Might as well have a list of things that got nerfed but didn't need it.

I'll start:

IF! Cymoon +7 Assault Gozantis

I'm not sure if this fits in the list of things that were intended to be hit, but Quasar+Demo+3.

11 minutes ago, Npmartian said:

IF! Cymoon +7 Assault Gozantis

The whole point of the Nerf was to remove lists like this from the game. And im glad they did. There is just no tactic or skill to it, bringing your ISD into the optimal position just by having way more activations than your opponent. Activation Spam is a lazy and boring mechanic and a lot of other games confirm this. It was the same issue with the officers in Imperial Assault, in the WOTC Star Wars Miniatures Game and in lots of other games relying on alternating activation systems.

2 minutes ago, >kkj said:

The whole point of the Nerf was to remove lists like this from the game. And im glad they did. There is just no tactic or skill to it, bringing your ISD into the optimal position just by having way more activations than your opponent. Activation Spam is a lazy and boring mechanic and a lot of other games confirm this. It was the same issue with the officers in Imperial Assault, in the WOTC Star Wars Miniatures Game and in lots of other games relying on alternating activation systems.

This list isn't about positioning the ISD for a big shot, it's about whittling other ships down with the death of a thousand cuts.

1 minute ago, Formynder4 said:

This list isn't about positioning the ISD for a big shot, it's about whittling other ships down with the death of a thousand cuts.

You say that. A experienced player at a tournament will always know how to abuse those 8 activations to set up unfair and frustrating conditions for his big hitter.

I'm really excited to build lists with 2, and only 2 Flotillas in mind. Will make for a lot more variety!

50 minutes ago, Npmartian said:

Might as well have a list of things that got nerfed but didn't need it.

I'll start:

IF! Cymoon +7 Assault Gozantis

From tournament play not casual.

"Oh, no, my list that won through technically abusing game mechanics is no longer playable thanks to this nerf! So tragic, much sad, ZERO SYMPATHY."

Fish Farm is dead, 1+X is dead, 2+3 is dead. Thank. Flipping. Goodness.

More on topic, lets see what lists were actually harmed by this change. The presence of flotillas wasn't just about activation spam (though it certainly helped some lists with that), it was also about providing cheap platforms for a number of support upgrades including officers, titles, Fleet Support cards, and Offensive Retrofits.

Lists that are likely dead:

2+3 Yavaris Aces: So many changes to this list archetype and good ****ing riddance. This list is dead. D-E-A-D dead. The flotilla cap has reduced the number of functional squadron augmentation upgrades (and bonus activations), Gallant Haven no longer makes squadrons immune to small damage amounts, and Yavaris can no longer scoot and double tap bombers or CAP squadrons. The Relay nerf has only affected this list significantly by making cross-board token farming more difficult, as compact organization into an impenetrable brick of heavily augmented squadrons is a highlight of this archetype.

1+X farm lists (Cymoon+flots, Fish Farm): These lists will still exist in some form, but with slightly fewer activations and likely minus any squadron cover they might have incorporated. This is going to be as much due to the change to Relay as the reduction in flotillas. We'll see far less in the way of board-spanning farm operations with fewer flotillas and limited relay distances.
@Tokra 's Bull**** pocket carrier lists: This is the biggest loss to Germany since the War! (joking, joking) But in all seriousness, the idea of playing a half dozen scattering flotillas and activating squadron screens from across the board to eliminate enemy squads and a few small targets was very effective and very safe (though its overall power was somewhat diminished over the last few waves). And it is now very, very much finished. Of all the list archetypes available, this one is the most thoroughly eliminated from competition play as it is the one most dependent on the major nerfs to Flotillas and Relay.

I'm happy with the nerfs, but I think I would have liked 1 flotilla for each capital ship you have and not a hard cap at 2. most list I play never had more than 2 flotillas, but i'm not a play tester so i'm sure this is the correct course. I am very excited to see how the FAQ changes the game up, it will definitely be interesting to see the lists that come to worlds.

13 minutes ago, thecactusman17 said:

So many changes to this list archetype and good ****ing riddance. This list is dead. D-E-A-D dead.

“Mr Kim, if you had to describe how dead it is in one word, what would it be?”

