22 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

yeah, GW doesn't seem like it had as much of a buy-in...but the actual costs of upgrading to have any chance of fun was much much higher

True, though arguably that's not even remotely as bad with 8th edition, which seems to have done most everything right. That is where I'm drawing the most direct comparison with X-Wing since it's most likely the strongest competitor - sure the rulebooks/codex books/what have you were pretty expensive too, but still cheaper than these conversion kits will be, and only ever required one copy per faction.

These conversion kits, on the other hand, are going to require multiple purchases to cover the collections of long-term players (who in most cases are going to own all three/five factions given 1.0's tendency to put required upgrades in other faction ship packs), and at the moment we don't know if what they contain will match with later 're-issued' expansion packs for older ships (all we know is that the 'new' Wave 1 won't have anything that's not in the conversion kits - no guarantees beyond that).
Add to that a required new core (because of the new damage deck, tokens and templates) and suddenly that's a huge rebuy-in for veteran players: whether you spread it out over time or not, it's still a lot of money to expect to use things we already paid a premium for. It's particularly galling to be told that we should be grateful for the kits rather than having to rebuy the same ships in new expansion packs in order to upgrade; entirely missing the fact that FFG actually doing that would destroy the game with the level of ill will it would generate, and so it was never a possibility.

Out. I am going to sound like an antiquated curmudgeon with my response, but I have three main reasons for not wanting to continue.

First, I play casually and I very much like the game the way it is. I've got more than enough to keep it fun (not to mention HotAC) for a very long time. I don't need the new stuff (moar toakenz!!!1), so I am happy to leave at 1E.

Second, I have been a big fan of FFG up until around the buyout/merger. Maybe it is market oversaturation and a glut of board games out there, but nothing is particularly making me go "wow, I must have that." It might also be, too, that the pattern of limited core experience ... with 10,000 expansions cools my interest after a while. I know you "only" ever need the core, but let's also be honest - it is a very limited experience at just the core.

Third, I play board games to get away from technology. I love the social aspect and I love the physical, tangible feel of components ... or, the overly sterile feel of sleeved cards. I know the app is "just X" or "just Y" and the game can probably be played casually without it, but I am not a fan of the trend to include apps as part of the game's "full" experience. There is just something about the tangible nature of games, just like reading a book instead of a Kindle (etc).

Anyway, TLDR: X-Wing is awesome, 2E looks neat ... but, I'm out.

As someone who only plays scenario based and epic games (or uses the models in the RPG or in my Imperial Assault super-campaign) this is going to be a hard choice. I like the changes, especially the addition of the app for more dynamic games, but the cost of $150 (well, hopefully Asmodee hasn’t completely screwed over online retailers come fall and the usual discounts can still be had) to upgrade barely a quarter of my collection is going to be a tough pill to swallow. To be honest, I am more peeved that the price of the standard blister has gone up from $15 to $20. That smacks of blatant cash grab-iness on the part of the Asmodee overlords (along with the bizarre ship allotments in the conversion kits which seemed designed to force many people to buy more than one each). Anyway, September is a long way off so I guess I have plenty of time to decide.

I'm totally in. This looks f***ing amazing.

In, but cautiously, gonna start with rebels (since resistance and first order will take time)

I’m just thrilled I can sell my scum junk if I can unload it. Never wanted them and was basically getting them for upgrade cards and now all those if I can unload them will fund what I really want , my empire. Will keep rebels too but never again will I ever have to nor will I buy scum. This alone makes the game worth looking at.

I have a sizeable collection too but just buying what I need to play what I want instead of what I’d have to is going to be amazing. People cry that they have collections of countless things they never use now. Don’t upgrade everything and the cost is not that bad. Completionists and OCD are the only ones really suffering here.

New core set: will buy

Scum conversion kit: will buy

Imperial conservsion kit: probably will buy on launch day

Rebel conversion kit: maybe I'll wait and ask for it as a Christmas gift? I'll have a lot of stuff to play with in the meantime with the other 2.

My biggest issue with X-wing 1.0 is the bloat and complication coming from that. We had too many ships, with too many pilots and upgrades that all had to do something unique (they're all essentially rule exceptions). Inevitably, ideas got through that shouldn't have. Balance suffered. Iconic ships disappeared and it became basically a SW EU game.

And 2.0... I don't think it addresses that problem at all (based on what we've heard so far). All the ships in 1.0 are transitioning over into 2.0, so that's bad news. All the pilots are coming over as well, plus some more brand new pilots. And while yes, FFG will probably do a great job at balancing everything together, that's an awful lot of stuff to balance and what's going to happen years later? They've done a horrible job at balancing these past few years (ever since Wave 4) and practically admit that they've been getting worse at it. They say the game became too complicated, right after all of the same people added conditions etc. into the game. The app likely will help them balance the game just on the cost principle (theoretically).

