Just now, RampancyTW said:

Hi, I live here and attend X-Wing nights. You live where, again? Not here?

Pandy is Monday nights, Saugus has one Tuesday, Malden on Thursdays. Norton and some other places south of the city have them throughout the week. They've all been running for a while.

Funny i live here too! Suagus and Norton are not part Boston as im sure you know, hence me saying the nearest one i could find aside from pandemonium was outside the city

as to "Pandy"... are you refering to Pandemonium, the store i mentioned? ive been getting my game supplies there since they 1996 when they were in the Garage and ive never heard it called that, but its a cool shorthand

an aside on your "you arent from around here" comment, I grew up in Boston and i spend 2 months a year living in Brighton. i grew up in somerville, cambridge, newton, and brighton, and I know almost all the older nerd stores pretty well, believe me ive searched for game nights. outside of Pandemonium I dont think theres one you can get to on the subway.

BTW, last time i checked Brighton was part of the city of Boston, while Saugus and Malden were not. its kinda rude to demand knowledge of someones life while claiming they are an outsider if you dont even know whats considered part of the city

TLT don’t bother me as much anymore, it’s all about hugging them and not letting go. Pretty much like Dash, stay in the doughnut

1 minute ago, Vontoothskie said:

Funny i live here too! Suagus and Norton are not part Boston as im sure you know, hence me saying the nearest one i could find aside from pandemonium was outside the city

as to "Pandy"... are you refering to Pandemonium, the store i mentioned? ive been getting my game supplies there since they 1996 when they were in the Garage and ive never heard it called that, but its a cool shorthand

an aside on your "you arent from around here" comment, I grew up in Boston and i spend 2 months a year living in Brighton. i grew up in somerville, cambridge, newton, and brighton, and I know almost all the older nerd stores pretty well, believe me ive searched for game nights. outside of Pandemonium I dont think theres one you can get to on the subway.

BTW, last time i checked Brighton was part of the city of Boston, while Saugus and Malden were not. its kinda rude to demand knowledge of someones life while claiming they are an outsider if you dont even know whats considered part of the city

They're very much part of the GBA (which is what I said I was referring to), and Saugus/Malden are closer than Framingham. Boston itself is not a large city at all, but the GBA is pretty large. I figured if you were pulling the "even in a major city like Boston!" bit, you were including the part that is actually major.

This is like saying that Tonawanda or Amherst aren't part of Buffalo, or any other city with closely attached towns and cities as part of their sprawl. You aren't wrong but you ARE being disingenuous.

And maybe instead of getting grumpy, you can pass along the info to your friends and family, eh?

Just now, DelGriffen said:

TLT don’t bother me as much anymore, it’s all about hugging them and not letting go. Pretty much like Dash, stay in the doughnut

textbook example of "easier said than done" especially given how incredibly maneuver all those ships are

it's like the secret to Saitama's good-like invincible strength being routine strength training, there's kinda more to it than that

Not, arguing it can be challenging and a TLT still could use a nerf, they just don’t make me want to rage quit anymore

6 hours ago, Dreadai said:

I find it interesting that people equate long term players quitting the game with 'the game is bad or unhealthy'.

People move from hobby to hobby and game to game all the time. That someone has played x-wing for 5 years, and is now moving to something else could be as much to do with their own mentality and approach to hobby play as with the game itself. Trying to intellectualise why you are moving to a new game is fine, but then imposing your biased view on the community serves to dissuade new people from getting in to the game that you used to love.

Conflating declining numbers at x-wing night with a perceived reduction in quality of the product, when you attend x-wing night and spend the time complaining about the game is just weird.

It's nearly as weird as the mynocks complaining about the state of the meta while reinforcing and promoting the lists that meta is comprised of. ('Raptor attack is bad for the game and broken as all **** ... hey lets all fly it at the next big tournament, and all make top 16.... now lets podcast complaining that 8 of the top 16 were the same list!') If you want to change your local meta, or your regional meta and so improve the play experience for new and old players, as a community, you must actively take steps to play things that subvert the so called 'power lists' rather than just jumping on the latest bandwagon and yelling how broken it is while rolling around in your swag brag of acrylics.

