Hi all!

I thought I would drop in and get folks thoughts on dealing with Military Vehicles in Genesys since one of my conversions makes them kind of a big deal.

This is what I’ve come up with for a fairly simple APC for players. Feel the scores are ok, but as have never dealt with vehicles in Genesys (or SW really) I thought about reaching out to more knowledgeable folks.

All feedback is welcome on all portions of this design, from the Thresholds to the Hvy MG.

TC

Cadillac-Gage V-150 (APC configuration)

The Cadillac-Gage V-150 is a 4x4 Armored Car with bulletproof tires. The APC variant can carry 10 people in addition to its crew of 2.

SIL : 1 Max Speed : 3 Handling : +2

Def 3 Armour 2 HT 30 SS 35

Control skill: Driving

Complement : 2 (Driver, Commander/Gunner)

Passengers: 10

Consumables: 1 day

Encumbrance capacity : 25

Hardpoints : 1

 Price/rarity: ?? / 9

Weapons : Heavy Machine Gun (Fire Arc All; Damage 12; Crit 3; Range [Long]; Auto-Fire, Pierce 3, Suppressive 3 (Target and each character engaged with them (friend or foe) takes Strain equal to the Rating), Vicious 3)

Special : None

It should be Silhouette 2 or 3. Silhouette 1 is roughly the size of a human.

I would say it depends on how you're dealing with damage, but that is a remarkably high HT for a vehicle of that size.

Realize there is a 10x damage difference between personal and vehicle scale. At HT 30 with Armor 2, this means that its going to take 15 shots from the default man portable rocket launcher to destroy this thing. It probably should just be HT 3 and SS 5 or something. Also, defense 3 is -really- high, and probably needs at least some justification.

The MG is fine, but does need a note that its personal scale damage. Suppresive is an interesting quality, I would say that its pretty potent. I would probably make it an activated talent at least, or at least indicate that it is such if you intend it to be activated.

2 hours ago, CaptainRaspberry said:

It should be Silhouette 2 or 3. Silhouette 1 is roughly the size of a human.

Ah, I forgot the vehicle is on the same scale. It should probably be on a 2, since can hold like 12 people....

2 hours ago, Kommissar said:

I would say it depends on how you're dealing with damage, but that is a remarkably high HT for a vehicle of that size.

Realize there is a 10x damage difference between personal and vehicle scale. At HT 30 with Armor 2, this means that its going to take 15 shots from the default man portable rocket launcher to destroy this thing. It probably should just be HT 3 and SS 5 or something. Also, defense 3 is -really- high, and probably needs at least some justification.

The MG is fine, but does need a note that its personal scale damage. Suppresive is an interesting quality, I would say that its pretty potent. I would probably make it an activated talent at least, or at least indicate that it is such if you intend it to be activated.

Thank you. I completely missed that “Planetary/Personal” scale difference. It would probably be better as HT: 2, SS: 3, Armor 1, Def 0 (Since I cant think of anything that would make it higher). It is just an APC after all. When I get to more dedicated combat vehicles I’ll start bumping those values.

I will be sure to add the Personal Scale quality to the MG for all variants of this.

what would you say something like a TOW missile would look like for its weapon listing?

Handling 2 needs to go, that's what a sports car would have. The armor on those things also isn't something you'd want to beat your life on. A TOW will turn one of those into parts.

For a TOW missile I'd use the launcher in the core book. It has guided, it has breach. The key is keeping vehicle HT's in line to keep it effective. It actually gets a bit tricky, especially if you're trying to make sure personal scale combatants have a fighting chance against vehicles.

Recognize, crits against vehicles are also a good way to handle it (as well treating vehicles as minions so that crits take them out). You might want to give the launcher Vicious rating so as to better ensure the more crippling crits are the result.

1 hour ago, 2P51 said:

Handling 2 needs to go, that's what a sports car would have. The armor on those things also isn't something you'd want to beat your life on. A TOW will turn one of those into parts.

Agreed. I was just looking at the handling ratings in the CRB, and looks like -1 is a light tank. I would say this is right along those lines, if not a 0...

1 hour ago, Kommissar said:

For a TOW missile I'd use the launcher in the core book. It has guided, it has breach. The key is keeping vehicle HT's in line to keep it effective. It actually gets a bit tricky, especially if you're trying to make sure personal scale combatants have a fighting chance against vehicles.

Recognize, crits against vehicles are also a good way to handle it (as well treating vehicles as minions so that crits take them out). You might want to give the launcher Vicious rating so as to better ensure the more crippling crits are the result.

Ok, that does fit a TOW it seems. And with Damage 20,Breach 2, I think it fits that it would have a good chance of eliminating another V-150. Although I may change the TOW to be something like Damage 3 (vehicle/planetary scale) to simplify the write ups.

