What do you do when the players continually ignore plot hooks and don't investigate the clues you give them?

I have introduced several major and minor plot hooks into the game that the players are directly or indirectly involved in, and they just kind of meander around not really pursuing any of them.

Some of the plots will simply continue on behind-the-scenes whether the PCs interact with them or not. And I guess at some point, the PCs will hear about it in the news that some bad guy they know did this, or did that. Or some other group of heroes saved the day.

Is it them? Is it me? How can I help motivate them to actually pursue accomplishing something?

Have a chat with them out of character. Are they noticing things and choosing not to act? If so, why. If they are playing safe, remind them this is a heroic adventure. If they aren't interested in the sound of it, talk to them about what they would be interested in. Had a few issues moving from Shadowrun to this as the approach is so different.

A couple sessions ago, before we started rolling dice, I went over the current situations with them and reviewed their open plot hooks and Obligations and such. I was hoping they would latch on to one of them and chase it. Unfortunately, they have not yet.

They're not being particularly overcautious or anything like that. It's more like they lack motivation or ambition to pursue anything. They're just aimless. Maybe I've given them too much, and they don't know what to pick?

Option paralysis is a real thing. I think, in this instance, it might be time to yield the GM Hammer and hit them right in the player agency. Can you put them in a situation where they must act?

I do agree a friendly chat outside the game could yield good results - are they bored with their characters?

6 minutes ago, themensch said:

Option paralysis is a real thing. I think, in this instance, it might be time to yield the GM Hammer and hit them right in the player agency. Can you put them in a situation where they must act?

Sure. I'll give that some thought. As I mentioned, they have a few ongoing plot hooks. I can probably find situations for each one that would force them to act on it.

Right now I am writing up brief summaries of their current plot hooks, major and minor, personal and group. Maybe they need to have a printed list of them sitting on the table.

These are the plot hooks going on in the game right now...

Group plot hooks, major and minor

• Doomed to Repeat It. Indomitable oligarch Crassio wants you to find the ancient power module that would unlock the secrets from an 11,000 year old Pius Dea sarcophagus. He's paying $20,000, but he says he'll find other people to pursue this endeavor if you're not quick enough. (This is the one they are most involved in right now, but they're like, maybe it's over here... maybe it's over there... They have no direction, but neither are they pursuing direction. They aren't investigating it at all; they're making guesses.)
• Ghosts of the Jedi. Weird things keep happening on your ship that are possibly linked to one of its previous owners, Jedi Knight Arges Dakur. Not a lot is known about him, but it seems his life was troubled at its end.
• The Grassy Knoll. Xorgo Vosadii Turni, one of Indomitable's underworld bosses and information broker, has offered a Hutt's ransom for information about the assassination of his son, Rada the Hutt.
• Romani Ite Domum. On your somewhat successful spice smuggling trip to Ryloth, you learned the citizens of Lessu might be having serious trouble with spice-smuggling offworlders smuggling spice into Ryloth and murdering the locals. Unfortunately, your offworld spice smuggling venture has been put on hold after you murdered one of the local leaders and had to flee the system.
• The Plight of Lionel Aquilae. Aquilae hired you all to assist him in scouting out a nearby uninhabited planet. Upon returning to Indomitable, he was arrested by Imperial troops. You learned then that he was the son of the sector moff and that his entire family had been taken into custody on treason charges, and the moff replaced by an Imperial Army general named Thire. Aquilae's current whereabouts are unknown.
• All About that Base. The mountains of Gaulus had apparently contained a stronghold of resistance. Sector moff General Thire led a crushing assault on an extensive Rebel fortification, and now Imperial troops have a much greater presence in the streets of Indomitable.

Player plot hooks, major and minor (based on Obligations)

• Bucket of Thrills. Krakex is a thrill-seeker and he has a bucket list of thrills to experience before he dies – even if it kills him.
• The Missing Triplet. The Force users, Jaedemm and Raymbab, seek out their missing triplet brother kidnapped many years ago. However, a recent encounter with an old soldier revealed that they aren't triplets at all, they're clones.
• Betrayal and Revenge. An old rival wants Hanako dead after the way she betrayed her. And likewise, Hanako wants to see her old rival dead as well.
• Kirk Syndrome. Gareth is drawn by the allure of lust. He secretly has a list of other species he would have love with.
• Kybers Are Forever. Kyber crystals are very rare – even more so in these dark times. It is Raymbab's personal quest to find one and build a lightsaber. However, Force visions showing himself fighting a mighty dragon in a desert may prove this a difficult and dangerous venture.
• Bright Light City. Jaedemm has a gambling addiction, but he's been working hard to overcome it.

1 hour ago, themensch said:

Option paralysis is a real thing. I think, in this instance, it might be time to yield the GM Hammer and hit them right in the player agency. Can you put them in a situation where they must act?