I play at home with an increasing play group and have lots of fun doing so.

That being said, I have no authority to discuss the state of the game or what is happening at a FLGS. Reading this made me think of something, overall negativity. Dreadai made valid point, if you are a long time player and complain about the game, why would new players join or more casual players want to come back/continue. There is one very clear thing about people, they all want to be part of something fun. No one says, "I can't wait to go spend hours playing a boring game!" My play group was started by me buying several pieces, bringing it over my nephews house, and saying, "Hey, this looks like fun! Let's play!!" and then we invited others and others and now we could run a dozen people on an X-Wing night. There is no meta in the group because we are trying to have fun.

To be clear, I am not saying people should just love everything that comes out. Sure, you can not like Harpoons or TIE Phantoms or TLT or whatever. There will always be something. There are things I don't like in the game. The key is to not sit around the table and complain. Have fun! Life is too short to be angry at plastic spaceships.

One thing my group is doing is planning a night where we fly things we haven't flown in awhile or ever (I'm looking at you Punisher!). Why? Because we want to use our collections and have fun.

13 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

textbook example of "easier said than done" especially given how incredibly maneuver all those ships are

it's like the secret to Saitama's good-like invincible strength being routine strength training, there's kinda more to it than that

more training? (man do i love one punch)

59 minutes ago, Vontoothskie said:

well youre obviously trying to derail discussion here, but i'll bite.

Dude. Bro. Compadre. My man.

Chill.

I already apologized for having a snarky tone. It sucks if your local scene appears to be dying. Have you tried the forums or Reddit to find other groups or stores that may not advertise online that well?

Also, that bit about Legions appears SUPER disingenuous. According to their website calendar, they don’t have dedicated nights for ANY miniatures games. So that’s like saying 40k is dead in Pittsburgh because Legions has no dedicated 40k night. Which is why anecdotes (like the ones you shared) are not grounds to say a game is in trouble.

And as for Boston, might I suggest your friends and family move to a real city? With real subways? And a couple real baseball teams? And a sizable X-Wing group right off the 4-5-6? And I’m sure stuff out in the “other” boroughs if you’re brave.

(if I actually need this disclaimer that I’m joking around, then I give up)

19 minutes ago, DelGriffen said:

TLT don’t bother me as much anymore, it’s all about hugging them and not letting go. Pretty much like Dash, stay in the doughnut

Sure, if they don‘t have bombs, primary turrets, or ps11 boost.

But for these cases: teach me your ways!

9 minutes ago, FatherTurin said:

Dude. Bro. Compadre. My man.

Chill.

I already apologized for having a snarky tone. It sucks if your local scene appears to be dying. Have you tried the forums or Reddit to find other groups or stores that may not advertise online that well?

Also, that bit about Legions appears SUPER disingenuous. According to their website calendar, they don’t have dedicated nights for ANY miniatures games. So that’s like saying 40k is dead in Pittsburgh because Legions has no dedicated 40k night. Which is why anecdotes (like the ones you shared) are not grounds to say a game is in trouble.

And as for Boston, might I suggest your friends and family move to a real city? With real subways? And a couple real baseball teams? And a sizable X-Wing group right off the 4-5-6? And I’m sure stuff out in the “other” boroughs if you’re brave.

(if I actually need this disclaimer that I’m joking around, then I give up)

All joking aside, the public transportation isn't particularly awesome and a big part of the issue here is a lack of game stores that have game nights period. There are some retail spaces and board game cafes. It's one of the reasons why I asked him about transportation issues, outside of a dedicated WH40K store and a couple places that do Magic nights there just isn't a particularly large gaming market in Boston itself.

Having car access opens up your options a ton in the area, though.

4 minutes ago, FatherTurin said:

Dude. Bro. Compadre. My man.

Chill.

