16 minutes ago, Pooleman said:

I think TLT is fine. I’m getting to the point where I support a nerf just so people will stop complaining about it.

In a vacuum its fine (really good, but not OP). However, certain ships can really exploit it like Miranda and the Ghost.

edit: Just thought of it, but add this to TLT: After you complete your 2nd attack, receive a weapons disable token.

Basically ruins the Ghost TLT build, but doesn't effect Aggressors/Y-wings with TLTs.

For Miranda just make her primary or arc only for her ability. She'd still be really good, but not ridiculous.

Ok, so before I talk nerfs, I'd like to clarify that I don't super care. My local meta is pretty wholesome anyway so I don't really care that much about the errata/FAQ. I just want a new errata so that the majority of the local X-Wingers who ragequit a month or two ago when their scum stuff couldn't win come back.

The new FAQ either has to be small or enourmous. There is a careful balance of the meta, and as soon as you pull one thing out, another thing comes in and wrecks everything.

Harpoons: are bad. But also neccesary. I don't super care that they "make arcs matter", because they're still overpowered BS, and frustratingly un-StarWarsey (and if you don't think lore/feel is driving players away, think again). But they're absolutely needed to prevent weird disgusting defensive tanks from destroying everything. Nerf them, and you've gotta nerf everything else. If you're gonna do that, I think requiring a Target Lock spend is fine - other than that, the complexity of the condition makes them about on par with most other missiles. But make sure they're on the bottom of the nerf list.

Miranda: is a problem. I think making her ability only apply to primaries is the most elegant way to fix it. Other than that, she's actually ok. I don't really mind K-Wings in general. It's just Miranda and TLT.

TLT: Like Harpoons, you don't want to act too hastily here. I'm sure Imperial Ace players wouldn't mind this getting nerfed, but that's who this is balancing. Remove TLT, and it gets so much harder to do small amounts of consistent damage (which is what aces hate). I have been playing long enough to remember when people complained about playing "ace-wing".

Dash: probably too good, but not as stupid broken. I don't know how to nerf him though. The HLC-turret is his thing, and when he's out-PSed, there's viable counterplay. A slight nerf might help here.

VI/Adaptablity: its a problem for listbuilding. But maybe not for meta. I'm a strong advocate for a PS9 cap, but Kylo, Soontir, and Vader quickly get stupid broken in that meta. So do you want to have to nerf all three of those too?

Sheathipede: problem here. I don't know how to fix it. I think the easiest right now is a hard nerf ala Jumpmaster: remove all the EPTs. Note that Fenn is still just as much of a problem if you do the PS9 cap though. So in that case, I'd just blank out his entire ability. highest PS coordinate is good enough. He doesn't need any ability too. And droid+crew is just too good.

Auzituck: too defensive and tanky. I'd say that the small-ship reinforce can be treated as an evade token for all card text purposes, allowing Homing Missiles, Old Teroch, Wes Janson, etc. to counterplay.

Ventress: ok she's technically a Clone Wars character who died before Episode III, so I think it's funny that none of the prequels-haters have complained about how prevalent she is. But she's actually fine game-balance-wise. There's counterplay and stuff.

So in summary, I'd suggest one of these two:

THE BIG NERF

Harpoons: Spend Target Lock

Miranda: Primary Only

Fenn: blank ability

Advanced Sensors: doesn't work with PTL (Kylo nerf)

Soontir: change to "when you receive a stress token, if you do not have a focus token, you may receive a focus token"

Sheathipede: remove droid upgrade

Small Ship Reinforce: can remove/ignore like evade

Rules Changes: PS9 cap, add range bonuses to cannons and turrets.

the little nerf

Miranda: Primary Only

Sheathipede: Remove EPT

Small Ship Reinforce: can remove/ignore like evade

1 minute ago, FatherTurin said:

I think I found the Nym/Miranda player.

Edit: possibly Ghost/Fenn

Not necessarily. I'm a HWK player, so likewise think TLT is fine (at least for my HWKs). I also don't mind VI. And I have not flown either of the lists you mentioned.

1 hour ago, FatherTurin said:

Out of curiosity, why shadowcasters? I feel like it’s one of the most well designed large ships FFG has ever released? It’s a strong ship that rewards positioning and planning, and at the same time it can be counter-played, unlike traditional turrets.

No large ship should ever have green turns. Especially one that is not arc-locked.

Have you noticed how the large ships with normal arcs have by far the worst dials in the game? The U-Wing should have green turns. The Aggressor should have green turns. Not ships with turrets and extra arcs.