The silhouette definitely should be 3. HT and SS are enormous, especially with armour 3. I would halve the SS and reduce armour to 2. Handling definitely at 0, it’s better if it’s -1 so the dedicated driver has something they can mitigate with talents.

Thanks for all the input!

heres my revisions:

SIL : 3 Max Speed: 3 Handling : -1

Def 0 Armour 2 HT 5 SS 5

Weapons : Heavy Machine Gun (Fire Arc All; Damage 12; Crit 3; Range [Long]; Personal Scale, Auto-Fire, Pierce 3, Suppressive 3 (Target and each character engaged with them (friend or foe) takes Strain equal to the Rating), Vicious 3)

And my take on a Humvee:

SIL : 2 Max Speed : 4 Handling : 0

Def 0 Armour 1 HT 2 SS 6

Thoughts?

I think at this point you are setting the Hull Thresholds a bit low. The default four-door in the CRB has 4 Hull, 5 Strain. I'd give an APC probably 8 HT and the Humvee 5.

They do get a bit tougher than realistic with that (single rocket vs 2 or 3) but it also means that if your PCs are driving them, they're less likely do die to a single lucky shot.

Not sure if it'll help, but I managed to do a rough conversion of AOR's Fully Operational to Genesys , and you can view it here .

It also has expanded rules for making vehicular weapons.

5 hours ago, BluSunrize said:

I think at this point you are setting the Hull Thresholds a bit low. The default four-door in the CRB has 4 Hull, 5 Strain. I'd give an APC probably 8 HT and the Humvee 5.

They do get a bit tougher than realistic with that (single rocket vs 2 or 3) but it also means that if your PCs are driving them, they're less likely do die to a single lucky shot.

Thanks. i’ve Been looking at getting back to my MP Conversion, this helps.

46 minutes ago, c__beck said:

Not sure if it'll help, but I managed to do a rough conversion of AOR's Fully Operational to Genesys , and you can view it here .

It also has expanded rules for making vehicular weapons.

Thanks!

Im at work on my iPad at moment, but will check it out when I get home.

Handling -1 looks right. That much weight transfer forwards will cause understeer at even 60 km/h.

I used to work for a branch of the company that produced the V-150 and I would place the V-150 handling at -2, a HUMVEE would be a -1. A minivan for getting groceries would be a 0 as the sample 4 door passenger vehicle. However, what you might do is add some special flavor to the V-150 and HUMVEE. Such as giving them some abilities/perks to offset some off-road difficulty modifiers to either add boost dice or remove setback dice. Most Military HUMVEE are speed limited (Unless you know where to say...) Being diesel powered and how they are geared limits their base MAX Speed to 3 for both. I'm not trying to de-rail your first post edits, but they were not made to handle, they were made to cross rough terrain, provide moderate small arms protection and provide mobility. Speed, Handling and Acceleration aren't on the high-end at all.

My suggested V-150

Sil 3 Max Spd 3 Handling -2 DEF 0 ARM 2 HT 20 SS 14 {I basically did Sil - 1 x 10 for HT and real world weight in tons x 2 round down for SS)

Control Skill: Driving

Compliment: 2 (1 Driver & Commander/Gunner)

Passenger Cap: 10 (14 uncomfortable)

Consumables: 1 Day

Encumbrance Cap: 30 (possibly higher without passengers)

Equipment and Weapons: Weapons as you suggested are fine, but I suggest it is listed as one light vehicle weapon (Could be a M2, M19, M249 or M60, or whatever the country happens to mount on the mount, perhaps one of the ultra-sonic crowd suppression devices), First-aid kit, fire extinguisher, stretcher, Tow chains, Multi-band military radio.

Reduce setback dice by 1 when performing a Driving Skill check in off-road conditions.

For the HUMVEE

Sil 2 Max Spd 3 Handling -1 DEF 0 ARM 1 HT 1 0 SS 12 (The up-armored version would be ARM 2)

Control Skill: Driving

Compliment: 1 (1 Driver)

Passenger Cap: 6 (8 uncomfortable)

Consumables: 1 Day

Encumbrance Cap: 20 (possibly higher without passengers)

Equipment and Weapons: Weapons as you suggested are fine, but I suggest it is listed as one light vehicle weapon (Could be a M2, M19, M249 or M60, or whatever the country happens to mount on the mount, perhaps one of the ultra-sonic crowd suppression devices), First-aid kit, fire extinguisher, stretcher, Tow chains, Multi-band military radio.

Reduce setback dice by 1 when performing a Driving Skill check in off-road conditions.

You can find some really solid armor analysis information and comparison on many websites. Think about adding some special flavor gear and abilities to enhance, but maintain their poor S, H and A. Think your average mini-van as Sil