I already apologized for having a snarky tone.

malcolm_firefly.gif

ASIDE: @Vontoothskie @RampancyTW I've been looking for casual X-wing in the greater Boston area and can't seem to find anything that isn't prohibitively far (I have a car, but driving to Saugus from here at 6-7pm on a weeknight seems like a special brand of torture I just can't bring myself to attempt, and Pandemonium only has a weekly store tourney listed which doesn't sound super casual). If yall (or anyone else, don't be shy!) is possessed of the arcane secrets of Boston-area X-wing I'd sure appreciate a pm to help point me in the right direction!

Just now, nexttwelveexits said:

ASIDE: @Vontoothskie @RampancyTW I've been looking for casual X-wing in the greater Boston area and can't seem to find anything that isn't prohibitively far (I have a car, but driving to Saugus from here at 6-7pm on a weeknight seems like a special brand of torture I just can't bring myself to attempt, and Pandemonium only has a weekly store tourney listed which doesn't sound super casual). If yall (or anyone else, don't be shy!) is possessed of the arcane secrets of Boston-area X-wing I'd sure appreciate a pm to help point me in the right direction!

There are casual and/or Armada nights at Pandemonium on Sundays! Depends who's going to be there what gets played I think. Feel free to come out to Monday nights, though, we have a pretty broad range of player skill and lists. I travel a ton for work, but there are a bunch of regulars that are there pretty much every week and it's a great crew of people. The traffic thing really does make getting to some of the other locations less... fun than it could be, but there are a bunch of options if you're willing to put up with it. Feel free to PM me if you want to e-meet and/or do some live X-Winging!

50 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

it's like the secret to Saitama's good-like invincible strength being routine strength training, there's kinda more to it than that

Well yeah... you can't run the AC either, that's key

I am very anti-nerf, because, well, nerfing has caused half of this situation. And second, no matter how much you nerf, there will always be a couple top ship lists in the meta. Third, let it sink in for a few waves of new stuff before yelling "It is overpowered."

The meta is very much like an ecosystem. If you take the APEX predator out (in this case the JumpMaster 5000), something will rise up and take its place. Things have been heavily nerfed in the past that were meant to keep the current meta under control. One of the best ways to deal with TLT's was Biggs and/or an Alpha Strike. Those things have been Nerfed, so now you are dealing with TLTs. When the next wave is released, more than likely the meta will change yet again.

Currently, the top of the meta lists are defeatable with a well flown well crafted alternative lists as proven by regional tournaments.

The meta is not Triple Jumpmasters, it is not TIE Phantoms. The meta is not in a bad place.

And again, THERE WILL ALWAYS BE TOP META LISTS, no matter how much you nerf. It is the nature of the point system.


Now that being said, I do think every ship should have a useful niche role to play in the game and some ships definitely need buffs and find a unique role in the game. I also think the "recognizable" should be higher on the power curb. (Basically the X-Wing and TIE Fighter.)

The bottom of the meta needs more attention than the top.

24 minutes ago, nexttwelveexits said:

ASIDE: @Vontoothskie @RampancyTW I've been looking for casual X-wing in the greater Boston area and can't seem to find anything that isn't prohibitively far (I have a car, but driving to Saugus from here at 6-7pm on a weeknight seems like a special brand of torture I just can't bring myself to attempt, and Pandemonium only has a weekly store tourney listed which doesn't sound super casual). If yall (or anyone else, don't be shy!) is possessed of the arcane secrets of Boston-area X-wing I'd sure appreciate a pm to help point me in the right direction!

this. Other than Pandemonium, it can take 1+ hours of travel to each way to reach the places people are describing as "in Boston" from most of Boston. also am i hearing it right that Pandemonium dropped tuesday night x-wing? if so that's yet another example of the decline in popularity of the game.

and for those getting nasty about it, no one here is saying we want the game to die, exactly the opposite we want it to thrive.

unfortunate decisions by FFG have pushed some players to leave the game though, and that is the real topic. If X-wing is declining, why? how do we stop that decline? and how do we get new players in? to me that all comes down to balance, fun, and lower price points for entry

3 minutes ago, Jadotch said:

I am very anti-nerf, because, well, nerfing has caused half of this situation. And second, no matter how much you nerf, there will always be a couple top ship lists in the meta. Third, let it sink in for a few waves of new stuff before yelling "It is overpowered."

