I'm also perfectly fine with the Flotilla nerfs. Both my Imperials and my Rebel collections only have a single flotilla each, and even that was mostly because it helped make each fleet on the table look more numerous, because I was used to games like Battlefleet Gothic which involved more numerous fleets of 8+ ships. But at the same time I hated the thought of people simply spamming them.

1 hour ago, Green Knight said:

The NEXT FAQ should do something to address some of the over/underused objectives.

I think the main problem with the overused ones are the underused ones.

@Hawkstrike I had a similar experience at my regional. Very frustrating.

At all

Having thought about it for a few hours it is still not sitting well with me. I'm going to have to make a decision when they get to fill reveals about wave 8. Here's to hoping I'm wrong

@Hawkstrike and double post? Sorry bout that.

Ok, somebody explain how the Avenger is not “Totally nerfed” with this. Most games I ran into or used one, it had a good front arc on a target and a side arc on a second target.

In group discussion, I’m getting a lot of, “Yeah this got em.” While I shrug and think this does nearly nothing to my decision on whether or not I’m taking the Avenger.

3 minutes ago, ricefrisbeetreats said:

Ok, somebody explain how the Avenger is not “Totally nerfed” with this. Most games I ran into or used one, it had a good front arc on a target and a side arc on a second target.

In group discussion, I’m getting a lot of, “Yeah this got em.” While I shrug and think this does nearly nothing to my decision on whether or not I’m taking the Avenger.

It does nothing to Avenger in 75%+ of the situations you use BTAvenger or GTAvenger. Its the other 25% where they basically nerf your 2nd shot. Its a light debuff. I ran Avenger the past 5 months and honestly it really wouldnt affect my play with the card too much besides some additional uncertainty in a few situations and I think thats the intent with the change.

1 minute ago, bleachorange said:

It does nothing to Avenger in 75%+ of the situations you use BTAvenger or GTAvenger. Its the other 25% where they basically nerf your 2nd shot. Its a light debuff.

It also removes the case of Avenger flak, not that that's incredibly common either.

1 minute ago, Arcwelder said:

It also removes the case of Avenger flak, not that that's incredibly common either.

I don't think I've ever actually had that be a thing. Interesting.

1 minute ago, bleachorange said:

I don't think I've ever actually had that be a thing. Interesting.

It's only ever mattered once for me- securing me an 8-3 at Regionals by one flak die when the opponent's scatter had been Sloane'd.

13 minutes ago, bleachorange said:

It does nothing to Avenger in 75%+ of the situations you use BTAvenger or GTAvenger. Its the other 25% where they basically nerf your 2nd shot. Its a light debuff. I ran Avenger the past 5 months and honestly it really wouldnt affect my play with the card too much besides some additional uncertainty in a few situations and I think thats the intent with the change.

Ok so it’s as I thought. From the impression of people I spoke to, this killed the BTAvenger. I argued it does almost nothing to the Avenger because looking back in my own games, it’s come up like once where I either had 2 arcs on the ship that got hit by boarding team. Sounds like another case of theorycrafting being super useless in a complex game like this.

Any rebel transports people are willing to just give away?

Hahahahahaha

19 minutes ago, ricefrisbeetreats said:

Ok so it’s as I thought. From the impression of people I spoke to, this killed the BTAvenger. I argued it does almost nothing to the Avenger because looking back in my own games, it’s come up like once where I either had 2 arcs on the ship that got hit by boarding team. Sounds like another case of theorycrafting being super useless in a complex game like this.

If you look at a case of double arcing another ISD from the front (arguably the toughest BTA shoot to kill) you previously had to do 15 damage to kill it from full health. and you could do it fairly reliably and/or finish it off with another ship immediately after.

#1, whatever you want to BT - it almost never has full HP. there are previous shots or squadron damage done usually.

#2, so lets assume a conservative ldamage done previous turn at 2 between your fleet's ships and squads. now you only need to do 13 on your BT activation.

#3, you have upgrade options that can add dice or deal additional damage. let's assume heavy ion emplacements/spinal armaments on a vader ISD2, a power-build.

#4, so you have 9 dice out the front, and if they have shields left with vader you have a very high chance of getting a blue crit and rerolling any accuracies or blanks into hits to do extra damage. if they dont, they have at most 11 HP unless they have motti.

#5, your command has the option of being either a concentrate fire or a squad depending on your fleet. lets say a CF. so you deal probably 10 damage, plus extra shield damage for 11+1+1. The isd is on it only has 2 life left because its total HP was 13 since it had 2 front shields left. now you get a side shot that can deal 4 damage+accuracy (vader). Lets say they ECM brace+redirect to move 2 damage to a side hull zone. It has 2 life left.