I do agree a friendly chat outside the game could yield good results - are they bored with their characters?

It is indeed a real thing.

Also, if any of the options presented are red herrings, don't spin the players'/characters' wheels too terribly much...don't have an entire session taken up with them following that false lead. Some fun might be had with that false lead, but let them discover their error fairly quickly and see about getting them back on track. Game time is valuable, and for some, hard to come by because...well, adulting...and players feeling like they've wasted that time is a sure way to get them grumpy and consider jumping ship.

Oh, none of those plot hooks are red herrings or wild geese. They are actual things going on that the players could involve themselves in if they want to. I just don't think they've latched onto any. I've also told them they can create their own stories and goals and pursue those as well.

I think maybe it is a problem with having too many story options.

Should I direct them more? Should I pick one of the plots and start making encounters happen that concern that plot?

10 minutes ago, RLogue177 said:

These are the plot hooks going on in the game right now...

8<----snip---->8

Okay, you have a great hefty story here, good! Have you mapped how all these plots interact with each other? Say player A cranks a crank in plot A, does it affect plot D? What if not cranking crank A means plot D happens?

What I'm getting at here is that inaction is itself an action, and if your plots advance, interacting or not, then eventually situations will present themselves that force action. I like to set small timelines of bullet points of what I think the factions will do, and things get very bad for the characters if they don't act. I don't mean to railroad them, I'm just portraying a living universe wherein standing by is not an option. Obligation, Duty, and Morality would be excellent tools to really force the issue if your call to action isn't working.

However, it sounds like your players have stalled out during an investigation, and the rule I've read over and over is "hit them over the head with 3 clues. No more, no less." This has worked for me, the only drawback being so obvious that it's mistaken for a red herring.

2 hours ago, RLogue177 said:

I think maybe it is a problem with having too many story options.

I'll admit that was my reaction to seeing that list.

But more importantly...it's hard to tell for sure, but reading those options I don't see a single one that directly relates to an NPC or a location that the PC/player has a reason to care about. It's a list of missions, but there doesn't seem to be any emotional hooks, the PCs are being asked to inject themselves into, and solve, other people's emotional hooks.

Are there any loyal friends with dark secrets? Nieces or nephews who've gone missing? Their usual arms provider who's being shaken down for a mob payout? It might help to make it more personal.

Grassy Knoll might instead be about one of the PC's siblings. Of course, you have to build to that, and it might take a session or two to establish a relationship, but once relationships are established, you can easily work in your plot mission ideas and make it hit closer to home. So maybe sibling is more "straight-laced/corporate" than the PC, but now finds him or herself on the wrong side of the law, having been framed by some corporate execs where they worked. The PC is the only one they know who won't turn them in, even if things haven't always been easy between them. So a couple missions helping out, and perhaps reestablishing the sibling (which, of course, creates new enemies, who get away), and then the hammer: niece/nephew has been kidnapped by the enemy execs who want revenge. You can add a lot of layers to this (how high does the corporate corruption go, who is the real enemy, etc) but at the heart it's about helping someone they care about.

Okiday, I can dig it. Lots to consider here.

Most of us are getting together for breakfast tomorrow and I'll bring it up. Our next session is on Saturday. That will give me some time to come up with some encounter ideas and character connections to the plots.

On 4/5/2018 at 4:21 PM, RLogue177 said:

These are the plot hooks going on in the game right now...

I would connect all those plot hooks together with a crazy conspiracy map like this:

If all of your missions (subplots) connect in little ways, it will feel more like one big over arching story. When your players make the connections and have lightbulb moments, they may come up with thier own conspiracy theories. If they seem more excited with their theories than your plan, just role with the plot fule!

A lot of times when books are made into movies, certain characters are merged with others to help with pacing which is crucial in maintaining your audience's interest. If done incorrectly this may sacrafice story depth, but if done correctly this could add layers of depth to your characters and story.

22 minutes ago, Mychal'el said:

I would connect all those plot hooks together with a crazy conspiracy map like this:

I do mine in Scapple, but it looks very much like that. I also color-code the links to denote the relationship, be that Obligation, Motivation, another PC, a job, etc.

On 4/5/2018 at 4:21 PM, RLogue177 said:

These are the plot hooks going on in the game right now...

