13 minutes ago, Norsehound said:

No, I don't think you can just nitpick your way out of this one. The Suncrusher is the only ship that uses these torpedoes (likely the only one that can arm and launch them) so they might as well be synonymous with the space vehicle. We never hear about this weapon again either, so it's inseparable from the starfighter, which means Suncrusher = Oneshot solar system. It also never runs out of ammunition in the lore its featured.

About the only drawback to this setup is that it cannot easily, strategically, wipe out individual things. Even the Death Star has more flexibility out of a single reactor ignition to act as super artillery.

Engines, Weapons, Comms... are these things destroyed or damaged as the Suncrusher rams the Hydra? or any other time in the lore? Have these systems been disabled as a major plot point when fighting the Sun Crusher? If not, then they might as well be as indestructible as the rest of the ship.

As far as I'm aware no starfighter ever challenged the Sun Crusher, and if they had, they never disabled it. So why use that as a point of strength when you can also assume the starfighter is impervious to those things too?


Now, Death Star, Starkiller et all... they do less and require more. One's suspension of disbelief is not as easily unsettled when annihilating plants requires a gun nearly as big as a planet in turn. The Suncrusher was supposed to be impressive because it did more with less, but in the end it was so overcompensating in a universe full of superweapons that it stands as a remark of excess in the expanded universe. Nobody is sad to see it go, here we are ridiculing it! But nobody had a problem with the Death Star, and I don't understand why people have a problem with Starkiller when it's slightly scaled up from the DS, built out of a planet, and only elliminates one planet and its moons.

Since Starkiller isn't mobile either I'd wonder if after exhausting the sun it orbited, Starkiller would be unable to fire again, meaning the weapon had only two shots total.

I find your use of "nitpicking" pretty interesting as this is No nitpicking. I'm all for critizising the concept of the Suncrusher but people should critizise the right stuff and not Just go by hearsay.

The SC has a magazine of 11 torpedoes and fires ~7 of them, so of course it never runs out of torpedos in the stories.

We never hear about it again because the torpedoes and armour were one of a kind secret projects which needed decades to be build. The SC was the testbed these technologies.

And yes the weapons are explicitly mentioned to be destroyed when crashing through the Hydra.

The engines and comms were not destroyed because they aren't located at the front of the vessel but still are noted to bei vulnerable.

And yes Starkillerbase is mobile and has a hyperdrive as by word of god.

2 hours ago, VanderLegion said:

This guy....Pops. ‘Gold five’. Yeah his annoying voice was sampled for the Super Star Wars game on the SNES, and during the trench run if you went too far to the sides of the trench he would chime in to stay on target. So annoying. No one misses you! We all miss Porkins and Biggs and General Merrick! We even miss Tyree and Dutch, who died so your slow *** could try to make it to the exhaust port, and all you could say was STAY ON TARGET in a voice more suited to a droid. I HATE YOU POPS, I’m glad you got popped by Vader, you deserved it.

ahem, anyway, also, no one misses the Suncrusher. A Star fighter sized ship that shoots torpedoes that make Sol-massed stars go supernova is one thing (a very stupid thing that was also ripped of from Star Trek Generations, not exactly the best movie in that franchise), but KJA built the SC with ‘quantum armor’ making it indestructible to the point of SURVIVING A PLUNGE INTO A GAS GIANT. KJA can get the Pops treatment as well.

1 hour ago, RogueLeader42 said:

And yes Starkillerbase is mobile and has a hyperdrive as by word of god.

Pablo Hildago? Surely you don’t mean J. J.

13 hours ago, VanderLegion said:

Weapons yes, engines seemed to be less vulnerable, given that it was dropped into the heart of Yavin and the engines still worked just fine. Plus all thet imes it was shot and plowed through star destroyers and the like. It only lost it's weapons.

3

Wasn't it pulled out of Yavin by Kyp/Exar Kun using the Force? Seems like they could have cleared out/fixed any problems with the engines. Crashing through the Star Destroyers was silly, but I get what KJA was trying to go for. (it can only be destroyed where it was built, character walking the edge has to almost sacrifice themselves to destroy it)

On 5/11/2018 at 7:03 AM, Alpha17 said:

Because turning a planet into another Death Star that blows up whole solar systems was such an improvement.

Yep. The Jedi Academy books were great.

At the very least, the Sun Crusher was a new take on the superweapon idea. Small, but still powerful. The invisible armor was a bit much though.

Did we read the same books?

28 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

Wasn't it pulled out of Yavin by Kyp/Exar Kun using the Force? Seems like they could have cleared out/fixed any problems with the engines. Crashing through the Star Destroyers was silly, but I get what KJA was trying to go for. (it can only be destroyed where it was built, character walking the edge has to almost sacrifice themselves to destroy it)

Yeah, just about the lamest character using the lamest way to bring back Edgelord, the Starship.

20 minutes ago, Yakostovian said:

Did we read the same books?

Yeah, just about the lamest character using the lamest way to bring back Edgelord, the Starship.

I've often wondered that, considering how many people bash the trilogy these days. It's not on the same level as the Thrawn Trilogy, but it's not nearly as bad as people make it out to be. Helluva lot better than Disney's attempt at the same idea at least.

And the Force is lame? You must not be a fan of any Star Wars movie.