The meta is very much like an ecosystem. If you take the APEX predator out (in this case the JumpMaster 5000), something will rise up and take its place. Things have been heavily nerfed in the past that were meant to keep the current meta under control. One of the best ways to deal with TLT's was Biggs and/or an Alpha Strike. Those things have been Nerfed, so now you are dealing with TLTs. When the next wave is released, more than likely the meta will change yet again.

Currently, the top of the meta lists are defeatable with a well flown well crafted alternative lists as proven by regional tournaments.

The meta is not Triple Jumpmasters, it is not TIE Phantoms. The meta is not in a bad place.

And again, THERE WILL ALWAYS BE TOP META LISTS, no matter how much you nerf. It is the nature of the point system.


Now that being said, I do think every ship should have a useful niche role to play in the game and some ships definitely need buffs and find a unique role in the game. I also think the "recognizable" should be higher on the power curb. (Basically the X-Wing and TIE Fighter.)

Jadotch, if one is to understand “the great mystery” one must study all it’s aspects, not just the dogmatic narrow view of the anti-nerf purists. If you wish to become a complete and wise leader, you must embrace a larger view of the Design. Only through Nerfing can you achieve a power greater than any designer!

1 hour ago, DelGriffen said:

TLT don’t bother me as much anymore, it’s all about hugging them and not letting go. Pretty much like Dash, stay in the doughnut

How's that work against Miranda who can tag you with a 4 dice PWT at Range 1? Or Ghosts with 2 Arcs (5 dice) and PS 11 Coordinate?

56 minutes ago, FatherTurin said:

Dude. Bro. Compadre. My man.

Chill.

I already apologized for having a snarky tone. It sucks if your local scene appears to be dying. Have you tried the forums or Reddit to find other groups or stores that may not advertise online that well?

Also, that bit about Legions appears SUPER disingenuous. According to their website calendar, they don’t have dedicated nights for ANY miniatures games. So that’s like saying 40k is dead in Pittsburgh because Legions has no dedicated 40k night. Which is why anecdotes (like the ones you shared) are not grounds to say a game is in trouble.

And as for Boston, might I suggest your friends and family move to a real city? With real subways? And a couple real baseball teams? And a sizable X-Wing group right off the 4-5-6? And I’m sure stuff out in the “other” boroughs if you’re brave.

(if I actually need this disclaimer that I’m joking around, then I give up)

Compade-friend... whats super disingenuous is to claim Legions doesn't have schedualed events. I mean wow. Every friday from 8:00 pm to 3:00 am is warhammer, pokemon and yugiyoh are saturday, mtg is friday and saturday, open play is all weekend. they have a board with the schedual in the store, and the employees or owner are happy to fill you in. maybe get the scoop before you put it in print, lol

Btw in the 90s the NY subway was voted inferior to Bostons by an urban planning commision from Europe. they were looking for a highly efficient system as a model to replicate, and we won on the grounds that you didnt need ancestral knowledge to read the map. so in short, my subway will kill your subway bruh, CUZ IT HITS LIKE A TRAIN!!!

you have my blessing to sass our **** sports ball teams though, cuz ugh.

10 minutes ago, Vontoothskie said:

this. Other than Pandemonium, it can take 1+ hours of travel to each way to reach the places people are describing as "in Boston" from most of Boston. also am i hearing it right that Pandemonium dropped tuesday night x-wing? if so that's yet another example of the decline in popularity of the game.

and for those getting nasty about it, no one here is saying we want the game to die, exactly the opposite we want it to thrive.

unfortunate decisions by FFG have pushed some players to leave the game though, and that is the real topic. If X-wing is declining, why? how do we stop that decline? and how do we get new players in? to me that all comes down to balance, fun, and lower price points for entry

Pandemonium simply swapped to Mondays from Tuesdays. They didn't drop anything.

