Dear FFG,
Can Y-Wings, B-Wings and Tie Bombers have reload? It would breathe some really good life into those old frames.
Sincerely,
-Angry

I had this very same thought. It could easily be done with a title or torp slot. 3-4 points for the upgrade? Doesn’t seem broken on any of those ships ( Nera would be a little scarier). Do we really want additional efficient munitions carriers though??? >.<

8 minutes ago, DubWing said:

I had this very same thought. It could easily be done with a title or torp slot. 3-4 points for the upgrade? Doesn’t seem broken on any of those ships ( Nera would be a little scarier). Do we really want additional efficient munitions carriers though??? >.<

I'd say make it cost zero points. Look at the Tie Bomber, its 16 points compared to the Gunboats 18. Those 2 points get you SLAM, Reload, 1 more hitpoint (3 of them being shields), and arguably better dial when you consider SLAM. Sure the Bomber can take Bombs, but Imperials do not have any crew that makes Bombs better. 5 Scimitars with poons and Reload sounds fun.

Y-wings and B-wings aren't tearing up the meta either.

Event at 0 points the ships would still be underpowered. Could make it a torpedo slot and hit all those three ships. Call it 'Autoloading Magazines' or something. B-Wings and Y-Wings would still be bad until a Torpedo existed that could keep the Target Lock, but Bombers might be worth it at 16 pts with reload.
People would probably just take gunboats anyway though

4 minutes ago, Jo Jo said:

I'd say make it cost zero points. Look at the Tie Bomber, its 16 points compared to the Gunboats 18. Those 2 points get you SLAM, Reload, 1 more hitpoint (3 of them being shields), and arguably better dial when you consider SLAM. Sure the Bomber can take Bombs, but Imperials do not have any crew that makes Bombs better. 5 Scimitars with poons and Reload sounds fun.

Y-wings and B-wings aren't tearing up the meta either.

Good point.

no real reason not to

I mean, even with reload these poor buggers would still just get two-round nuked by basically anything and TLT would probably still remain the strictly superior option on the Y, so why not right?

thematically, though, it'd make more sense on the B than the Y. The Y isn't exactly the stuffed-up-the-bum weapons platform that the B or the boat are

Some people said the same thing with the bullseye. I my opinion, fixing the old ship with mecanics from the new ones is not fun at all. I would prefer original fixes designed more specificaly.

I did come up with this one a little while ago. If you think about it, it's perfect for most ships, but I think a Scurrg nerf and a Miranda nerf would have to be released simultaneously. I don't really see it being that much of a problem with other things.

Nerfing things isn't going to help old ships specifically see play, though we really could do with tlt changes

Bigger problem is that jousters simply don't bring anything more to the table compared to ships with far greater

1 . Ps

2. Manueverability

3. Utility

4. Arc coverage (or worse, turrets) etc

They throw a similar number of dice often with less modifiers, both offensive and defensive

Something as ungainly as the the Bwing just needs simple mathematical improvements to make jousting worth a ****. Easiest thing to do would give it a free Linked Batteries (leaving Cannon slot open) and basically permanent forward reinforce

For the Y, btl ignores all attack restrictions on secondary weapons (not range, but needing focus/locks)

4 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Something as ungainly as the the Bwing just needs simple mathematical improvements to make jousting worth a ****. Easiest thing to do would give it a free Linked Batteries (leaving Cannon slot open) and basically permanent forward reinforce

I like the idea of a B-Wing fix title that gives them reinforce, a canon slot, and decreases the cost of all cannon upgrades by 2. That could work.

39 minutes ago, Kieransi said:

I did come up with this one a little while ago. If you think about it, it's perfect for most ships, but I think a Scurrg nerf and a Miranda nerf would have to be released simultaneously. I don't really see it being that much of a problem with other things.

This gives infinite munitions to 15 ships in the game, including the ghost, poe, nym and miranda. Bad idea

If Y-Wings could have missles then 4 Harpoon, Autoblaster, LRS Y's might be a thing

An astromech that gave reload would be fine for me.

What makes ships with reload fundamentally different from ships with Extra Munitions is the downtime on the fire cycle. Extra Munitions means you can get 2 shots off in a row- with Reload you have to run away and come back around. These are fairly different playstyles and I'm not sure every ship would be well suited to both.

For instance: a Y-Wing can run away- but not really do much with it's down turn. It can't regen (neither of the regen droids pair well with it), it can't boost out of shots, and it has a hard time turning back around. It's much better off with a TLT. K-Wings are in a similar position, but the Slam action would actually pair well with the reload action- letting them get multiple perks to the same weapons disabled token.

The B-Wing, though... that's a different sort of thing, I think. It can't easily turn around, nor can it easily run away. It's so fragile that it needs to get maximum use out of fire time before it goes pop.

I'm not opposed to the idea (and missile launch racks are the way I'd go about it), but I think it's not enough to get Y-Wings and B-Wings to see more play time.

Titles specific to those ships seems like the most direct way to implement a fix that doesn't necessarily splash over into benefiting too many others. But if those ships wanted to make a comeback, it would definitely require more than just reload. So maybe each gets something to help on one of the other matters.

