11 hours ago, Veldrin said:Corran Horn is the worst protagonist in any Star Wars book(s) and not canon. No way a non-canon character will get force powers.
Did you forget about Mara "best at everything, was trained by the emperor and never even tempted by the dark side" Jade?
3 hours ago, Wiredin said:the bigger question is... where is tycho?
In a Lambda. Without any red dice.
2 minutes ago, Punning Pundit said:In a Lambda. Without any red dice.
Or a Headhunter, with powered down targeting lasers.
3 hours ago, ClassicalMoser said:
Second, I know it's super duper unlikely given that we've seen one of her cards already, but I REALLY want Hera to be I6, if only to have another true Rebel Ace in the game that actually flies a fighter. The way I justify this? We've seen Hera at I5, but that was as Spectre 2. But perhaps as Phoenix Leader we might possibly see her higher. Also Dave Filoni said he thinks she's better than Poe, so there's that. Also, SHE TAUGHT WEDGE EVERYTHING HE KNOWS.
Maybe I really just want there to be a female I6 because there currently isn't, I don't know.
Yes, this. Hera is supposed to be the best pilot in the Galaxy. Like. At _worst_ it's an open question between Han and Hera as to who is better. But I'm pretty sure Hera takes the edge.
Han shoots first, but Hera gets elsewhere faster.
46 minutes ago, Punning Pundit said:Did you forget about Mara "best at everything, was trained by the emperor and never even tempted by the dark side" Jade?
You shut your hole. ? Mara > All
11 hours ago, Ambaryerno said:Nope, he's on the E-wing again. If there's an X-wing version AFAIK it hasn't been revealed yet.
Personally, I think the ships should JUST be ships, with the pilots as separate cards.
In theory, maybe. However, lots of veterans of Star Trek Attack Wing point out that this has often been a problem there. It's easy to imagine that a lot of pilots are just flat out broken in some ships. Sabine Wren with her pre-move boost or barrel roll is the perfect example of someone who'd be busted on a lot of ships. CERTAINLY anything large base, almost surely on a medium base, and probably on most good small-base ships, and points costs alone might not be enough. Having Luke or Wedge in an E-Wing would also be crazy. I know it'd be possible to potentially ban various pilots from various ships, but it makes balance a **** of a lot harder.
3 hours ago, ClassicalMoser said:Eh, I'm skeptical. First, if they do include rebel Fenn at I6, they'll definitely have 3 because Han is a thing. I would really much rather they didn't because we don't need high initiative coordinate and the ubiquity of sheathipedes in 1.0 is just plain wrong. Actually, now I am remembering that the devs mentioned Rau gets a "Reluctant Rebel" subtitle. Oh well. Hopefully they still dial him back to a 5 or so.
Second, I know it's super duper unlikely given that we've seen one of her cards already, but I REALLY want Hera to be I6, if only to have another true Rebel Ace in the game that actually flies a fighter. The way I justify this? We've seen Hera at I5, but that was as Spectre 2. But perhaps as Phoenix Leader we might possibly see her higher. Also Dave Filoni said he thinks she's better than Poe, so there's that. Also, SHE TAUGHT WEDGE EVERYTHING HE KNOWS.
Maybe I really just want there to be a female I6 because there currently isn't, I don't know.
I'd be quite happy to see a Init 6 Hera X-Wing or A-Wing. For an X-Wing, with 2E dial instead of a 1E dial, it wouldn't suck. A-Wing would be really sweet, too, with the S-Loops and all that green. Maybe kinda busted though.
No, Phoenix Leader needs a different ability than Spectre 2 for sure! It would be so easy to improve upon her with additional maneuverability or stress negation.
Edited by ClassicalMoser15 hours ago, WAC47 said:Yeah... I’m guessing Corran’s lack of force sensitivity either reflects him pre-awakening.
I'm pretty sure Corran had at least basic Force control by the time he was flying an E-Wing.
14 hours ago, Veldrin said:Corran Horn is the worst protagonist in any Star Wars book(s) and not canon. No way a non-canon character will get force powers.
Just be glad he is still in the game...
I want Ooryl instead. He is a much more intriguing character.
14 hours ago, Kharnete said:We all need Piggy.
I don't particularly hate Corran, but Ooryl and Piggy would be my top choices for X-Wing pilots. We need more non-human representatives!
4 hours ago, Punning Pundit said:Yes, this. Hera is supposed to be the best pilot in the Galaxy. Like. At _worst_ it's an open question between Han and Hera as to who is better. But I'm pretty sure Hera takes the edge.
Han shoots first, but Hera gets elsewhere faster.
And you people wonder why we didn't like rebels?
Hera isn't the best pilot. She is the best at everything.
Seriously, she matches Rukh in hand to hand combat.
She matches Thrawn in strategical thinking.
And now you say she is supposed to be one of the best pilot in the Galaxy?