#6 so you ram their ship and it has 1 life left. this could change with better prep shots previous turn or squads doing more than 1 bombing damage or a slightly better than average roll such as a double hit or 2 on red.

as you can see, the above scenario is very close to killing an ISD in a single activation with conservative damage numbers (vader). This isnt even with the best possible damaging ISD, merely a good one. All I can say is the people saying its dead are the ones who demand mathematical certainty rather than probability. pre-nerf, It still usually took me 2 activations to kill another ISD even with BTA because usually they either had their own avenger or they were very wary of mine, or both. so often times, getting that double arc shot was hard to do regardless. still, even nerfed, the btavenger combo is alive and well.

AS someone who has played since wave 2, the flotilla spam change will take us back to some of the better aspects of that wave. I’d predict: large plus strat adviser, 2 small combat ships, and the two flotillas will become more of a standard. And as we saw that 2+3 resulted in an assortment of ships that formed the two ships, we will see an even greater combination of three combat ships possible.

i think squadron points becomes more diverse, with at least an opening for medium squadron contingents. The changes to flotilla spam and relay certainly help there. Let’s also not forget that flotillas created a kind of rogue tax that should mitigate itself somewhat now.

Getting it in for the record. Such a good change for currently abusive fleets. And its funny to note that the people who don't agree are the ones who've been known to champion these crappy +3 +4, mass squadrons garbage.

Oh shut up already.

20 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

Getting it in for the record. Such a good change for currently abusive fleets. And its funny to note that the people who don't agree are the ones who've been known to champion these crappy +3 +4, mass squadrons garbage.

I dont think they were abusive. But for FFG's goal of adding fleet variety, limiting the number of flotillas increases variety by default I think. And that is a good thing.

This does hurt imperials too. They don’t have a decent sub 40 point small base. I am all for the flotilla nerf, just wish we had a good small base option outside of the raider and in the high 30 point range

3 minutes ago, ripper998 said:

This does hurt imperials too. They don’t have a decent sub 40 point small base. I am all for the flotilla nerf, just wish we had a good small base option outside of the raider and in the high 30 point range

I do as well, but I'm ok at the moment. Been dying for a good medium base imperial ship for a while though to open up non-ISD fleet building though. all the current options are speed 2, and need a christmas tree to be useful. Ick!

1 hour ago, ripper998 said:

This does hurt imperials too. They don’t have a decent sub 40 point small base. I am all for the flotilla nerf, just wish we had a good small base option outside of the raider and in the high 30 point range

Wait, are you hating on the raider? I am sending my six raiders to destroy your fleet.

Just now, ryanabt said:

Wait, are you hating on the raider? I am sending my six raiders to destroy your fleet.

What's the difference between a Raider 2 and a Gozanti Cruiser?

One hits hard with blue dice, radically disrupts enemy fleets, and is a major threat to the enemy squadron wing for cheap.

The other is a Raider 2 Corvette.

Hmm.. the change to Relay weakens the Fighter Ambush objective. Did anyone use that?

56 minutes ago, Wedge1126 said:

Hmm.. the change to Relay weakens the Fighter Ambush objective. Did anyone use that?

Yep.

With Rogue squadrons.

No change for me, here.

56 minutes ago, thecactusman17 said:

What's the difference between a Raider 2 and a Gozanti Cruiser?

One hits hard with blue dice, radically disrupts enemy fleets, and is a major threat to the enemy squadron wing for cheap.

The other is a Raider 2 Corvette.

You have maligned the wrong ship, sir! I will have some Vassal time the weekend of the 21. My Raiders (including Raider IIs) challenge your gozanti laden fleet.

52 minutes ago, ryanabt said:

You have maligned the wrong ship, sir! I will have some Vassal time the weekend of the 21. My Raiders (including Raider IIs) challenge your gozanti laden fleet.

Can't do the 21st, but possibly the next evening?

The R2's currently only significant build is powerful, but costs 60 points. It has serious deficiencies vs minor issues like ships or squadrons shooting in its general direction. It's fast, but has to approach an enemy to successfully attack it in most cases. A major part of its cost

A Gozanti Cruiser on the other hand can be outfitted for a variety of purposes and can withstand an unusually lethal beating with decent success rates. It can act as a pocket carrier, disrupt enemy commands with Slicer Teams, augment squadrons, provide a platform for "bubble" augment or debuff effects like BCC and Suppressor , and even repair damaged ships with Repair Crews. And it also has small guns that can plink off shields on top of its support functions.

Am I allowed to think that my beloved Admo CR90 swarm just made it 10% back from the path of the dead towards viability? At the very least, like last Euro, my fragile ships wont be hounded so easily over the whole map by Jendon and Marek, activated from a remarkable quiet part of a galaxy at war.

Thinking of it, the Demo players also have it slightly more difficult nowadays.

If there is a trend, why not bring back the old TRC in the next faq ?