WRT to other stores in the area you're considering Boston, there's just a simple lack of stores that do general game nights at all. Lots of Magic nights, a dedicated WH40K store, and military reenactment miniatures-focused store are your options, and none of that has anything to do with X-Wing's status as a game.

11 minutes ago, Vontoothskie said:

Compade-friend... whats super disingenuous is to claim Legions doesn't have schedualed events. I mean wow. Every friday from 8:00 pm to 3:00 am is warhammer, pokemon and yugiyoh are saturday, mtg is friday and saturday, open play is all weekend. they have a board with the schedual in the store, and the employees or owner are happy to fill you in. maybe get the scoop before you put it in print, lol

Btw in the 90s the NY subway was voted inferior to Bostons by an urban planning commision from Europe. they were looking for a highly efficient system as a model to replicate, and we won on the grounds that you didnt need ancestral knowledge to read the map. so in short, my subway will kill your subway bruh, CUZ IT HITS LIKE A TRAIN!!!

you have my blessing to sass our **** sports ball teams though, cuz ugh.

Hey man, I was just going by the website, so my bad on that. Tell them to update their site ?.

About the subway though, don’t you be knocking the good old NYC subway. It gets you anywhere you want to go, as long as that isn’t cross town. If you have to cross the island, may god have mercy on your soul. Or, you know, walk. As a New Yorker (well, bridge and tunnel, really, but close enough), I can diss the subway, but a Bostonian with the chutzpah to denegrate our wonderful sewer trains? I demand satisfaction, good sir!

So to sum up, as long as your destination isn’t too far away from one of the two or three major avenues, it’s awesome.

Oh, and ancestral knowledge helps, but you really need to consult the bones, get a tarot reading and make a small sacrifice to the transportation gods just to figure out what lines are running on a weekend. And when your train will show up. And to protect you from that....is that a rat, or a dog?

I think, however, that civic pride aside, we can agree on an intellectual level that we all kinda wish we had DC’s metro. It’s so nice.

I also have nothing really bad to say about the Red Sox. I’m a Phillies fan myself (long story), it just felt like something a New Yorker has to say to a Bostonian. I think it’s a law or something.

Just now, RampancyTW said:

Pandemonium simply swapped to Mondays from Tuesdays. They didn't drop anything.

WRT to other stores in the area you're considering Boston, there's just a simple lack of stores that do general game nights at all. Lots of Magic nights, a dedicated WH40K store, and military reenactment miniatures-focused store are your options, and none of that has anything to do with X-Wing's status as a game.

my original point was that i've spent time trying to find games in 3 large cities in the past few years, and where it used to be very easy to do so, it no longer is. this is anecdotal, but leads me to believe(in conjunction with what others say on this board) that the game is in decline. My play group is down to me and 1 other regular person, everyone else decided the game was going in a direction they didnt like.

unless i switched threads accidentally(which i've done, lol), that's what we were talking about here. a large group on this forum are frustrated and an equally large group are claiming they have no right or reason to be upset.

what i've noticed is that its a lot of the older accounts saying the game needs an overhaul, while mostly new posters(or posters i don't recognize) are saying the game is in a good state. that leads me to believe that the people who have been playing longer have moved on or are thinking about it, which is not good, as retention is how these games survive. i see custom painted ships people proudly displayed on here for sale with entire collections too, which is a good sign people are leaving. we need old players to want to keep playing not, just new sales of product to new players for FFG

38 minutes ago, Jadotch said:

I am very anti-nerf, because, well, nerfing has caused half of this situation. And second, no matter how much you nerf, there will always be a couple top ship lists in the meta. Third, let it sink in for a few waves of new stuff before yelling "It is overpowered."