Either you have a great dial OR you have a turret. That should have been the primary design principle of this game.

Just now, SabineKey said:

Not necessarily. I'm a HWK player, so likewise think TLT is fine (at least for my HWKs). I also don't mind VI. And I have not flown either of the lists you mentioned.

I know, I edited my post to make it more clear that I was joking around and to not look like a complete a-hole.

I still maintain that PS should have a cap, but *shrug*

1 hour ago, AlexW said:

I think you actually agree with the poster you are quoting.

The other post was about Dash being considered "wholesome" I was just saying that not all posters consider him so.

1 hour ago, Lightningclaw said:

I thought plungers fixed problems.

Plungers fix the toilet but in my metaphor the game was the stuff heading down the toilet and plungers simply send that stuff further and irretrievably down the sewer pipe.

Just now, FatherTurin said:

I know, I edited my post to make it more clear that I was joking around and to not look like a complete a-hole.

I still maintain that PS should have a cap, but *shrug*

And I could get behind that, though I think it would be more of a shift of problems than an actual solution. Some would find it better, others would find it worse. Unfortunately, that's what quite a few proposed fixes boil down to.

Let's avoid treating Reinforce like evade.

You want Juking Wookiees? Because that's nightmare fuel.

Reinforce should need to be spent to add the evade.

5 minutes ago, FatherTurin said:

I know, I edited my post to make it more clear that I was joking around and to not look like a complete a-hole.

I still maintain that PS should have a cap, but *shrug*

I get you and agree.....high PS should be for the grand pilots and not a pay-to-play kind of add-on.

3 minutes ago, SabineKey said:

And I could get behind that, though I think it would be more of a shift of problems than an actual solution. Some would find it better, others would find it worse. Unfortunately, that's what quite a few proposed fixes boil down to.

This. Well prophesied sir, and well penned.

Maybe I was to harsh on TLT even.... on lesser ships, it is a nice weapon, like HWKs and Aggressors; wouldn't want to hamper them. Perhaps it has the caveat about loosing certain upgrade slots instead of making it harder to use? It's really only a problem on ships that have other ways of doing damage like Miranda #1, Ghost #2 and Nym I guess #3.

13 minutes ago, Commander Kaine said:

No large ship should ever have green turns. Especially one that is not arc-locked.

Have you noticed how the large ships with normal arcs have by far the worst dials in the game? The U-Wing should have green turns. The Aggressor should have green turns. Not ships with turrets and extra arcs.

Either you have a great dial OR you have a turret. That should have been the primary design principle of this game.

You know, you have a point. I was about to pull an “akshually!!!!” and go through other ships with green turns and alternative arcs or turrets, but...there aren’t any. The Lancer is literally the only ship in the game that isn’t arc locked and has green turns. So, point taken.

I would counter that the arc can only be rotated with an action (or a mod), but that belies the fact that it’s still a better Slave 1, even if you don’t move the arc. So my last point is just that screaming around the board with 3 turns results in a ship that feels barely controlled (I fly a PtL Asajj, so I’m good friends with the 3 turn).

But still, you have a point and I acknowledge that the shadowcaster does break that mold.

Edit: yes, technically Rainbow Dash has “green” turns, but you pay for that. And that’s one of the reasons Dash is a little OP.

1 hour ago, FatherTurin said:

Out of curiosity, why shadowcasters? I feel like it’s one of the most well designed large ships FFG has ever released? It’s a strong ship that rewards positioning and planning, and at the same time it can be counter-played, unlike traditional turrets.

The thing that has always irked me on shadowcasters is the 2 Agility. How does a ship simliar in size and style to the Ghost & Decimator (0 Ag) have a better agility than a Bwing (1 Ag) ?!? Knock it down to a 1 Ag ship and I think its better balanced.

The 3 green turns are a bit much too.

The Nerf Herding is strong in this thread.

The game is fairly well balanced. There will always be a few ships that rise to the top, but right now all the top meta can be beat. It is not triple Jumpmasters (what a dumb name) or TIE Phantoms anymore.

5 minutes ago, FatherTurin said:

You know, you have a point. I was about to pull an “akshually!!!!” and go through other ships with green turns and alternative arcs or turrets, but...there aren’t any. The Lancer is literally the only ship in the game that isn’t arc locked and has green turns. So, point taken.

I would counter that the arc can only be rotated with an action (or a mod), but that belies the fact that it’s still a better Slave 1, even if you don’t move the arc. So my last point is just that screaming around the board with 3 turns results in a ship that feels barely controlled (I fly a PtL Asajj, so I’m good friends with the 3 turn).

