80% of our local scene brings everything for standard play for average game nights. Some of us have played since the beginning and have never used a squad builder on a smart phone that we do own. Some of us like building lists by hand while playing a boardgame to escape from reality that promotes interacting with human beings instalead of being absorbed by our electronic devices that we are tied to on a daily basis. I have ideas of what I want to fly when I go but tailor a list to the skill level of the opponent I’m playing. I like most everything they have implemented in 2.0 except the app, and yes there are the arguments for printing a pdf or really any number of workaround, but the one that bugs me the most is the argument for “just use the quick builds”. If I wanted to play whatever somebody else has built that should be pretty decent then we might as well stay at 1.0 and netlist.

3 minutes ago, ScummyRebel said:

I would speculate the update depends entirely on whether or not you are online and how you have configured your phone to roll out app updates.

Yeah, like, my phone doesn't have auto-updates turned on. I'm actually always logged out of the App Store because I don't like Apple spying on me. So I've gotta go in, log into the App Store, and hit "update" to update Aurora whenever VanderLegion changes the code.

However, I've noticed that when new cards are spoiled or something, they automatically populate without me having to log into the App Store at all.

And Aurora always works, whether or not I have WiFi.

33 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

Yeah, like, my phone doesn't have auto-updates turned on. I'm actually always logged out of the App Store because I don't like Apple spying on me. So I've gotta go in, log into the App Store, and hit "update" to update Aurora whenever VanderLegion changes the code.

However, I've noticed that when new cards are spoiled or something, they automatically populate without me having to log into the App Store at all.

And Aurora always works, whether or not I have WiFi.

FFG doesn't have to update the app to update the points value. The app is simply pulling down a database file from the FFG servers that indicates the value of ships and upgrades. This database is stored locally on your device and will only ping the servers to verify you have the current version.

For all the Luddites out there they can either print off a paper copy of the database or stick with quickbuilds. Everyone here has access to a device that can use the squadbuilder for custom lists.

6 hours ago, Ken on Cape said:

Also, has FFG said if you need the cards for tourney's anymore? If you have the app can you run your whole squad on the app as you play? Keep track of dammage, missles, ect?

Yes, you still have to have the cards for official tournaments.

2 hours ago, LordFajubi said:

That being said, who carries around their stuff without making lists at home first? Not being snarky I am genuinely curious. There is no way I’d lug around the components for this game in a random pool, there is way too much. Several ready lists sure but it takes a battlefoam suitcase plus a tackle box besides to cover all my bases. No way I’m carrying all that to a store.

I keep my 2 tackleboxes (I have a separate one with everything for heroes of the aturi cluster) in the trunk of my car so I don’t have to lug em in and out of the house. I have lists built ahead of time (I build lists all the time), but don’t always have one picked out to actually fly ahead of time. I also loan out cards/ships/cardboard all the time.

1 hour ago, Kieransi said:

So, correct me if I'm wrong @VanderLegion , but your squadbuilder app automatically updates the cards by itself right? So you don't need to have a WiFi access all the time to use it, but you don't need to go to the App Store every week to get the new cards in there? They just put themselves in there automatically whenever you open the app and have WiFi?

Correct. It’s set up to be able to update the card info over the air, so as long as the option is enabled it will attempt to check for updates anytime you launch the app fresh (not when you come back and it hasn’t been killed yet). Means I only need to do full App Store updates for bug fixes and and adding features (or new mechanics, which is why the X-Wing refit doesn’t reduce the cost of epts yet

7 hours ago, Ktan said:

The quick build cards are going to be a godsend to me. I don't have many X-Wing playing friends in the area, so the idea of trying to train people in list building is daunting, especially when I've limited experience in it myself. So it'd be nice just to have some quick and interesting lists ready to go

Except for those getting into the game via the conversion kits.

Confirmed in the Twitch stream last week that the conversion kits have no 'quick build' cards.

(FWIW, I dig the 'quick build' card idea a lot, myself, but...seems none of us will be getting them)

10 hours ago, RedHotDice said:

You dont have a smart phone? Who does not have a smartphone these day?

Yeah, man...I tell ya, it's the first thing *I* think of when getting together with a group of friends for some tabletop gaming that I do online gaming with. Finally offline, face to face, sure thing...first idea in my head..."Hey, everyone, let's get out our smartphones and be heads-down in a web app for the next 15 minutes!" Every time , no doubt...

(Nobody is saying it's an impossible hurdle, unable to be overcome - but it is annoying and not something an issue in 1st edition)

17 minutes ago, xanderf said:

Except for those getting into the game via the conversion kits.

Confirmed in the Twitch stream last week that the conversion kits have no 'quick build' cards.

(FWIW, I dig the 'quick build' card idea a lot, myself, but...seems none of us will be getting them)

Fairly sure I heard they will be available in the app or downloadable so you can print off a bunch and toss them in your kit if its an issue...

Can't remember where I heard this though.

I build my lists at home, on my PC with the Yet Another builder. If it's a list I want to try, I transcribe it onto an index card (takes under a minute) and take that with me.

I'm excited for 2.0 and curious about the app, and as ubiquitous as smartphones are these days, I do feel it's unfair to people who don't have one. The common workaround is "print it" but I honestly don't know many people with printers and I haven't had a home printer in over a decade.

When I do print (usually D&D stuff) it's an upload and trip to FedEx (which costs money, and again is reliant on access to tech).

I can see how this can be limiting to people who don't have a device readily available to consult for squadbuilding, but again it doesn't make it impossible.