A jousting fix might be: When a friendly ship within range 1 is attacked, you may discard a missile or torpedo upgrade card. If you do, roll 2 attack dice. Cancel attack dice from your opponent's attack that matches your own (1 matching die each). It's worded a little clunky, but that would give them a defensive benefit to themselves and other ships around them, while encouraging them to carry multiple ordnance to have a shot and still protect one or two other ships. I'm sure someone smarter than I can phrase it better.

A fix for having trouble with maneuvering and never having arc might be a modified Outrider title: You may not perform primary attacks. Choose a torpedo or missile upgrade card you have. This may be used to perform attacks outside your firing arc. If you would be instructed to discard this upgrade card as part of the attack, ignore it. That basically makes them all turret boats, with different options beyond the TLT. But something that might make them more unique would probably be better received by the community. Something like: If you have a target lock on a ship who is not in your forward arc at the start of the combat phase, you may rotate your ship 90 degrees towards that ship.

Even with those fixes, I can't really see many people taking them over their newer counterparts.

What Saturation Salvo should have been:

When attacking with an equipped [torpedo] or [missile] secondary weapon, up to 2 friendly ships at range 1-2 with the defender in their primary arc at ranges 1-3 may discard an equipped [torpedo] or [missile] secondary weapon.

If they do, add 1 hit result for each discarded.

Worded like this, it allows the attacking ship to discard as one of the two ships, and allows for you to do something like burning a token off of Extra Munitions.

Its a crappy action and wont help them.

Its unbelievably inefficient, it wont do anything for those ships outside of games you are already winning in a convincing fashion.

2 hours ago, DubWing said:

I had this very same thought. It could easily be done with a title or torp slot. 3-4 points for the upgrade? Doesn’t seem broken on any of those ships ( Nera would be a little scarier). Do we really want additional efficient munitions carriers though??? >.<

its bad at 0pts.... but you could take it at that cost in case that one in 20 games where it actually is uesfull. at 3-4pts its absolute garbage.

Have run a gunboat in my regional season list and in all the games i played i re-loaded twice, and only fired the missile from the reload once in a game i was going to win 100-0 anyways. not only does the opertunity to re-load rarely happen its usually better to do another action instead for the immediate benefit.

(if Nera can sit there getting 2-3 missile shots off with turns to reload in the middle you clearly have already crushed your opponent, even just 2 missiles that means she has been around for 3 rounds of combat and lived, and did not shoot on her second turn of combat on top of that.)

I think it would be a great idea. Especially for B-wings, as either they go down in the first round therefore wasting 2pts on extra munitions, or they stick around for a second volley and can grab their needed target lock with FCS and have an action handy to reload with.

B-wings need a lot more help than just a reload but it would be a start.

I'd say that a revision of the basic rules card for munitions is in order:

A ship with two or more of either [torpedo] or [missile] upgrade slots may perform a "rapid reload " as an action. If it does so, it performs the reload action, then receives one Ion token and one weapons disabled token. When a ship performs a reload action, it may flip any number of its face down [torpedo] and [missile] cards face up.

Every ship that could reasonably be expected to have a reload action now has it; B-wings, Y-wings, Ghosts, TIE Bombers, TIE Punishers and TIE aggressors. K-wings and Scurrgs are really, really good as-is.

It keeps the ships with the reload action in their upgrade bar in the game, since they don't get ionised when they reload, while still giving older ships the ability to recoup their massive investment in ordnance.

How it should have been

modification 0pts

Your action bar gains the reload action icon.

When an attack instructs you to spend a target lock you may reroll a number of attack dice up to your primary weapon value.

Brings other missiles/torps up to snuff compared to cruise and harpoon missiles without effecting cruise and harpoon missiles by giving a "free" target lock effect (to a limit). and gives reload which saves points from extra munitions. Takes up chips and LRS and engine upgrade for large ships that might be tempted.

7 hours ago, AngryAlbatross said:

Dear FFG,
Can Y-Wings, B-Wings and Tie Bombers have reload? It would breathe some really good life into those old frames.
Sincerely,
-Angry

What about the Punishers???

9 hours ago, GILLIES291 said:

What about the Punishers???

They're dead Jim!

Personally, as mentioned earlier, I would create an astromech that handles reloads. This covers x and y wings. Perhaps a unique one however.

The B-wing.. well, with the new canon, it should maybe get a new cannon slot. Thats right, two cannon slots for it, as per canon, it can inflict massive damage with a laser.

The punisher.. there are several threads that cover this.

13 hours ago, GILLIES291 said:

What about the Punishers???

Yes punishers need help too.
If the upgrade that gave reload was in the torpedo it could buff anything with multiple torp/missile slots.

20 hours ago, pyoinator said:

This gives infinite munitions to 15 ships in the game, including the ghost, poe, nym and miranda. Bad idea

Poe with unlimited missiles? I fail to see the issue here....

While we are being silly can we have unlimited Prockets for A-Wings?!