You know... I'd take the last one even. Fine. Not in the game, because rebels don't need 4 max initiative pilots, but lorewise.
But the fact that she succeeds at pretty much everything, takes away from her achievements...
This is nothing, but lazy wish fulfilment of the most basic level. Badass Mary Sue character, best at everything.
Are there many like her? Sure. Sabine is even worse. But this shouldn't be the standard.
Its actually not all that difficult to sort this out. Theres basic math involved.
Initiative order goes in percentile format so if you multiply by 5 you get a standard 1 - 120.
If you use the old p.s. scale as a reference , cut out the NOW unused numbers (7-12)
The remaining balance plus or minus the points cost,
AND THIS DOESNT EVEN ACCOUNT FOR DICE!that's the best part.
It's easy to see it's just because ,
Corrann Horn is stupid.
8 hours ago, Commander Kaine said:And you people wonder why we didn't like rebels?
Hera isn't the best pilot. She is the best at everything.
Seriously, she matches Rukh in hand to hand combat.
She matches Thrawn in strategical thinking.
And now you say she is supposed to be one of the best pilot in the Galaxy?
You know... I'd take the last one even. Fine. Not in the game, because rebels don't need 4 max initiative pilots, but lorewise.
But the fact that she succeeds at pretty much everything, takes away from her achievements...
This is nothing, but lazy wish fulfilment of the most basic level. Badass Mary Sue character, best at everything.
Are there many like her? Sure. Sabine is even worse. But this shouldn't be the standard.
Ah yes. Hera's master plan of... getting her fleet destroyed (twice) and getting captured. Totally out thought Thrawn. In reality, every time in the show Thrawn has been beaten, it's because someone used space magic. That's cheating.
Beating Rukh in hand to hand combat? Must have been an episode I don't remember. The way I remember it she was losing slowly until a couple undead magic wolves came to help her out. You can say that it's cheating for her dead BF to have turned into an undead magic space wolf, that's fair. But you can't say that she beat Rukh.
It sounds like you haven't watched these episodes. Or maybe I'm misremembering. That's also possible.
Ultimately, who's better at what is in the service of story. You either like the story of you don't, that's totally up for individual judgement. But. The characters in Rebels have been consistent between episodes, with clear flaws and strengths.
I guess you're upset that kids today have new legends that you didn't have as a kid. I can't be mad at that, as long as I get to experience them too.
Just now, Punning Pundit said:Ah yes. Hera's master plan of... getting her fleet destroyed (twice) and getting captured. Totally out thought Thrawn. In reality, every time in the show Thrawn has been beaten, it's because someone used space magic. That's cheating.
Beating Rukh in hand to hand combat? Must have been an episode I don't remember. The way I remember it she was losing slowly until a couple undead magic wolves came to help her out. You can say that it's cheating for her dead BF to have turned into an undead magic space wolf, that's fair. But you can't say that she beat Rukh.
It sounds like you haven't watched these episodes. Or maybe I'm misremembering. That's also possible.
Ultimately, who's better at what is in the service of story. You either like the story of you don't, that's totally up for individual judgement. But. The characters in Rebels have been consistent between episodes, with clear flaws and strengths.
I guess you're upset that kids today have new legends that you didn't have as a kid. I can't be mad at that, as long as I get to experience them too.
I don't mind new stories. I mind badly written ones.
8 hours ago, Commander Kaine said:And now you say she is supposed to be one of the best pilot in the Galaxy?
This is Star Wars. EVERY pilot protagonist is the "best pilot in the galaxy". That's why they have to jump around in the timeline.
Just now, JJ48 said:This is Star Wars. EVERY pilot protagonist is the "best pilot in the galaxy". That's why they have to jump around in the timeline.
Also... Hera, while good, when she meets an ACTUAL PS 9 pilot (Vader)... she is scared to the bones, and she is pretty much powerless.
Even if we wanna go with the overblown action of Rebels, we do have a comparison in that show. Vader is clearly shown to be the superior pilot in every way.
12 minutes ago, Commander Kaine said:Also... Hera, while good, when she meets an ACTUAL PS 9 pilot (Vader)... she is scared to the bones, and she is pretty much powerless.
Even if we wanna go with the overblown action of Rebels, we do have a comparison in that show. Vader is clearly shown to be the superior pilot in every way.
That's a fair point, and what the heck happened to _that_ Vader? He didn't seem that scary even at Yavin.
Just now, Punning Pundit said:That's a fair point, and what the heck happened to _that_ Vader? He didn't seem that scary even at Yavin.
Eh?
A different cinematic style due to artistic differences, technical and budget limitations?
This is what happens when you take everything at face value in a piece of fiction. There are inconsistencies. There are inconsistencies even in the OT. Notice the way how lightsaber combat changed. There is no canon explanation for that. Lucas just changed his mind on how lightsaber combat should work, to make it look more interesting. Even more in the PT.