Anyhow, I'm going to wait and see. I suppose they could utterly gut the upgrade list and the pilots. Refreshing them all and coming up with a better and smaller selection. It already seems that they may rewrite a lot of them, and that's good news.

Out, but with a caveat. I think the new changes I have seen are good for the game but the "buy-in" is too steep for me and I feel that the Conversion Kits are just money grabs from the original/Epic/rabid players. I have worked a crap-ton of overtime to buy ships since this game started and now I will have to buy about $300 worth of Conversion Kits to make them playable at events??? Nope, not gonna happen.

What I will do is make new bases and dials myself for those that have changed and I will never play an organized event again. I might have to buy some medium bases and a new core later, as I play all factions, but I will give as little of my money to Asmodee as possible now. In addition, the prices have steadily risen on their models to the point that I can get better sculpts printed for less and make the cardboard myself.

I have no animosity towards the manufacturer as I understand that it is a business first for them and cash is king, but I can take my business elsewhere as a result.

I wish everyone a whole lot of fun with 2.0 and...I don't know, just fly casual!

50 minutes ago, redxavier said:

My biggest issue with X-wing 1.0 is the bloat and complication coming from that. We had too many ships, with too many pilots and upgrades that all had to do something unique (they're all essentially rule exceptions). Inevitably, ideas got through that shouldn't have. Balance suffered. Iconic ships disappeared and it became basically a SW EU game.

And 2.0... I don't think it addresses that problem at all (based on what we've heard so far). All the ships in 1.0 are transitioning over into 2.0, so that's bad news. All the pilots are coming over as well, plus some more brand new pilots. And while yes, FFG will probably do a great job at balancing everything together, that's an awful lot of stuff to balance and what's going to happen years later? They've done a horrible job at balancing these past few years (ever since Wave 4) and practically admit that they've been getting worse at it. They say the game became too complicated, right after all of the same people added conditions etc. into the game. The app likely will help them balance the game just on the cost principle (theoretically).

Anyhow, I'm going to wait and see. I suppose they could utterly gut the upgrade list and the pilots. Refreshing them all and coming up with a better and smaller selection. It already seems that they may rewrite a lot of them, and that's good news.

For a player like you threat levels will probably a joy. If you haven't seen them, yet, it is basicaly prebuild ships that have a value between 1 (basic TIE Fighter) and 5 (highest so far is Luke with some bling at 3). For something similar to todays 100 point game you would pick a threat level of 8 or 9. This allows you to chose your list configuration without having to dive into the upgrade pile. Probably my third favourite feature after mobile arcs on everything and the card reworks that 2nd ed. has, it is just super convenient for casual quick play and matches between players where one of them is way more involved in the game.

I'm in. Way in. (And I was, as loathe as I am to admit it even to myself, easing out the door.)

I'm just about as far from an FFG apologist as one can get, but given the information so far (I just couldn't live without the caveat, could I?), they have done everything right on this. I am genuinely baffled by the hard-core criticism.

Excellent job, FFG. Just fantastic.

Very much in. Rebel and Imperial conversions already pre-ordered, along with a new core and a new Y-Wing.

The possibilities of much more fluid balancing, thanks to the app, is the biggest improvement in my opinion. I have a hard time predicting how pro-active they will be, because that could go very badly for them in the initial buy-in stage. I know they have said they won't make big balance changes immediately before tournaments, but even "badly received" or "poorly considered" nerfs/buffs might be blamed on the app making the whole idea of a nerf/buff easier. On the other hand, if they don't use it enough, it will look worthless instead of frustrating. It's a tough idea to sell and implement, but really does offer the possibility of better balance and a more interesting game. I like the initiative.

The new mechanics, just for the challenge alone. I am sure there will still be some stuff that is more effective and frustrating to play against. Hopefully the new, easier balancing will help reign in the stuff with truly limited or prohibitively difficult counter-play. They have been able to adjust a lot of things that were not considered in the original design space in order to make this a better experience. They have obviously put a lot of effort into revamping what they know is their most important miniature game. I am more than willing to pay roughly what I was already planning to spend to see what they did with it.

The value of this reboot is pretty good really. Consider what you are getting in the conversion boxes and the core sets. Not just a ton of material components, but the time you can spend learning the interactions of the new rules, building new lists with all new pieces, gitting gud with the new barrel roll, figuring out that one janky force user. The theorycrafting, practice time, learning, and play time value out of these boxes is probably triple or more what I would expect to get out of buying multiple copies of the same new expansions. Those complaining about how much this will cost them probably haven't factored in what they will no longer be buying because it fits 1.0 meta lists. You can now spend that on 2.0 stuff instead. I know that there are probably some people who did think about that and still feel a little grabbed in the wallet. I agree that they are asking us to pay for a big project here, but it's one that I definitely want to be a part of.