Group plot hooks, major and minor

Player plot hooks, major and minor (based on Obligations)

Connections you already have:

• Doomed to Repeat It - Ancient Secrets - Ghosts of the Jedi
• Ghosts of the Jedi - Force Users (familiar with clone template?) - The Missing Triplet
• Ghosts of the Jedi - Jedi (Lore) - Kybers Are Forever
• The Plight of Lionel Aquilae - General Thire - All About that Base

Possible connections:

• The Grassy Knoll - Betrayal & Revenge - Romani Ite Domum
• The Grassy Knoll - Bright Light City - Doomed to Repeat It
• All About that Base - the old soldier - The Missing Triplet
• Bucket of Thrills - Romani Ite Domum - Kirk Syndrome

I'm not as experienced, but when my group had a "unsure of what to do" moment where they just started pursuing unplanned side adventures, I just steadily racked up the difficulty until they just couldn't do it and then said "Hey, maybe you'll find an easier job ON THE NOTICE BOARD in THE CANTINA" and then they get the hint.

OR, if they really need someone to grab them and point out the path they're supposed to take, have an angry employer call them, a random NPC point out the path, or just block everything off until they start heading in the right direction.

All of the advice in this thread is good, but it's YOUR group. Everyone should be having fun, you included, so just make that known and hopefully they'll come around.

@RLogue177 ,

What if Crassio, Aquilae, & Xorgo were members of a secret society who meet under the guise of a private high stakes gambling table (ala Casino Royal)?

Create handouts. A job offer, a bulletin board, paper cards with datapad information on it. An audio message. When my players don't have an aim I remind them, that they have multiple handouts. Maybe they decide to do something else first, but maybe you can build something of the missed plot into that new plotline...

Don't give them dead ends. If they are stuck, just give them more info.

These are all great suggestions!

We chatted about it over breakfast. They agreed that I've given them too many plot hooks; I think they are used to more railroady GMs/games. Having a printed list of the plot hooks and descriptions helps. They want to concentrate on the first two: working for Crassio, and resolving the ghosts of the ship's past. When we played on Saturday, they really went after the second one there, and I feel like they'll be able to resolve it in a session or two. Our next game is this Friday, so I've got a little bit of time to finger out how to connect anything that might be connectable.

I don't know if this will assist with your issue but I started doing this in my games and I'll never go back. Ask the players to recap the last session, and you as the GM only fill in if necessary.

Opening of each session, me as GM asking the players: "So who wants to recap what happened last time and where you are at?" As someone is describing, if they leave out what i thought was an obvious lead or plot point I might prod them with a leading question.

Player A: "we went to the cantina and got in a fight with the swoop gang. I think we were going to just sell their bikes and loot."

Me: "Yeah the Sand Vipers, We wrapped with me listing off their items, was there anything in particular in their loot you are looking for?" (Knowing full well that they found a datapad with a new plot hook)

Second follow up later if they missed the datapad hint, and didn't bother to examine it.

NPC vendor "Sure, I'll buy the datapad, but i don't take no responsibility for any loss of data. Make sure you got backups of anything important ya got on there."

1 hour ago, ThreeAM said:

Ask the players to recap the last session, and you as the GM only fill in if necessary.

Great idea, don't know why I didn't think of it before.

3 hours ago, ThreeAM said:

Opening of each session, me as GM asking the players: "So who wants to recap what happened last time and where you are at?" As someone is describing, if they leave out what i thought was an obvious lead or plot point I might prod them with a leading question.

This is a great idea - I am fond of offering up 5XP for someone to chronicle the session (and I hand out 5XP for tracking initiative. Ho, ho ho!) but I like how this will play out and I'm going to use it. I've heard it done in podcasts but I have yet to try it.

On 4/5/2018 at 3:36 PM, RLogue177 said:

I have introduced several major and minor plot hooks into the game that the players are directly or indirectly involved in, and they just kind of meander around not really pursuing any of them.

You need to add a catalyst. This is the thing that in a story that kicks the hero into gear, and is actually part of the classic "save the cat" formula of film making.

Using Star Wars as the example:

Luke chases down R2 and meets Obi who says "let's go on an adventure!" Luke says "Ummmm no."

So catalyst:

Luke's driving Obi to the bus stop at anchorhead, when they come across the burning sandcrawler. Which leads them back....home. Owen and Beru are extra crispy and the homestead is a burning wreck. Luke has only two options: Go with the old man in the bathrobe, or stay on tatooine and try and rebuild the homestead with no money or resources.

While burning down the players other option is a bit extreme, the concept is solid. Don't just drop a hook, put up a "plot this way" sign and give them a push.

21 hours ago, ThreeAM said:

Ask the players to recap the last session, and you as the GM only fill in if necessary.

Other Advantages I forgot to mention:

• Allows me to see what they do and don't remember (or straight up missed). And if its clear they missed something crucial I know I need to interject that info again in a new way.
• It allows me as the GM to discover what is is my Players potentially care about and what it is they want to do. By simply taking your players lead and running with it you let them create plot ideas for you. Which can be important for sandboxing.
• It is also super satisfying when one player is describing something and the other players chime in with their additional details they remember, and now they are having a group conversation about the plot and where their characters are at. I feel it really draws everyone back in to start the session.

Use the Three Clue Rule .