The meta is very much like an ecosystem. If you take the APEX predator out (in this case the JumpMaster 5000), something will rise up and take its place. Things have been heavily nerfed in the past that were meant to keep the current meta under control. One of the best ways to deal with TLT's was Biggs and/or an Alpha Strike. Those things have been Nerfed, so now you are dealing with TLTs. When the next wave is released, more than likely the meta will change yet again.

Currently, the top of the meta lists are defeatable with a well flown well crafted alternative lists as proven by regional tournaments.

The meta is not Triple Jumpmasters, it is not TIE Phantoms. The meta is not in a bad place.

And again, THERE WILL ALWAYS BE TOP META LISTS, no matter how much you nerf. It is the nature of the point system.


Now that being said, I do think every ship should have a useful niche role to play in the game and some ships definitely need buffs and find a unique role in the game. I also think the "recognizable" should be higher on the power curb. (Basically the X-Wing and TIE Fighter.)

The bottom of the meta needs more attention than the top.

Sorry man, but this is kind of silly

Nerfs got us from very narrow list pressence to 'oh hey, we're starting see something other than jumps and nymranda come out of the woodwork". They've obviously improved the competitive landscape and the game overall

Also, alphas weren't nerfed at all. If anything Harpoons are FAR more dangerous than anything a scout could fart out. Problem is these super turrets can alpha just as hard, down to literally carrying Harpoons themselves

second, it's a fallacy to give up improving simply because things will never be perfect. Nothing will ever be perfect, doesn't mean you come to a standstill for the rest of your days

The game is better than it had been with the utter dominance of very few ship types. It could be better, ie the gap between the best and everything else could become less vast and abyssal

Just because there will be a top dog doesn't mean we should stop trying to give everyone some sort of fighting chance

Especially given the state of wave 7 saw some **** good variety at the top table of world's

The biggest problem with the game currently is that we're still getting turrets that can perform basically every facet of gameplay better than even specialized ships. This really ought to change

6 minutes ago, FatherTurin said:

Hey man, I was just going by the website, so my bad on that. Tell them to update their site ?.

About the subway though, don’t you be knocking the good old NYC subway. It gets you anywhere you want to go, as long as that isn’t cross town. If you have to cross the island, may god have mercy on your soul. Or, you know, walk. As a New Yorker (well, bridge and tunnel, really, but close enough), I can diss the subway, but a Bostonian with the chutzpah to denegrate our wonderful sewer trains? I demand satisfaction, good sir!

So to sum up, as long as your destination isn’t too far away from one of the two or three major avenues, it’s awesome.

Oh, and ancestral knowledge helps, but you really need to consult the bones, get a tarot reading and make a small sacrifice to the transportation gods just to figure out what lines are running on a weekend. And when your train will show up. And to protect you from that....is that a rat, or a dog?

I think, however, that civic pride aside, we can agree on an intellectual level that we all kinda wish we had DC’s metro. It’s so nice.

I also have nothing really bad to say about the Red Sox. I’m a Phillies fan myself (long story), it just felt like something a New Yorker has to say to a Bostonian. I think it’s a law or something.

Sadly You cant call off Boston Subway pride dude. one of us has to die now. sorry, but you chose the wrong ride. see you in ****

2 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Sorry man, but this is kind of silly

Nerfs got us from very narrow list pressence to 'oh hey, we're starting see something other than jumps and nymranda come out of the woodwork". They've obviously improved the competitive landscape and the game overall

second, it's a fallacy to give up improving simply because things will never be perfect. Nothing will ever be perfect, doesn't mean you come to a standstill for the rest of your days

The game is better than it had been with the utter dominance of very few ship types. It could be better, ie the gap between the best and everything else could become less vast and abyssal

Just because there will be a top dog doesn't mean we should stop trying to give everyone some sort of fighting chance

Especially given the state of wave 7 saw some dam good variety at the top table of world's

Sometimes nerfs are necessary (See TIE Phantoms and Jumpmaster, and I will even concede Biggs to buff the X-Wing as a whole) but a lot of the time they cause just as much imbalance than before they were nerfed.