But still, you have a point and I acknowledge that the shadowcaster does break that mold.

well, "akshually", the JMK has green turn, but only on one side. (Which, again, would be fine if the other side was mostly red.

8 minutes ago, bydand said:

Let's avoid treating Reinforce like evade.

You want Juking Wookiees? Because that's nightmare fuel.

Reinforce should need to be spent to add the evade.

Not as an evade, but as a token similar to evade/focus. Then Wes, Carnor, Teroch, Bullseye, ect can affect it.

Just now, Commander Kaine said:

well, "akshually", the JMK has green turn, but only on one side. (Which, again, would be fine if the other side was mostly red.

You got me. After the last FAQ I forgot they existed.

How about if Reinforce gave a weapons disabled token as well?

Here’s my question on Lancers/Shadowcasters:

Do people honestly think they are in the same league as broken/OP/NPE stuff like Nym, Miranda, Ghost/Fenn? Or is it just the trickle down effect, that it’s in the next tier of effective stuff (I’d argue below Dash) and so it is starting to enter the crosshairs?

im seriously asking. I have never flown against a shadowcaster, and people have never kvetched about my Asajj list (granted I don’t think it’s considered hyper competitive):

Asajj w/PtL, Latts, Glitterstim, Title, Gyroscopic Targeting

2 TLT/Unhinged Thugs

Am I just playing a “nice” shadowcaster?

1 minute ago, DXCrazytrain said:

How about if Reinforce gave a weapons disabled token as well?

Oh my god. YES.

2 minutes ago, FatherTurin said:

Here’s my question on Lancers/Shadowcasters:

Do people honestly think they are in the same league as broken/OP/NPE stuff like Nym, Miranda, Ghost/Fenn? Or is it just the trickle down effect, that it’s in the next tier of effective stuff (I’d argue below Dash) and so it is starting to enter the crosshairs?

im seriously asking. I have never flown against a shadowcaster, and people have never kvetched about my Asajj list (granted I don’t think it’s considered hyper competitive):

Asajj w/PtL, Latts, Glitterstim, Title, Gyroscopic Targeting

2 TLT/Unhinged Thugs

Am I just playing a “nice” shadowcaster?

Overall, I think it's fine in terms of power.

I dislike it from a design point of view. It does things other ships like it shouldn't be able to do. It breaks the flavor. I have a really hard time visualising how this lumbering hulk of metal is much faster than ships that were designed to be the fastest ships. It has stuff it doesn't need, in my opinion.

Does that make it a bad or OP ship? No, if it's priced right, and I think it is. I just don't like it.

Asajj/Latts is a seriously undercosted combo.

I guess i'm the only one with an issue with shadowcasters haha. I'd argue facing a timewalk asajj is more frustrating that facing dash with player skill being equal, for me anyways.

- Miranda would be fine if her regen had a different limitation of some kind (primary? in arc?)

- TLT would be fine with the numerous different ideas brought about

- harpoons would be fine if you had to spend the lock

- coordinate would be fine if it was range 1 or small base only or couldn't be used for boost/roll actions.

- reinforce with a weapons disabled token is an interesting idea... but too hard a nerf?

- r2d2/r5p9 would be fine if during deployment you put shield tokens = to ships shield value on the upgrade and pulled from there for regen.

Nerf TLT/Harpoon/Coordinate/Reinforce/R2d2/r5p9 - Dash BB8 Poe becomes top meta list.

27 minutes ago, DXCrazytrain said:

How about if Reinforce gave a weapons disabled token as well?

Nah, that's too harsh. And I HATE reinforce. Receive a stress token after assigning the reinforce token would be more interesting. It limits next turns movements (can't hard 2 and reinforce endlessly) and shuts down expertise use as an EPT.

36 minutes ago, FatherTurin said:

You got me. After the last FAQ I forgot they existed.

4 Trickshot Scouts just won a Regional.

No stopping them.

Fuming

And

Quaking.

It is the lifeblood of this game, isn't it??

1 hour ago, DXCrazytrain said:

How about if Reinforce gave a weapons disabled token as well?

That would all but remove it from any usefulness, except for Lowhhrick's ability - which is the only really OP use of the Auzituck. That would leave the Lowhhrick formations just as tanky and frustrating but less damaging, making it even more boring and unfun to play against. Your proposed reinforce nerf would make every other Auzituck near-enough useless (reinforce is basically the whole point of them) and they're not OP at all.