57 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

I've often wondered that, considering how many people bash the trilogy these days. It's not on the same level as the Thrawn Trilogy, but it's not nearly as bad as people make it out to be. Helluva lot better than Disney's attempt at the same idea at least.

And the Force is lame? You must not be a fan of any Star Wars movie.

Any of the Young adult books were prequel level horrible. Worse, in many cases, and Kyp Durron was the worst case I can recall off the top of my head. Almost all the characters outside the main protagonists were edgelords supreme, especially if they were teetering with the darkside. Being darkside does not equal character development.

As for the use of the force: it was in the gas giant: It should have been irretrievable to even the most powerful force users. ****, Palpatine's force powers rarely were able to affect at that distance, and he was using stuff like Battle Meditation. Pulling a starship from the gas giant from a "fledgling" force user that is toying with the darkside was just plain stupid.

8 minutes ago, Yakostovian said:

Any of the Young adult books were prequel level horrible. Worse, in many cases, and Kyp Durron was the worst case I can recall off the top of my head. Almost all the characters outside the main protagonists were edgelords supreme, especially if they were teetering with the darkside. Being darkside does not equal character development.

As for the use of the force: it was in the gas giant: It should have been irretrievable to even the most powerful force users. ****, Palpatine's force powers rarely were able to affect at that distance, and he was using stuff like Battle Meditation. Pulling a starship from the gas giant from a "fledgling" force user that is toying with the darkside was just plain stupid.

You must've really loved Dorssk 81 flinging an entire imperial fleet away from the planet then.

For myself, while the Jedi Academy Trilogy weren't the best books in the EU, they were far from the worst

1 hour ago, VanderLegion said:

You must've really loved Dorssk 81 flinging an entire imperial fleet away from the planet then.

For myself, while the Jedi Academy Trilogy weren't the best books in the EU, they were far from the worst

I agree with the bolded, and could not object more to the italicized.

I gotta give it to Young Adult authors though. Somehow writing a book about "special" kids that "adults just don't understand" is a real page-turner for the teens and tweens category. I could not ever bring myself to write that drivel and expect to get paid for it.

3 hours ago, Yakostovian said:

Any of the Young adult books were prequel level horrible. Worse, in many cases, and Kyp Durron was the worst case I can recall off the top of my head. Almost all the characters outside the main protagonists were edgelords supreme, especially if they were teetering with the darkside. Being darkside does not equal character development.

As for the use of the force: it was in the gas giant: It should have been irretrievable to even the most powerful force users. ****, Palpatine's force powers rarely were able to affect at that distance, and he was using stuff like Battle Meditation. Pulling a starship from the gas giant from a "fledgling" force user that is toying with the darkside was just plain stupid.

The Jedi Academy Trilogy wasn't young adult though. The young adult books were the Young Jedi Knights, while the children's version was the Junior Jedi Knights. Incredibly different stories and characters.

Being darkside is not character development, but escaping from slavery, getting some Force training, being seduced by the spirit of a Sith Lord, accidentally killing your brother, and realizing that destruction doesn't make everything right is character development. That was Kyp's initial arc in a nutshell. If anything, making him the poster child for the 90s Jedi in the NJO was more annoying than him in the Academy books.

And remember Yoda's saying? Size matters not? You realize that can apply to distance as well, right? The Jedi were supposed to be able to sense and affect things from great distances. Vader did it in Empire, the Prequels told us why the Jedi couldn't do it at the time, and even the Mouse picked up on this and had Luke and Snoke use the Force from great distances.

Kyp may have been a "fledgling force user," but he had great raw power, AND was being backed up by Exar Kun and his abilities. A team that can put Luke into a coma can probably pull a fighter out of a gas giant.

8 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

The Jedi Academy Trilogy wasn't young adult though. The young adult books were the Young Jedi Knights, while the children's version was the Junior Jedi Knights. Incredibly different stories and characters.

Definitely this. My guess is he's thinking the Young Jedi Knights, not hte JAT.

7 hours ago, VanderLegion said:

Definitely this. My guess is he's thinking the Young Jedi Knights, not hte JAT.

I was referring more to the YJK than the Jedi Academy trilogy, but I read them around the same time, and thought there were of equal quality at the time. Until you mentioned it, I had thought they were one and the same.

YJK is terrible for the "Ah. Aha" catchphrase of one of it's main characters, which I was never able to take seriously.

I might have a particular dislike for Jedi Academy because I loathe Kyp Durron so much. So please understand my bias.

10 hours ago, Yakostovian said:

I was referring more to the YJK than the Jedi Academy trilogy, but I read them around the same time, and thought there were of equal quality at the time. Until you mentioned it, I had thought they were one and the same.

YJK is terrible for the "Ah. Aha" catchphrase of one of it's main characters, which I was never able to take seriously.

I might have a particular dislike for Jedi Academy because I loathe Kyp Durron so much. So please understand my bias.

Understandable. I am much more tolerant of the YJK books than most, because I liked some of the ideas it had, if not the actual execution. (TIE Fighter pilot downed on Yavin, Dark Jedi academy, anti-human bias/terrorists) And hating Kyp is perfectly fine; he's a hateable character. He wasn't presented as anything remotely likable until halfway through the NJO.