Already pre-ordered.

In. I kinda faded out a year ago, mostly because of busy life issues. Though the many FAQ's helped with the inconvenience of getting back in. I dreaded going through the most recent FAQ and updating myself on all the changes. I yearned for the simple days when what was printed on the card was actually the rule.

2.0 brings that back and FFG will have learned from 1.0, so I expect even better. I think the conversion kits are great and I will probably buy only one each. When I started out, I bought the max number of each ship you could possibly fly at 100. I quickly found I rarely ever played that way.

I realize that eventually, 2.0 will have the same stacked FAQ's as 1.0 does currently. But I will enjoy the golden age in the mean time.

In big. Placed a $300 pre-order and can’t wait for Epic to join the party.

1 hour ago, redxavier said:

Anyhow, I'm going to wait and see. I suppose they could utterly gut the upgrade list and the pilots. Refreshing them all and coming up with a better and smaller selection. It already seems that they may rewrite a lot of them, and that's good news.

Apologies for quoting myself. But Alex Davy's comments on the live stream indicate that they're approaching 2.0 with a blank slate. Not all the cards are going into 2.0. This is really great news and really does change how I feel about the game. We're not simply getting the +200 cards slightly rewritten here and there.

I'm all in with a Core set preordered from FFG to get the special damage deck, and then 1 of each upgrade pack from one of the online discount retailers.

Im in, but approaching cautiously. Maybe just sticking to a single faction for the time being.

We cant expect this is going to be just be sunshine and flowers. This is the same team that thought unlimited bombs and PS11 coordinate were a great idea just a few month back.

They had a difficult time play testing and balancing 4 ships in one new wave and we expect 2.0 to be smooth sailing with every ship getting changed and tweaked? FFG would sit by for MONTHS and watch attanni dominate the field before suggesting a change to see how things "played out".

It all sounds great on paper. The one thing that really made me pull the breaks was Alex Davy describing seismic bombs. You drop it, then choose an obstacle at range 1 and that blows up damage all ships at range 1 of obstacle. So a seismic bomb is essentially the size of a large asteroid? Things like this make me go "Hmmmm?"

yase

3 minutes ago, wurms said:

Im in, but approaching cautiously. Maybe just sticking to a single faction for the time being.

We cant expect this is going to be just be sunshine and flowers. This is the same team that thought unlimited bombs and PS11 coordinate were a great idea just a few month back.

They had a difficult time play testing and balancing 4 ships in one new wave and we expect 2.0 to be smooth sailing with every ship getting changed and tweaked? FFG would sit by for MONTHS and watch attanni dominate the field before suggesting a change to see how things "played out".

It all sounds great on paper. The one thing that really made me pull the breaks was Alex Davy describing seismic bombs. You drop it, then choose an obstacle at range 1 and that blows up damage all ships at range 1 of obstacle. So a seismic bomb is essentially the size of a large asteroid? Things like this make me go "Hmmmm?"

@BlodVargarna I know why they did it, but doesnt make sense in gameplay. Two asteroids at range 1 of seismic, choose 1, that rock blows up. That bomb covers A LARGE FIELD, and god knows what sabine does after that.

Not saying its a horrible idea, but it does make me question some 2.0 choices. Again, same team that did this:

14 minutes ago, wurms said:

@BlodVargarna I know why they did it, but doesnt make sense in gameplay. Two asteroids at range 1 of seismic, choose 1, that rock blows up. That bomb covers A LARGE FIELD, and god knows what sabine does after that.

Not saying its a horrible idea, but it does make me question some 2.0 choices. Again, same team that did this:

Don’t harsh my mellow man! Ok you’re probably right that I (and others) need to temper expectations.

*Indecisive holding pattern: Engage! Duration: Indefinite*

I'm very comfortable with waiting to see how all of this shakes out.

I've only ever played or bought Scum, so if I come around 2.0 won't break my bank.

*FreeShrugs*

2 hours ago, MtnWook said:

Out, but with a caveat. I think the new changes I have seen are good for the game but the "buy-in" is too steep for me and I feel that the Conversion Kits are just money grabs from the original/Epic/rabid players. I have worked a crap-ton of overtime to buy ships since this game started and now I will have to buy about $300 worth of Conversion Kits to make them playable at events??? Nope, not gonna happen.

To be fair, at any given event you only need a conversion for one faction, and how often do you go to events with a 100 point list of all the same ship (as max spammed generics no less)?

In.