”Cadaveriffic!”

My Sato railgun transports. Three combat transports with disposable capacitors accompanied by a MC30 and Salvation and all rogue squadrons. I won a small tourney with it.

I really hate the hard limit of two. I think making them be tabled when all ships are gone would have been enough, or some other kind of soft limiter.

18 minutes ago, thecactusman17 said:

@Tokra 's Bull**** pocket carrier lists: This is the biggest loss to Germany since the War! (joking, joking) But in all seriousness, the idea of playing a half dozen scattering flotillas and activating squadron screens from across the board to eliminate enemy squads and a few small targets was very effective and very safe (though its overall power was somewhat diminished over the last few waves). And it is now very, very much finished. Of all the list archetypes available, this one is the most thoroughly eliminated from competition play as it is the one most dependent on the major nerfs to Flotillas and Relay.

Two times now. Both of the last two FAQ really messed up with my lists. I were for sure not the only one who saw the potential in the flotilla. But i really abused it at maximum. Flotilla swarm (even to the point with no combat ship at all), squadron swarm, relay abuse over the whole map.

Yes, i have to admit that this FAQ totally killed my list that i was testing for worlds. 3 weeks for nothing....
But on the other hand it messed up some of the lists i was testing against, so these are out as well (Yavaris aces, Last/first with 6+ activations). Sadly this nerf really pushed one list extremely. I bet we will see a ton of Raddus on the worlds after this FAQ. It was not nerfed at all, and even came out stronger.

But to answer the original question: None. No list got nerfed but didn't need it. The lists, who had more than two flotilla, did so to abuse it. Either for activations, as squadron carrier, or as lifeboat (park a flotilla far away, and you cannot get tabled). And this abuse got removed now with the FAQ. No one was using 3+ flotilla because they are so great.

Well, there is maybe one list that got nerfed but didn't deserve it. The 11+ Gozanti Screed version that no one really played . This list really used the Gozanti as combat ship.

3 minutes ago, Tokra said:

Two times now. Both of the last two FAQ really messed up with my lists. I were for sure not the only one who saw the potential in the flotilla. But i really abused it at maximum. Flotilla swarm (even to the point with no combat ship at all), squadron swarm, relay abuse over the whole map.

Yes, i have to admit that this FAQ totally killed my list that i was testing for worlds. 3 weeks for nothing....
But on the other hand it messed up some of the lists i was testing against, so these are out as well (Yavaris aces, Last/first with 6+ activations). Sadly this nerf really pushed one list extremely. I bet we will see a ton of Raddus on the worlds after this FAQ. It was not nerfed at all, and even came out stronger.

But to answer the original question: None. No list got nerfed but didn't need it. The lists, who had more than two flotilla, did so to abuse it. Either for activations, as squadron carrier, or as lifeboat (park a flotilla far away, and you cannot get tabled). And this abuse got removed now with the FAQ. No one was using 3+ flotilla because they are so great.

Well, there is maybe one list that got nerfed but didn't deserve it. The 11+ Gozanti Screed version that no one really played . This list really used the Gozanti as combat ship.

I'm disappointed to see my Slicer Teams Gozanti Knife Fight setup from the VWC get nerfed, that was fun to play and involved lots of engagement.

Thrawn's Regenerating Avenger
Author: Cynanbloodbane

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 400/400

Commander: Grand Admiral Thrawn

Assault Objective: Advanced Gunnery
Defense Objective: Hyperspace Assault
Navigation Objective: Dangerous Territory

[ flagship ] Imperial Star Destroyer Kuat Refit (112 points)
- Grand Admiral Thrawn ( 32 points)
- Avenger ( 5 points)
- Damage Control Officer ( 5 points)
- Boarding Troopers ( 3 points)
- Electronic Countermeasures ( 7 points)
- SW-7 Ion Batteries ( 5 points)
- Assault Concussion Missiles ( 7 points)
= 176 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Quad Laser Turrets ( 5 points)
- Repair Crews ( 4 points)
= 32 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Suppressor ( 4 points)
- Quad Laser Turrets ( 5 points)
- Repair Crews ( 4 points)
= 36 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Vector ( 2 points)
- Quad Laser Turrets ( 5 points)
- Repair Crews ( 4 points)
= 34 total ship cost

2 Firespray-31s ( 36 points)
3 TIE Interceptor Squadrons ( 33 points)
1 VT-49 Decimator ( 22 points)
1 Lambda-class Shuttle ( 15 points)
2 TIE Fighter Squadrons ( 16 points)
= 122 total squadron cost

Not abusing anything. An ISD with support ships and squadrons. Designed for survival.