This is why Rebels is not a good source to take stuff from if you take stuff at face value. Rebels is a high action kids show... They will do things that don't make sense in the universe, or they are inconsistent with it, to fulfill an artistic choice.
So is Hera the Best Pilot?
No. Not even within the frames of the show, but she is portrayed like that because she is a larger than life archetype in a mythical story of good and evil. She is the archetype of the strong mother character. As a show for kids, of course she is going to seem invincible, because that's how we want to see our mothers. Fierce, Fearless, Loving, Strong...
But you know... As an adult, I wish for more nuance in my stories. I'm capable of understanding stuff that kids might not, so their level of entertainment isn't for me.
So... Yes I watched that show. I just dislike it when people take it too seriously, because... it is really not meant for us. You don't take any kids show at face value... it's kinda their thing. They are unrealistic.
1 hour ago, Punning Pundit said:That's a fair point, and what the heck happened to _that_ Vader? He didn't seem that scary even at Yavin.
I HATED Vader Down for this reason. Vader Down Vader could have just used the Force to wipe out all of Red Squadron in one go, and ignores the fact that he NEARLY FAILED TO STOP Garven Dreis from blowing up the Death Star. If he timed the launch of his torpedoes just a HAIR better Luke wouldn't have needed to make his run.
Vader in the Original Trilogy was powerful, but he was also still mortal. This is just more of the same Force-wielder Power Creep that made Jedi in the old EU such a mess to deal with.
1 hour ago, Commander Kaine said:So... Yes I watched that show. I just dislike it when people take it too seriously, because... it is really not meant for us. You don't take any kids show at face value... it's kinda their thing. They are unrealistic.
I think the show and the movies are meant for the same age range. This is a franchise for the 8 year old in all of us- regardless of whether we're 6 or 96.
14 minutes ago, Ambaryerno said:I HATED Vader Down for this reason. Vader Down Vader could have just used the Force to wipe out all of Red Squadron in one go, and ignores the fact that he NEARLY FAILED TO STOP Garven Dreis from blowing up the Death Star. If he timed the launch of his torpedoes just a HAIR better Luke wouldn't have needed to make his run.
Vader hated Tarkin so much that he was willing to let the Death Star get blown up regardless of how bad it made Vader personally look. The Sith are the masters of aggression in all forms- even passive aggression.
1 hour ago, Punning Pundit said:Vader hated Tarkin so much that he was willing to let the Death Star get blown up regardless of how bad it made Vader personally look. The Sith are the masters of aggression in all forms- even passive aggression.
He was fine with Tarkin,
He wanted to prove Motti wrong
Just so he could say with confidence that the ability to destroy a planet wtc.
I also loathed Vader Down because it kinda makes the Force more like crazy DBZ stuff rather than the more subtle thing of th emovies.
23 hours ago, Mep said:Seriously, we all know it was Chewbacca and not Han who flew through an asteroid field.
Huh? Han and Chewie were attempting to fix the hyperdrive while Leia was flying, then when they hit asteroids Han and Chewie run back to the cockpit where Han clearly enters the pilot's seat and does the flying (with Chewbacca in the Co-Pilot station).
Corran is in4 max. I'm just waiting for the in7 Chuck Norris pilot.
On 5/19/2018 at 2:49 PM, Wiredin said:the bigger question is... where is tycho?
Winter is coming.
9 hours ago, Commander Kaine said:Eh?
A different cinematic style due to artistic differences, technical and budget limitations?
This is what happens when you take everything at face value in a piece of fiction. There are inconsistencies. There are inconsistencies even in the OT. Notice the way how lightsaber combat changed. There is no canon explanation for that. Lucas just changed his mind on how lightsaber combat should work, to make it look more interesting. Even more in the PT.
This is why Rebels is not a good source to take stuff from if you take stuff at face value. Rebels is a high action kids show... They will do things that don't make sense in the universe, or they are inconsistent with it, to fulfill an artistic choice.So is Hera the Best Pilot?
No. Not even within the frames of the show, but she is portrayed like that because she is a larger than life archetype in a mythical story of good and evil. She is the archetype of the strong mother character. As a show for kids, of course she is going to seem invincible, because that's how we want to see our mothers. Fierce, Fearless, Loving, Strong...
But you know... As an adult, I wish for more nuance in my stories. I'm capable of understanding stuff that kids might not, so their level of entertainment isn't for me.
So... Yes I watched that show. I just dislike it when people take it too seriously, because... it is really not meant for us. You don't take any kids show at face value... it's kinda their thing. They are unrealistic.
The lightsaber combat can be easily explained, even from a real world example. Granted there's a larger time gap but we are just starting to actually figure out what skilled fighting with an arming sword looked like due to the efforts of historians and enthusiasts translating ancient training manuals. Now look at what happened in star wars. The sword fighters all died and their ways were suppressed by the government. Luke got 3 days of basics before he went to fight Vader, who's lost most of the agility that made the sabre an art form pre-fall.