1 minute ago, cynanbloodbane said:

Thrawn's Regenerating Avenger
Author: Cynanbloodbane

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 400/400

Commander: Grand Admiral Thrawn

Assault Objective: Advanced Gunnery
Defense Objective: Hyperspace Assault
Navigation Objective: Dangerous Territory

[ flagship ] Imperial Star Destroyer Kuat Refit (112 points)
- Grand Admiral Thrawn ( 32 points)
- Avenger ( 5 points)
- Damage Control Officer ( 5 points)
- Boarding Troopers ( 3 points)
- Electronic Countermeasures ( 7 points)
- SW-7 Ion Batteries ( 5 points)
- Assault Concussion Missiles ( 7 points)
= 176 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Quad Laser Turrets ( 5 points)
- Repair Crews ( 4 points)
= 32 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Suppressor ( 4 points)
- Quad Laser Turrets ( 5 points)
- Repair Crews ( 4 points)
= 36 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Vector ( 2 points)
- Quad Laser Turrets ( 5 points)
- Repair Crews ( 4 points)
= 34 total ship cost

2 Firespray-31s ( 36 points)
3 TIE Interceptor Squadrons ( 33 points)
1 VT-49 Decimator ( 22 points)
1 Lambda-class Shuttle ( 15 points)
2 TIE Fighter Squadrons ( 16 points)
= 122 total squadron cost

Not abusing anything. An ISD with support ships and squadrons. Designed for survival.

Sadly, these sorts of uses were the exception rather than the rule in major competition. Just like my ridiculously aggressive Slicer Flotillas list.

I'm actually a little concerned that this change has made naked flotillas even more appealing as a cost savings activation booster than they already were. When you could have as many as you wanted, it was important to make them do something to maximize their effectiveness or they were free points scurrying around the board.

Its still a kind of boring and overused setup though, the whole "just 1 combat ship and rest is flotillas"-thing. Even if you just have 3 in there. With a hard cap at 2 you at least have to include a second combat ship. Which is a good thing in my opinion.

Heya everyone. I was at work all day. What did I miss?

Slow news day. I told @geek19 to piss off. That's pretty much it.

3 minutes ago, Ardaedhel said:

Slow news day. I told @geek19 to piss off. That's pretty much it.

Cool.

9 minutes ago, BiggsIRL said:

Heya everyone. I was at work all day. What did I miss?

New Destiny article.

Just now, thecactusman17 said:

New Destiny article.

Got any more of that... Legion... stuff?

1 hour ago, Ardaedhel said:

Slow news day. I told @geek19 to piss off. That's pretty much it.

You did, it was quite mean. I was very sad about it and spent the afternoon crying. Slash working on 5S stuff for work.

1 hour ago, BiggsIRL said:

Cool.

Oh, blog fight is ON, now! I challenge you to a Friday duel! Obviously, at the top table, but should our applications get misplaced or something, I say we find a table that afternoon or night or whatever and play out for blog glory. And some sort of blog based trophy.....

2 hours ago, >kkj said:

Its still a kind of boring and overused setup though, the whole "just 1 combat ship and rest is flotillas"-thing. Even if you just have 3 in there. With a hard cap at 2 you at least have to include a second combat ship. Which is a good thing in my opinion.

Not to be rude, but I don't build lists caring what anyone but me finds "boring or over used". I care if it looks fun for me to play. In a tournament, my goal is to have fun and win. Not make it a positive experience for my opponent. I have never begrudged an opponent for any gimmicky trick in their list. I appreciate them for what they are. Plenty of gimmicky tricks remain. I look forward to trying them all.

Well said. One man's gimmicky truck is another man's sweet idea.